Anyone have buyer's remorse?

[Max Capacity]

Quite frankly, I expected Honda/Toyota levels of quality from the Legacy. To be fair, the transmission/engine are generally reliable and it was a fast car for its time. But I've had enough, and after nine years of mediocre ownership, I'm going to trade it in when I get the chance.

 

Well there's your problem right there.

 

This is not a Honda.

 

I have also said, if Honda made a car like the 5mt GT Wagon, they would put subaru out of business.

 

But, I have two of these cars and enjoy both of them for what they are.

 

It's about personal choice. To me, there is no other car out there with the same bang for the buck. That's why I have about paid for my wagon twice over the years. I'll pick it up from the body shop later this week after spending another 2500 on it. Having the front bumper, hood and roof painted and rust spots around the windshield and where stones have hit the leading edge of the roof.

 

Body shop had all the paint off the roof yesterday, bare metal. Same with the top of the hood. Bumper was primed. They'll pull the windshield today and fix the rust around there.

 

 

So after putting about 2300 into the tranny in early Aug, I guess I really enjoy the car...

 

BTW you don't want to know how much I put into the civic in my avatar. Hint, could have bought a house.

[stuck686]

couple of Sr20s should pull a premiummm in the legacys

[gimpydingo]

I deeply apologize that I wasn't able to determine that I don't like the car 72 hours after buying it and trade it in at a steep loss because nobody ever has issues pop-up over extended ownership. I really feel so bad about interrupting the bliss you have owning a similar vehicle.

 

If you're happy with your car, then good for you. As I said about similar vehicles, I don't own your car and you don't own mine. Perhaps our opinions would be reversed if you owned a first-year 2005 and I owned a face-lifted 2007. Perhaps it would be different if you paid full price for a new car expecting a quality ownership experience for a good, long period of time instead of buying a used car and thinking "hmm... this is good for the price."

 

At the bare minimum, my car did what it had to do and provided reasonably reliable transportation back and forth. And as someone who owned the car from day one, I've more than earned the damn right to say that these kind of issues with the Legacy mainly regarding its poor build quality is unacceptable when I've owned Toyotas and Hondas for longer periods of time and even used ones that were treated worse and have held up better.

 

Subaru. Never again.

 

 

Obviously everyone's experience is different and some cars have gremlins that won't go away, and some (a lot) dealers are just horrible. Just saying if you despise a car that much, why not find a way to trade it in for a less expensive Toyota or Honda that you would love?

 

I bought a brand new 2001 Toyota Echo, manual. Thing held up great. Put about 70k miles on it total. Commuted over mountain roads, drove it through the snow. It was top heavy, and had zero power and was total plastic toy car, but it did it's job and was fun.

 

I'm on my 3rd Subaru. Traded the Echo for a new 07 Impreza; held up nicely till I traded it at 100k miles. Interior was the same as when I got it.

 

I've owned 2 VW's (prior to the Toyota) which was a mistake. My sis in law owned 2 as well. Both of ours had the interiors fall apart. Glove box, center console, door handles, trunk, etc... Would I buy a VW or Audi ever? NO

 

Want to talk about taking a loss on a car from a horrible dealer and company? How about Mitusbishi? I owned a 2011 Ralliart (traded the Impreza for it) for 3 months. Started finding small issues, had to keep taking back to the dealer, which itself had the worst service dept ever.

 

Finally the tranny started lurching from a stop after a ~20 mile drive. Come to find out that it will cost $11k to replace. Good thing I have a warranty. NOPE. Previous owner modded the car (put back to stock) but left the ECU flashed. So of course Mitsu won't honor the warranty, the dealer won't do anything to help. So I get a lawyer.

 

The owner of the dealership tells the lawyer it's fixed....they just fixed the software back. Went round and round, finally got all but around ~$2k back for the car. And ended up buying a new Legacy 3.6R. So over $2k gone from the Shitubishi, and another $10k to get something I wanted.

 

The service dept at my Subaru dealership is always good. They've checked a few things for me, taking it out for a drive, and not charging me for 30 min to an hour worth of inspection/testing.

[rob-2]

Well there's your problem right there.

 

This is not a Honda.

 

I have also said, if Honda made a car like the 5mt GT Wagon, they would put subaru out of business.

 

But, I have two of these cars and enjoy both of them for what they are.

 

It's about personal choice. To me, there is no other car out there with the same bang for the buck. That's why I have about paid for my wagon twice over the years. I'll pick it up from the body shop later this week after spending another 2500 on it. Having the front bumper, hood and roof painted and rust spots around the windshield and where stones have hit the leading edge of the roof.

 

Body shop had all the paint off the roof yesterday, bare metal. Same with the top of the hood. Bumper was primed. They'll pull the windshield today and fix the rust around there.

 

 

So after putting about 2300 into the tranny in early Aug, I guess I really enjoy the car...

 

BTW you don't want to know how much I put into the civic in my avatar. Hint, could have bought a house.

 

If Honda made the TSX or Accord in an AWD - it would crush Subaru sales. It would be more reliable and get better MPG.

 

After my bought with Subaru I've determined they aren't a solid enough engineering group. Toyota and Honda are know for quality engineering and get quality control.

 

The fact is Subaru has a problem with their tubro'd cars and it's coming up on 10 years without a real fix.

 

Compare that to Toyota with their direct injection problem on the FRS and a fix is already being developed. The troubles only show up with tracked cars but instead of voiding warranties like Subaru does you are going to get it fixed. A known tracker has had his motor replaced by Toyota and news is surfacing of a fix for the problem.

 

All of Subaru's AWD benefits have been outdone by the competitors. Unless you must have a sedan Toyota/Honda offer models that are in every way better but 0-60 times.

 

I am kicking myself for the day I bought this car

 

My next car will be a TL SH-AWD. Better quality control, usable power and same MPG.

[sphen22]

If Honda made the TSX or Accord in an AWD - it would crush Subaru sales. It would be more reliable and get better MPG.

 

After my bought with Subaru I've determined they aren't a solid enough engineering group. Toyota and Honda are know for quality engineering and get quality control.

 

The fact is Subaru has a problem with their tubro'd cars and it's coming up on 10 years without a real fix.

 

Compare that to Toyota with their direct injection problem on the FRS and a fix is already being developed. The troubles only show up with tracked cars but instead of voiding warranties like Subaru does you are going to get it fixed. A known tracker has had his motor replaced by Toyota and news is surfacing of a fix for the problem.

 

All of Subaru's AWD benefits have been outdone by the competitors. Unless you must have a sedan Toyota/Honda offer models that are in every way better but 0-60 times.

 

I am kicking myself for the day I bought this car

 

My next car will be a TL SH-AWD. Better quality control, usable power and same MPG.

 

But it's a Hondah brah

[gimpydingo]

Totally get what you are saying. You got a bad car, things are falling apart and you expect more when you dump a ton of money on a car.

 

I took a look at every car on the market before getting my 3.6R. The TL SH-AWD is a nice car, but the cost is a bit ridiculous. $45k? For a $12k difference I'm happy with the Legacy.

 

I went about pricing out cars with more power and similar feature, but end up with a $65k Mustang GT, $50k for the Acura, $$godthatsalotofmoneyimightaswellgetateslaandnotworryaboutmycarfailingat50kmiles$$$ BMW, etc..

 

Honda or not, if you can snatch up a nice TL SH-AWD do it. But take a look at the Acura forums first. Doesn't seem their interior holds up that well, plenty of creaks, cracking leather, won't start, etc... Any car is going to have issues, some more than others, and could even depend on what shift the car was finally assembled on, tired workers ready to go home might half ass their work. I could have sworn there were a ton of Honda recalls not too long ago as well.

 

My father in law was looking at a variety of trucks. Was considering a Nissan, after a quick search of Nissan forums, they all have tranny/cooling issues that need to be rigged to work properly.

[06lgtspecb]

I picked up my lgt a little over a month ago. I wish I would have know about the reliability issues with the turbo subaru's before hand. The car I bought runs perfect and was very well taken care of, but all the horror stories in these forums has me regretting buying it... I don't want to get stuck with a major repair so I've been considering putting it for sale before winter hits.

[gimpydingo]

I picked up my lgt a little over a month ago. I wish I would have know about the reliability issues with the turbo subaru's before hand. The car I bought runs perfect and was very well taken care of, but all the horror stories in these forums has me regretting buying it... I don't want to get stuck with a major repair so I've been considering putting it for sale before winter hits.

 

How many miles, and how much did you spend on your Spec B?

 

 

Just change the oil, use Rotella, keep an eye on the oil level, change the fluids on a regular maintenance schedule, stage 1, and you should be good to go.

[06lgtspecb]

Well it just rolled over to 56,000 on my way to work. I picked it up for 15k with two sets of tires. Our market in ND is outrageous when it comes to vehicle prices so I felt I got a fair good deal.

 

I was looking at that Rotella T6 the other day, but I noticed it said it's for diesel engines so I was hesitant to buy it. Is that the right stuff? Cause the store only had one T6 rotella. I've driven the car for almost 3k and its yet to use any oil or coolant at all, but I still check quite often. As for mods the only mod I'd plan to do is the catless uppipe in hopes of making it more reliable.

[gimpydingo]

Catless and stage 1 will make it more reliable and bit more peppy on the throttle. The T6 is the correct stuff, yes says diesel, but alot are running it with no ill effects. If you are not burning oil you can use the Castrol 0W30 German, Penzoil Platnium is good as well. Main thing, just change the oil regular.

 

Ahhh ND, too far for me to buy that from you.

[idiot4hire]

Well it just rolled over to 56,000 on my way to work. I picked it up for 15k with two sets of tires. Our market in ND is outrageous when it comes to vehicle prices so I felt I got a fair good deal.

 

I was looking at that Rotella T6 the other day, but I noticed it said it's for diesel engines so I was hesitant to buy it. Is that the right stuff? Cause the store only had one T6 rotella. I've driven the car for almost 3k and its yet to use any oil or coolant at all, but I still check quite often. As for mods the only mod I'd plan to do is the catless uppipe in hopes of making it more reliable.

 

Yes that's what I use I get it at Walmart for 21.99. Advanced had it for 28.99. I am sending it in for a oil anyasis as soon as I need a oil change again.

[06lgtspecb]

I know the catless up will help with reliability issues but how would the stage 1 tune help?

 

Yeah it's a nice hike from cali! lol but it is a stock spec b, and there doesn't seem to be very many of them around.

 

So that is the right one, I kinda figured it was, but ended up buying Mobil 1 to be safe. Since the car doesn't use any oil is it better to use something other than the T6 ( liek the example you listed above) or is that still the the top choice? Oh and I'm very good about changing the oil at 3k

[gimpydingo]

Steer clear of the 5w30 Mobil, shears to 20 in no time. These cars do not like that oil.

 

The stage 1 from one of the etuners on the forum will help correct any issues from the stock ECU, reducing knock, etc... The tuner will get it dialed in specifically for your car.

[06lgtspecb]

Oh that's not good at all, I'll probably do a early oil change then just to get it out of there. So if I were to buy a AP and use their stage one tune is that the same as having it e tuned? or is e tuning a better option? I wish we had a local tuner in ND but I highly doubt it.

[rob-2]

Totally get what you are saying. You got a bad car, things are falling apart and you expect more when you dump a ton of money on a car.

 

I took a look at every car on the market before getting my 3.6R. The TL SH-AWD is a nice car, but the cost is a bit ridiculous. $45k? For a $12k difference I'm happy with the Legacy.

 

I went about pricing out cars with more power and similar feature, but end up with a $65k Mustang GT, $50k for the Acura, $$godthatsalotofmoneyimightaswellgetateslaandnotworryaboutmycarfailingat50kmiles$$$ BMW, etc..

 

Honda or not, if you can snatch up a nice TL SH-AWD do it. But take a look at the Acura forums first. Doesn't seem their interior holds up that well, plenty of creaks, cracking leather, won't start, etc... Any car is going to have issues, some more than others, and could even depend on what shift the car was finally assembled on, tired workers ready to go home might half ass their work. I could have sworn there were a ton of Honda recalls not too long ago as well.

 

My father in law was looking at a variety of trucks. Was considering a Nissan, after a quick search of Nissan forums, they all have tranny/cooling issues that need to be rigged to work properly.

 

New you can get the TL in AWD is $39K. Yeah, you spend more on it but the fit/finish is better then the legacy. I'd buy used for about $25K.

 

I guess the difference is I have a great relationship with Honda. Going back over 30 years. We're 2 generations Honda family, in all the cars we've own, all the miles we've driven, both new off the lot and used; we've never had anything remotely as costly as I've had on the legacy. I was willing to think it was a one-off but when you research the matter it's a design defect.

 

When they had the tranny recall on the TL years ago they just replaced if after the oil jet fix failed to work. No questions asked.

 

On my Subaru it all went down hill when I started to have leaking gas lines. It's a $550 fix, Subaru did a limited state recall, claiming it doesn't get cold enough in California or Nevada compared to say Michigan. Fact is it hits some really cold temps up at 8,000 feet. My then wife had major gas leak to the point you had to drive around with it on recycle. Thankfully no fire, but they agreed with only 61K on the car and it as a known issue to chip in half.

 

Subaru had a brake line recall as well.

 

Tubro'd motors fail. Known fact and it gets worse every year as they change the tune. It's so bad that a reliable 'fix' to a turbo'd 2.5 is to flash the car with an aftermarket tune. This voids your warranty.

 

Which leads me to another point. You take the STI to the track, expect a motor failure on the stock tune. You flash the car, you can expect no warranty. This car company has no commitment to support the designs behind these cars.

 

Why does cyl 4 have high ring land failure? The knock sensor and turbo are over that cyl. So cyl 4 runs hotter and has advanced timing (1-2 degrees) to detect knock. Adding a second sensor to the other side and removing the advance on timing would resolve a large part of the issue.

 

Any decent tuner can tune out the subi problem, yet subaru refuses to do it themselves. Forcing their customers to run the risk of failure in a warranty or void the warranty with 'modifications' to prevent the problem. You're really screwed either way.

 

Honda and Toyota stand behind their products to a level Subaru is unable or unwilling to do.

 

Your 3.6 N/A motor will run a lot better. Wait until you get some miles on your interior, I can tell you it's no peach at 101K now. We've got an RL in the family with 120k on it, quiet as the day new. TSX's in the family, first and second gen, both very quiet even after some miles.

[rob-2]

Oh that's not good at all, I'll probably do a early oil change then just to get it out of there. So if I were to buy a AP and use their stage one tune is that the same as having it e tuned? or is e tuning a better option? I wish we had a local tuner in ND but I highly doubt it.

 

The Cobb solution is simple and safe.

 

etuning requires data logging and if you go with a good vendor is a 'better' tune in the fact you get one specific to your car.

 

The Cobb is more expensive and has a few more options - different maps.

The etuning is cheaper but requires data logging to get a good tune.

[HAMMER DOWN]

Keep in mind your non-turbo'd motor is more reliable then the turbo'd version. This would change my views a lot on the reliability factor.

:spin::spin: See sig.

 

Most reliable car I ever own. After 8yrs. & modded to my taste. This car still puts :):) on my face, mutable times per drive.

 

Mike

[Danteneon]

Tubro'd motors fail. Known fact and it gets worse every year as they change the tune. It's so bad that a reliable 'fix' to a turbo'd 2.5 is to flash the car with an aftermarket tune. This voids your warranty.

 

Which leads me to another point. You take the STI to the track, expect a motor failure on the stock tune. You flash the car, you can expect no warranty. This car company has no commitment to support the designs behind these cars.

 

While I understand the point you are making, there should be some clarification about tunes and warranties.

 

If you install an aftermarket tune, it does not just void your warranty. The warranty for the car is still intact, but any failure that can be contributed to the tune will not be covered by Subaru. No automotive manufacturer will cover a tune. It is the responsibility of the dealer to show that the tune contributed to the failure. In no way does a re-map cause a wheel bearing to fail for instance.

 

Should Subaru do more on their part to improve the quality of the stock maps? Sure, but there are reasons they haven't.

[gimpydingo]

The Cobb solution is simple and safe.

 

etuning requires data logging and if you go with a good vendor is a 'better' tune in the fact you get one specific to your car.

 

The Cobb is more expensive and has a few more options - different maps.

The etuning is cheaper but requires data logging to get a good tune.

 

Exactly. The Cobb will work just fine since you don't have any other mods. If the plan is to heavily modify, then you need to weigh the options between Cobb OTS and a customer etune.

 

I'll be going Stage 1 etune shortly.

[lccl]

I picked up my lgt a little over a month ago. I wish I would have know about the reliability issues with the turbo subaru's before hand. The car I bought runs perfect and was very well taken care of, but all the horror stories in these forums has me regretting buying it... I don't want to get stuck with a major repair so I've been considering putting it for sale before winter hits.

 

Keep in mind, these forums tend to be like the nightly news. You always hear about the horrible stuff, not so much on all the good stuff. People don't usually post a thread about how well their car has been running. Also, any modified car that is rodded on and not properly taken care of will have issues. A lot of people think Subaru = Reliable. So therefore, Turbo Subaru = reliable & fast obviously, and they forget to maintain it properly because well, it's a Subaru, they last forever.

 

Well it just rolled over to 56,000 on my way to work. I picked it up for 15k with two sets of tires. Our market in ND is outrageous when it comes to vehicle prices so I felt I got a fair good deal.

 

15K for a SpecB with 56k on it and two sets of tires? Uh, yes please. Should see some of the prices in the PNW, good god

[gimpydingo]

Your 3.6 N/A motor will run a lot better. Wait until you get some miles on your interior, I can tell you it's no peach at 101K now. We've got an RL in the family with 120k on it, quiet as the day new. TSX's in the family, first and second gen, both very quiet even after some miles.

 

 

Like I said my 07 has 80k on it, interior still looking good. The only real wear is the boot over the ebrake. Just need to dust and armor all this weekend.

[06lgtspecb]

Exactly. The Cobb will work just fine since you don't have any other mods. If the plan is to heavily modify, then you need to weigh the options between Cobb OTS and a customer etune.

 

I'll be going Stage 1 etune shortly.

 

Sounds like I need to look into the Cobb ap for the time being. Since this cars my daily driver I don't plan to modify it much, just what it might take to help reliability. I also kinda wonder about the turbo in my 06, sounds like they also have some flaws. I wonder if a lot of that can be prevented by proper maintenance.

 

Keep in mind, these forums tend to be like the nightly news. You always hear about the horrible stuff, not so much on all the good stuff. People don't usually post a thread about how well their car has been running. Also, any modified car that is rodded on and not properly taken care of will have issues. A lot of people think Subaru = Reliable. So therefore, Turbo Subaru = reliable & fast obviously, and they forget to maintain it properly because well, it's a Subaru, they last forever.

 

 

 

15K for a SpecB with 56k on it and two sets of tires? Uh, yes please. Should see some of the prices in the PNW, good god

 

That's a good point! Although I have seen a few great posts hidden in there about how little they've stuck into it in x amount of miles/time, so that's helped give me a glimpse of hope! lol Plus I hear so many say their only getting 18 to 20mpg average, so it kinda makes me think I either drive this car like a grandpa or their balls to the wall half the time:lol: I've been getting 27mpg average in 0ver 2500 miles.

 

I guess I'm getting old because I have to ask what's pnw? I had a feeling it wasn't a bad deal so I jumped on it quick. With the little time I had to research the value I couldn't actually find a 06 spec b for sale, but a few that sold over the years so it was hard to judge it's worth. Plus it was stock and driven by a 65 year old Dr. since new so if I passed this up I don't think I'd find another like it again.

[EyeFlyIsTheEye]

I picked up my lgt a little over a month ago. I wish I would have know about the reliability issues with the turbo subaru's before hand. The car I bought runs perfect and was very well taken care of, but all the horror stories in these forums has me regretting buying it... I don't want to get stuck with a major repair so I've been considering putting it for sale before winter hits.

 

I hate my car and think it's a piece of shit.

 

But even as I have said, I own a similar car to everyone else here and not the same exact car you do or anyone else does. If you're enjoying your car and it's treating you right, the best thing you can do is take care of it and maintain it properly. I would not advise selling it if it's not giving you any problems. It's your car for better or for worse and don't take an unnecessary financial bath if you don't have to.

 

Remove the banjo bolt from the oil feed if you haven't already though. You'll thank me. Put in an aftermarket uppipe and gut the downpipe for an affordable Stage II along with the Accessport.

 

In my personal experience, the drivetrain of my Legacy has treated me well, it's just that it's wrapped in garbage.

 

If Honda made the TSX or Accord in an AWD - it would crush Subaru sales. It would be more reliable and get better MPG.

 

After my bought with Subaru I've determined they aren't a solid enough engineering group. Toyota and Honda are know for quality engineering and get quality control.

 

The fact is Subaru has a problem with their tubro'd cars and it's coming up on 10 years without a real fix.

 

Compare that to Toyota with their direct injection problem on the FRS and a fix is already being developed. The troubles only show up with tracked cars but instead of voiding warranties like Subaru does you are going to get it fixed. A known tracker has had his motor replaced by Toyota and news is surfacing of a fix for the problem.

 

All of Subaru's AWD benefits have been outdone by the competitors. Unless you must have a sedan Toyota/Honda offer models that are in every way better but 0-60 times.

 

I am kicking myself for the day I bought this car

 

My next car will be a TL SH-AWD. Better quality control, usable power and same MPG.

 

All of the problems I have had with my Legacy probably stem down to improper quality control and lax testing before production or releasing the vehicles to general sale. Not to mention that Subaru wanted to sell an Audi A4 Quattro for the price of a Honda Accord which meant something (well, a lot of things) had to give and cheaping out was the rule of the day.

 

It also didn't help that I took into consideration the quality of previous Legacies, which were designed as utilitarian transportation compared to the fourth generation which was the opening salvo to Subaru's short-lived flirtation with being a half-assed luxury brand. I much would have preferred a cheaper and more durable interior than this non-durable H&M style fake luxury crap and that ugly wedge of a stereo which is a PITA to upgrade.

 

Only after Stage II did the car live up to any of its potential, but having other people who are not me have to void the warranty to get the car to perform and watching other people who are not me have to muck with downpipes and other emission crap is not exactly what buyers usually bargain for. Though it did turn me into a mechanic, and there's nothing wrong with knowing how to wrench on a car.

 

The 2013 Accord 6MT 4cyl would be first on my list if I had to buy another car new. It's not ridiculously small like the TSX nor is a bloated pig like the 2008 Accords. The current Legacy and Impreza (especially Legacy) look Flintstonean against their competition

[NWSPECB]

Somebody has their panties in a bunch.

 

We get it, you hate your car and mostly everything about it as you took AMAZING care of it and it has still fallen apart. Just move on like everybody else does when they don't like their car after a few years of ownership and be done with it.

 

It amazes me how much people can bitch about something just because they want their opinion to be heard.

[EyeFlyIsTheEye]

Somebody has their panties in a bunch.

 

We get it, you hate your car and mostly everything about it as you took AMAZING care of it and it has still fallen apart. Just move on like everybody else does when they don't like their car after a few years of ownership and be done with it.

 

It amazes me how much people can bitch about something just because they want their opinion to be heard.

 

I really don't care about what you think about my opinion. Hell, if I said the Legacy cures cancer and is the greatest car of all time, you'd probably offer me a blowjob.

 

Unless you're a moderator here, you can pound sand because I'll talk about my ownership experiences in whichever way I feel like. The real problem is that you can't tolerate the fact that someone else can own a similar car and not have the same experience you do without being butthurt.

 

And my last post is more useful than your whining because I'm actually helping a guy who just bought one and is scared of possible problems do what it takes to avoid any maintenance issues and not lose money on a sale.