bugblatterbeast Posted December 30, 2009 Share Posted December 30, 2009 hadvw, you need both because you are sealing a banjo style fitting. the crush washer seals are needed between the bolt and the banjo and between the banjo and the block. they provide a surface that can deform slightly to seal. if you managed to seal the fitting with only one new washer either 1) the inner washer didn't drop out while you were working or 2) you've imprinted the steel banjo fitting into the soft aluminium block. if you've imprinted the block, it is going to leak at that interface the next time you separate and reassemble the fitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hadvw Posted December 30, 2009 Share Posted December 30, 2009 hadvw, you need both because you are sealing a banjo style fitting. the crush washer seals are needed between the bolt and the banjo and between the banjo and the block. they provide a surface that can deform slightly to seal. if you managed to seal the fitting with only one new washer either 1) the inner washer didn't drop out while you were working or 2) you've imprinted the steel banjo fitting into the soft aluminium block. if you've imprinted the block, it is going to leak at that interface the next time you separate and reassemble the fitting. Hmm. Thanks for the image, that helped. I do recall putting one washer back, perhaps I do have both on there. Well, when the turbo gets replaced in a couple of weeks, there's a new banjo bolt coming with it, so hopefully all will be well.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papa g Posted December 31, 2009 Share Posted December 31, 2009 Got the second one in. I almost lost that one also. I ended using some duct tape to block it underneath so it wouldn't slide through before I could get the bolt through the washer. That was so easy with all the room in there. BE committed to DO what it takes to HAVE more of what you want in your life!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudeondacouch Posted December 31, 2009 Share Posted December 31, 2009 Got the second one in. I almost lost that one also. I ended using some duct tape to block it underneath so it wouldn't slide through before I could get the bolt through the washer. That was so easy with all the room in there. wut? i thot you losted it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papa g Posted December 31, 2009 Share Posted December 31, 2009 Picked up a couple at the dealer. I got extras in case I lost anymore before I got it together. BE committed to DO what it takes to HAVE more of what you want in your life!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noeladams Posted December 31, 2009 Share Posted December 31, 2009 Here is the info for it from alldata: http://www.sesubies.com/techdocs/Legacy/Banjo Bolt.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F1ERCE Posted January 24, 2010 Share Posted January 24, 2010 subscribe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05pearl Posted January 24, 2010 Share Posted January 24, 2010 I was thinking of doing THIS with my hta68 install. Comments? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natejd04 Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 05Pearl, That was exactly what I was going to ask!I saw that FP had a whole new "oil supply line" I was curious if this would help eliminate any problems I will have with the current "faulty" Banjo Filter Screen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05pearl Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 ^^ FP told me that below is their way of improving oil supply to the turbo in addition to eliminating the problem with the banjo filter. It makes sense to me and this is exactly what I plan on doing. http://store.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/graphics/subaru_oil/Full/sti_oil_line_install.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peaty Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 I have some info here too with detailed photos of the filter and banjo bolt, this tsb is for the AVCS on some Scoobies but the filter is pretty much the same: http://www.scoobymods.com/tsb_02_97_05-t5782.html?t=5782 Peaty, 2019 Imp Sport 5 Dr (Mine) 2013 Outback Premium (Wife's) 2010 Legacy 3.6R (Son), 2001 Forester S (other son) 1999 Miata (my summer ride) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natejd04 Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 It seems like an easy thing to do, and honestly looks to me like it will completely fix the problem, so I wont have to worry in the back of my head. Do you think it will easily attach to the Deadbolt turbo your sending? ^^ FP told me that below is their way of improving oil supply to the turbo in addition to eliminating the problem with the banjo filter. It makes sense to me and this is exactly what I plan on doing. http://store.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/graphics/subaru_oil/Full/sti_oil_line_install.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05pearl Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 It seems like an easy thing to do, and honestly looks to me like it will completely fix the problem, so I wont have to worry in the back of my head. Do you think it will easily attach to the Deadbolt turbo your sending? Unless I am missing something, if the oil supply end for WRX fitment is the same as the supply fitment for an LGT turbo (I don't know offhand), then I think so Nate. If anyone else sees a problem with the FP oil line suggestion on an LGT fitment turbo, please chime in. Also Nate, you could call FP and see what they say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrSpeed Posted February 8, 2010 Share Posted February 8, 2010 ^^ FP told me that below is their way of improving oil supply to the turbo in addition to eliminating the problem with the banjo filter. It makes sense to me and this is exactly what I plan on doing. http://store.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/graphics/subaru_oil/Full/sti_oil_line_install.jpg Why not eliminate the banjo fitting all together if you're gonna make a new hose? Why not use a straight thread (ISO) 90* fitting to a JIC connection, and use standard hoses...this way, you don't have to monkey around with the two seal washers and the banjo. and it flows better than a banjo too. We use this to eliminate the banjo on our fuel supply feed line to the high pressure fuel pump: http://www.glacierdieselpower.com/product.aspx?pf_id=6MJICx12x1-5 BANNED FROM THE TIKI FORUM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFromPA Posted February 8, 2010 Share Posted February 8, 2010 I support eliminating the banjo filter (seems completely unnecessary to me on a broken in engine running proper oil intervals), but more flow is not necessarily a good thing unless matched to a turbo that can use it.... ...although from what I know in this area (limited knowledge), more flow than the turbo can use will simply very minorly slow down spool up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrSpeed Posted February 8, 2010 Share Posted February 8, 2010 Oil is fed via oil pressure from the pump...more oil keeps it cooler (along with the coolant), allowing the lube and coolant system to share the heat rejection load. It won't hurt it. BANNED FROM THE TIKI FORUM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFromPA Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 Some turbo makers have essentially said that is not true. I'll try to find some quotes for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05pearl Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 This oil line kit is included with the new FP turbo I bought from an individual, so I don't want to make a new hose... It's a turn key kit. I just figured I'd post it in this thread because it looks to me like it's an improvement over simply removing the banjo bolt filter. As we were discussing earlier, if the oil line fitting on an LGT turbo is the same as on a WRX turbo, then I think the kit may work with LGT style turbos too. Why not eliminate the banjo fitting all together if you're gonna make a new hose? Why not use a straight thread (ISO) 90* fitting to a JIC connection, and use standard hoses...this way, you don't have to monkey around with the two seal washers and the banjo. and it flows better than a banjo too. We use this to eliminate the banjo on our fuel supply feed line to the high pressure fuel pump: http://www.glacierdieselpower.com/product.aspx?pf_id=6MJICx12x1-5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted February 9, 2010 Author Share Posted February 9, 2010 ...although from what I know in this area (limited knowledge), more flow than the turbo can use will simply very minorly slow down spool up. http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/7870/rofl1.gif Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFromPA Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 Thanks Rao. I don't have a link (and searching turbo + oil + flow is like a wading through an acre of haystacks to find a banjo bolt).... Anyway, my memory tells me that two turbo manufacturers said that opening up the oil supply to the turbo (i.e. substantially larger banjo internal diameters) can negatively affect the turbo in a few ways: 1. Create too much oil pressure at the bearing level and possibly push past gaskets (I don't know how this applies to different turbo constructions) 2. Try to force too much oil through spinning bearings, thereby increasing their drag. I could be wrong on both accounts and don't want to mis-represent myself, I'm just going off memory from what I took to be reputable sources. Prove me wrong, tell me I'm wrong, or point to a source that says differently and I'll be happy to retract. Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05pearl Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 ^^ IMHO, one can only assume the oil passages are optimally designed and improving oil flow to the pathways can only help. At a minimum, the FP oil supply line configuration is eliminating the weak link of the banjo filter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFromPA Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 I'm trying to minimize my assumptions here. My question in the past that was posed was if turbos are dying due to oil starvation or lubrication related issues (i.e. bearing contact), then wouldn't it be best if we removed the banjo filter and replaced the banjo bolt with one that has 3x the internal diameter (such a banjo exists). I was told at that time that it's not a good idea unless the turbo has been built to handle the additional volume of oil such a setup would provide, but that it was crucial on turbos that were designed with that additional volume in mind. Make sense? I am only specifically bringing this up in response to the assertion that a higher flow capacity than stock to the turbo is a good thing. I wish I knew for certain, but I don't, and I'm only trying to repeat what I believe to had read elsewhere from turbo suppliers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finse Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 ^^ IMHO, one can only assume the oil passages are optimally designed and improving oil flow to the pathways can only help. At a minimum, the FP oil supply line configuration is eliminating the weak link of the banjo filter. When are you doing your 68hta/oil line install? If you have good luck and are able to eliminate this weak link, I will be ordering the line w/ my new turbo as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrSpeed Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 Pressure is pressure, whether or not it's coming from a 100 or 200 thou hole. And how would the volume of oil change too? The size of the oil passages of the turbo does not change... BANNED FROM THE TIKI FORUM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05pearl Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 When are you doing your 68hta/oil line install? If you have good luck and are able to eliminate this weak link, I will be ordering the line w/ my new turbo as well. I plan on installing next week, just waiting on my fmic. But, installing the oil line will not tell me if I have "eliminated the weak link". The only thing that will tell me if it's doing the job is if I simply have no issues over the long term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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