Is the Spec B Worth The Extra $$$

[dr_sharp]

I'm not sure if certain individuals on this website realize that the MSRP on a spec.B is much higher than the actual price that they go for. Most go for invoice or less... very few go for more than $32k.

[RJS5689]

I'm not sure if certain individuals on this website realize that the MSRP on a spec.B is much higher than the actual price that they go for. Most go for invoice or less... very few go for more than $32k.

 

The dealers I spoke to really wouldn't budge much. It was probably due to timing. I got mine for 33k.

[stewartg]

I'm not sure if certain individuals on this website realize that the MSRP on a spec.B is much higher than the actual price that they go for. Most go for invoice or less... very few go for more than $32k.

I got mine at VIP pricing (invoice -2%) with a few extras thrown in as incentive. At the same time, other dealers were asking 4K markup. I commonly saw them going for close to 40, the only deals I saw were dealers in texas trying to move cars on ebay.

[RJS5689]

I'm a new member, but Ive been visiting this site for a while. I don't know how much my opinion counts, so here goes...

 

I HAVE driven BOTH the '08 Spec " and LGT with manual tranny, back to back over a period of days, on urban roads and highways, 6 months ago when I was making my buying decision. I definitely do have enough money to purchase a "B", so I'm not jealous of those who did. My conclusion was the "B" is NOT WORTH THE EXTRA MONEY. I'll qualify my contention this way. I'm a gearhead, a seat of the pants driver, and I notice everything. I feel a car should be greater than, or at least equal to, the sum of its parts.

I always owned high performance V8s until I purched my SAAB. My [from new] '94 SAAB 9000 CSE Turbo was greater than the sum of its parts, with an amazing engine, great handling [for its day], an incredibly comfortable, spacious, and versatile interior, surprising gas milage [35mpg plus hwy]. A car truly ahead of its time. I'll attempt address the FEW REAL differences between the "B" and LGT.

 

1. GEARBOXES: Both the 5 speed and 6 speed gearboxes are below average. Gear changes are dissapointing, and the ratios are way too close, particularly 4th and 5th. 5th should provide 30mph/1000rpm @ 2000rpm. This would help gas milage, and the motor has enough torque pull well enough at these rpms.

The final drive ratio on the "B" is the same, and 1/2 inch bigger wheel/tire radius makes little difference. What you do get is one more stupidly close ratio and horrible gear change with the "B". Maybe the extra ratio helps with the 115 lbs extra weight you get on a "B". You can buy aftermarket shifters for both. What's the point?

 

2. SAT-NAV: I bought a portable speech-to-text GPS for $179.99, with 5 hr battery life, and it plays mp3s. I can take it anywhere and I get to keep the badly needed storage cubby in the dash. If it croaks I can hand it back and demand a new one, no time lost. My wife or I can fiddle with the thing on the fly, no hack or ground wire reworking needed.

 

3. SEATS: Black leather is going to be easier to clean, and stay looking cleaner longer than blue Alcantra. I'm the only driver, so memory seats are a moot point [they should be standard, it's an insult to pay more]. If I have to make an adjustment it only takes a few seconds.

 

4. SUSPENSION: Unless you plan to autocross I don't think there's really much in it. I drove the LGT and "B" in wet [PNW wet] and dry conditions reasonably aggressively, and while the "B" felt a little sharper, I'd have to be breaking quite a few traffic laws to utilize this advantage. The LGT has a tighter turning circle, and you can improve the LGT for a few hundred dollars, but you'll just eat up the Potenzas even faster.

 

5. TORSEN vs. VISCOUS LSD: See above. Really, for 99% of driving there is nothing in it. If you plan to dramatically increase horsepower and torque you'd probably go aftermarket on both diffs, and kiss your warranty goodbye.

 

6. WHEELS/TIRES: 17" rubber is cheaper to replace, and there's more to choose from. I happen to prefer the 17" wheels, but both 17" and 18" wheels look OK.

 

7. VDC: "VDC applies braking and/or reduces torque [my emphasis] to help..." [2008 Subaru Sales Brochure] Welcome to the nanny nation. Seriously though, all the really hardcore "B" drivers are probably going to turn the VDC off.

Hey, here's idea for a cheap mod: A fake VDC switch, which you turn "off", and show all your friends.

 

8. TRIM/ODDS & ENDS: All purely cosmetic, and they must be fairly heavy ones at that. The LGT's fake wood, which is OK, looks just as fake as the fake titanium trim in the "B".

 

9. PRODUCTION NUMBERS: Exclusivity is worth absolutely nothing at this end of the market. BMW will produce many thousands of 335s, and I know what I'd prefer to be driving. Have I left anything out?

 

10. BRAGGING RIGHTS: In a straight line/quarter mile drag, wouldn't the LGT be quicker than a "B"? It's 115lb lighter [a whole person worth], has the same power, and has one less crappy gear change to deal with. Has anyone repeatably and reliably raced an umodified LGT against an unmodified "B" at a drag strip?

 

I do realize value is in the eye of the buyer and it's your hard earned dollar afterall, but the added features on the "B" do not make it worth several thousand dollars [$5K-$6K according to Subaru] more than the LGT. Remember, the same points many bring up to justify purchasing a Spec "B" over various Audis, BMWs, Mercs, Lexuses etc, are equally applicable to buying an LGT rather than a "B".

 

Cheers, Albatross.

 

Interesting opinion, and I can see your points, but they come across pretty strong. Let me give the flip side.

 

The Spec.B is truly worth the extra money if you want a well equipped from the factory sport sedan.

 

Gearbox: While the gearbox is a little clunky, the 6speed is far more durable than the 5speed gearbox and can take more power.

 

Sat Nav: Its nice to have an in dash unit rather than an ugly touch screen stuck to my windshield. Its also nice knowing its always in the vehicle with me, and a much much nicer screen than any portable nav.

Seats: Alcantara is very durable and easy to clean. Alcantara grips much better than the black leather, and also isnt as abrupt in its temperature change in the winter/summer. Find me a car in the LGT price range with memory seats? Paying more for them isnt really an insult. For 2008+ they don't have blue inserts anymore, its black now.

 

Suspension: The Bs suspension just feels crisper through the turns, even over bumps I felt it actually rides better, it doesn't hop, and bounce as much as the soft springs on the LGT. Plus, its a great balance of comfort, and sport from the factory. Its covered under warranty and you don't need to do aftermarket work.

Torsen Differential: Even in daily driving, a torsen differential will react faster than a viscous differential. You dont need to wait for any fluid to heat up, and power can be transferred in less than 3/4 of a wheel rotation.

Wheels: The 18" while yes, heaver, they do put it "on par" with some of the other entries in the class.

 

VDC: You do know VDC will be MANDATORY in all vehicles sold in the US by 2012 right? While on the track I turn mine off, I always keep it on when im on the street, it's there for a reason. In fact, Subaru's VDC can be turned off ENTIRELY, so personally, Im glad its there when I may need it, but I can shut it COMPLETELY is I want too.

Trim: The wood on the LGT looks pretty funky, I far would prefer the look of the trim in the B, plus the Bs pedals, Shifter, seats all make it a far more appealing car to be in.

Production numbers: The B wasnt produced in "limited numbers" after 2006.

Bragging rights: Eh, I think it comes down to which vehicle you truly prefer. At the end of the day I am much happier I went with the B rather than the GT.

 

Again, all it comes down to is what the driver wants, its their own opinion.

[xihearthookersx]

Heyo

New member here. I just picked up an 08 SB with 4300 Miles for 23K. I am pretty sure it was worth it to spend the same amount to get the SB as opposed to the LGT. I really liked the difference between the LGT and the SB. I love the gear box and the car handles WAY BETTER. But that is just my opinion.

[CTATV]

Heyo

New member here. I just picked up an 08 SB with 4300 Miles for 23K. I am pretty sure it was worth it to spend the same amount to get the SB as opposed to the LGT. I really liked the difference between the LGT and the SB. I love the gear box and the car handles WAY BETTER. But that is just my opinion.

 

welcome, there is another spec.b discussion forum as well you might want to introduce yourself in so you know

[paycer]

Heyo

New member here. I just picked up an 08 SB with 4300 Miles for 23K. I am pretty sure it was worth it to spend the same amount to get the SB as opposed to the LGT. I really liked the difference between the LGT and the SB. I love the gear box and the car handles WAY BETTER. But that is just my opinion.

 

That was a killer deal!

 

Was that from a dealer or a private owner?

[xihearthookersx]

Dealership. It was parked on the lot when a hail storm hit. Has some cosmetic hail damage on the roof. Worth them taking 7K off IMHO. I love the car. I am going to order exhaust today. I work for a company called Premier FX in bozeman, mt and i get magnaflow and borla at cost. Dont have a price on the borla yet, but i will by the end of the day. once i have the info i will order which one i like better. What do you guys think about these exhaust systems?

[rtbrjason]

Heyo

New member here. I just picked up an 08 SB with 4300 Miles for 23K.

 

Damn that's cheap..

[xihearthookersx]

Ok sorry for the off topic here, but i like you guys =D. Need a BOV any ideas???

[rtbrjason]

Ok sorry for the off topic here, but i like you guys =D. Need a BOV any ideas???

 

God I hate to be that guy mentioning search, but I've seen a lot of threads about blow off valves lately.. I think the actual answer is you don't need one though.

[xihearthookersx]

roger that. i am working on it as we speak.

[paycer]

Back to the top for visibility.

 

It's interesting that the numbers/percentages have seemed to stay about the same each time this poll gets legs and runs a bit further. It seems logical that a smaller percentage of people will go for the "top of the range" model of any model car, but the closeness between the Yay, and neigh category here amazes me.

 

The arguments for getting the sB over the LGT and vice-versa have been beaten to death and I can understand both points of view but these results lead me to believe that SOA could easily sell a limited run of 'tuned by STI' cars or even some full-tilt STI'd cars in the USA.

 

By some of the voters posts, if the sB came stock with more powah, some of the no votes would have gone to the other side.

 

I know SOA persuses some NASIOC threads and probably peeks in here too so this poll should help validate a breathed on/full on STI model in the near future.

 

Something like 2009.5 would be soon enough.

[SubieDriver]

Your power comment is spot on. If the Spec.B came with more power, it would sell a whole lot better. It'll be interesting to see what they do for '10.

[08specB]

As a Spec owner, I think the reason it is "faster" is the 6-speed trans. And that was my main reason to getting the Spec over a GT. The boost increase may also have something to do with it too, but I can't confirm that. The stock tires on the Spec SUCK! I have always hated Bridgestone tires, and this only proved my point that much more. I despised the ride quality the most.

 

 

 

There is no reason to change your BOV unless you upgraded to a bigger turbo and have a tune. If you want that sound, then get a CAI and a tune for it.

[DukeTrout]

As a Spec owner, I think the reason it is "faster" is the 6-speed trans. And that was my main reason to getting the Spec over a GT. The boost increase may also have something to do with it too, but I can't confirm that. The stock tires on the Spec SUCK! I have always hated Bridgestone tires, and this only proved my point that much more. I despised the ride quality the most.

 

 

 

There is no reason to change your BOV unless you upgraded to a bigger turbo and have a tune. If you want that sound, then get a CAI and a tune for it.

 

The RE050s on the spec.B are orders of magnitude better than the RE92s on the LGT ang OBXT. Not world beaters, but pretty good rubber for OEM.

[08specB]

That I will agree with, but when starting with crap and then refining crap, you still end up with crap in my opinion.

[stewartg]

As a Spec owner, I think the reason it is "faster" is the 6-speed trans. And that was my main reason to getting the Spec over a GT. The boost increase may also have something to do with it too, but I can't confirm that. The stock tires on the Spec SUCK! I have always hated Bridgestone tires, and this only proved my point that much more. I despised the ride quality the most.

 

 

 

There is no reason to change your BOV unless you upgraded to a bigger turbo and have a tune. If you want that sound, then get a CAI and a tune for it.

Fater = yes, more boost = no.

 

It has been rummored that the spec makes slightly more power than the gt, but this has not been confirmed as there are several factors (dyno type, dyno calibration, ambient temp, elevation and air quality among others) that can make one dyno read higher than another.

 

If you hate the tires on the stock spec (as do i, but their not so bad for the cars default configuration), then try driving a gt with the re-92's. Probably the worst tire Subaru could have chosen for the wrx and gt. I wish the spec came with the re070's like the sti.

 

Whether or not the tranny makes it any faster is debatable as well, not likely for drag racing but the gearing works well when your on a road track and spend 90% of your time between 2nd and 4th gears.

 

What makes the spec faster is the better suspension components and grippier tires. Sure you can upgrade the gt wheels, tires and suspension to match or beat the spec at the same cost as the msrp difference of the two models, but i think with the extra gimmicks the spec is a well priced package over the gt. A lot of people forget that most spec owners are not paying msrp or anything close to it.

 

There are pro's and con's to both models and has been mentioned already this debated has been beaten to death. When it comes down to it, a lot of spec.b owners want to place themselves in an elite group thinking they have something much greater, and a few gt owners may be envious because the spec.b wasn't available in 05 or didnt have everything in 06 when they bought their cars. Just as owners of 06-09 spec's would be a bit jealous if an sti edition came out in 2010.

 

While adding more power to the spec.b would make it an even more attractive package, whether or not it is labeled as spec.b or sti, adding power to a base gt would still be more economical and this debate would start all over again.

[DukeTrout]

Fater = yes, more boost = no.

 

It has been rummored that the spec makes slightly more power than the gt, but this has not been confirmed as there are several factors (dyno type, dyno calibration, ambient temp, elevation and air quality among others) that can make one dyno read higher than another.

 

If you hate the tires on the stock spec (as do i, but their not so bad for the cars default configuration), then try driving a gt with the re-92's. Probably the worst tire Subaru could have chosen for the wrx and gt. I wish the spec came with the re070's like the sti.

 

Whether or not the tranny makes it any faster is debatable as well, not likely for drag racing but the gearing works well when your on a road track and spend 90% of your time between 2nd and 4th gears.

 

What makes the spec faster is the better suspension components and grippier tires. Sure you can upgrade the gt wheels, tires and suspension to match or beat the spec at the same cost as the msrp difference of the two models, but i think with the extra gimmicks the spec is a well priced package over the gt. A lot of people forget that most spec owners are not paying msrp or anything close to it.

 

There are pro's and con's to both models and has been mentioned already this debated has been beaten to death. When it comes down to it, a lot of spec.b owners want to place themselves in an elite group thinking they have something much greater, and a few gt owners may be envious because the spec.b wasn't available in 05 or didnt have everything in 06 when they bought their cars. Just as owners of 06-09 spec's would be a bit jealous if an sti edition came out in 2010.

 

While adding more power to the spec.b would make it an even more attractive package, whether or not it is labeled as spec.b or sti, adding power to a base gt would still be more economical and this debate would start all over again.

 

I agree with your assessment except for one thing:

 

"When it comes down to it, a lot of spec.b owners want to place themselves in an elite group thinking they have something much greater..."

 

I think you can change "a lot of" to "one" .

[08specB]

I'm not an elitist. I just wanted the better trans when I was looking at the Leggys. I drove a 2.5GT, but bought the Spec UNDRIVEN!! The only diff being $100 per month for payment. Done deal, and I would do it again too.

[rtbrjason]

I'm not an elitist. I just wanted the better trans when I was looking at the Leggys. I drove a 2.5GT, but bought the Spec UNDRIVEN!! The only diff being $100 per month for payment. Done deal, and I would do it again too.

 

Same here, drove the LGT but changed my mind and bought the Spec B undriven. Payment was approximately $80 differnce per month.

[ordiga]

I drove the Spec.B for about 20miles before I bought it. I had driven LGT's before as well but for me, I was either getting a Spec.B or I was keeping my old car. A standard LGT was not an option at all...

[Albatross]

Hi Guys,

 

Personal buying decisions are none of my business, but I have to ask: What kind of cornering speeds are you all generating to make the "B" suspension worthwhile? I can throw my LGT around corners at nearly double the posted advisory speeds, which is fast enough to get plenty of tickets. Plus, there's no way I'd really test the suspension and tires with my wife and kids with me. If you autocross, well, that's different, but on a daily basis in the REAL WORLD?

Another thing, as I mentioned in an earlier post; a "B" weighs at least 115lbs more than an LGT, before you've added any accessories. What makes it faster? Certainly not the extra gear. It's going to take more power to get the "B" moving, and keep it moving, compared to an LGT. Given both the LGT and "B" have the SAME motor with the SAME compression ratio, SAME induction pressure, SAME everything, the "B" will prove to be slower in a straight line provided the AWD does as advertised. Like "Scotty" used to say "You canna change the laws of physics".

Here's an idea: Rather than Subaru produce an overpriced "B" with more power [honestly, I would have bought one if it was, say, 10% up on HP and torque], why don't they make an LGT stripper which weighed in at around 3200 lb or less. It would have to handle better, out run any "B", use less fuel, and be more fun, etc, etc.

Last question. OK, so the price difference is only $80-$100 more a month. For how many months are we talking about? Add in finance charges, the "B" is going to be even MORE expensive than it is already.

Here is, in my opinion, a worthwhile mod. Buy a K&N airfilter. I was somewhat annoyed to find the "I" setting to be a little too lethargic, and it seemed to make no real difference in fuel economy. After fitting a K&N filter I can achieve 24-26mpg in suburban driving, 31-33+ mpg highway easily, and 35+ mpg highway slipsteaming. I couldn't get over 31 mpg before the filter change. It feels a little peppier in "I" mode as well, so it isn't as boring. "S" mode returns about the same mpg as above.

 

Cheers, Albatross.

[DukeTrout]

You have to remember several things before you jump to the conclusion that the spec.B is inherently slower than a LGT because of the weight. With the sB, there is less squat and dive, stock vs. stock, due to the better damping of the Bilsteins (forget the springs - there's no real difference between the spec.B springs and the LGT springs in the US). Second, the gearing of the 6 speed is different than the 5 speed. Third, the stock tires LGT vs LGT spec.B are different, with the stock spec.B tires substantially more grippy than the stock LGT tires. So you can invoke the laws of physics all you want, the equation is not as simple as F=ma.

 

I didn't finance the spec.B at all, so the only difference for me was the difference in price. Oregon doesn't have sales tax, so I was looking at a LGT for $30k vs. a spec.B for $32k. Very simple decision.

[Underdog]

For a $2000 difference it's a no-brainer (as long as you can afford it) get the spec.B. When I was buying my leftover '06, I was able to snag the GT for $23,600 while the new GT's and Spec.B's were brand new on the lot and not discounted at all. IMO, when you're talking about a >$5,000 difference in price for two new cars, then you have to start weighing the pros/cons.