Rattsl Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 I'm just thinking....can't be worse than stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTris Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 stick with the whiteline ones. trust me you dont want pillowballs in your suspension if you can avoid it if you daily drive the car. I'm just thinking....can't be worse than stock. Before we get too far, here -- Do you know the difference between the stock bushings and the pillowball mounts, terms of handling, NVH, and ride comfort? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattsl Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 To be honest, no. But seeing as they are 10 years old, and 150k miles on them..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTris Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 To be honest, no. But seeing as they are 10 years old, and 150k miles on them..... Dammit, I had just read a really good article post on pillowball mounts the other day, and can't seem to find it now. Their unfortunate namesake doesn't accurately describe what they do, at all, really. They're far from comfortable, however, they handle amazingly well, and much better than standard hardened rubber bushings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattsl Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 Better get to finding that then, because for daily highway commutes, the car is just fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTris Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Rubber Bushings In stock form, almost all cars use rubber bushings in the suspension. The reason for this is that rubber bushings absorb much of the force produced by the vehicle's suspension when it is driven over bumps and road imperfections. This in turn isolates the occupants and provides a more comfortable, compliant ride. One of the issues with rubber bushings though is that, because they deflect more, the suspension can lose precision. This is generally not a problem for normal driving, but if a car is modified for better handling, a more rigid setup may be desired. Among the solutions to make a suspension more precise are urethane bushings as well as a more extreme solution, which are pillow ball mounts. Pillow Ball Mounts Despite their misleading title, pillow ball mounts are solid metal mounts that are used in areas such as the upper strut mount. The rubber normally used is replaced with a metal spherical bearing. Rather than deflecting from the cornering forces like a conventional rubber bushing, pillow ball mounts do not move at all. This translates into a far more precise feel from the suspension and steering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattsl Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 Pretty good sound description. Pretty sure Whiteline and Megan use the same design though....I'll check here in a few. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTris Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Pretty good sound description. Pretty sure Whiteline and Megan use the same design though....I'll check here in a few. Megan = Honda parts. Do you really want to sully your ride with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattsl Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 Megan = Honda parts. Do you really want to sully your ride with that? I wouldn't say Honda parts exactly. Maybe not "Tried and true" but...can't call out Honda lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 Megan is garbage. whiteline is highly reputable. Its a no brainier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 Why not? Pillowballs are not weather sealed and will go bad faster because his car is also a daily driver. Also lots of NVH. No one will argue that as far as suspension stability goes, pillowballs are the best, but a good poly bushing will be 90% there and will be much more durable. If the can was being more purpose built, is say go for the pillowball stuff, but the thread title says "yet good for daily". id only do a pillowball if it had a dust covers and grease fittings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattsl Posted March 17, 2015 Author Share Posted March 17, 2015 So, what do the whiteline ones include? Poly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 yes. here - http://www.whiteline.com.au/product_detail4.php?part_number=KTA124 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattsl Posted March 17, 2015 Author Share Posted March 17, 2015 Noted. Thanks. Guess I'll do those later in the month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 do them before you get your alignment. I dont recall if you said what wheel/tire setup you are going to run, but if you are planning to autox regularly, you need to have that figured out. these whiteline are will be critical in getting exact fitment and alignment you need for wide tire setups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattsl Posted March 17, 2015 Author Share Posted March 17, 2015 For now I'll be running my current wheels (17x8 +35 on 215's) but will be switching to 18x8.5 +45 later down the road with 245's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 17x8 on 225s will be a much better fit for autox. If you have done your turbo, you automatically get punted to SM. I had to make the pillowball & bushing choice, too. Every racer I talked to asked if I my SO was going to ride in the car. If so, bushings. As it is, my vision blurs on some of our roads. " far more precise feel from the suspension and steering" translates into a brutal ride. As others have suggested, go pro plus cellphone (for data logging) will teach you alot. I used ALapRecorderHD @ $7 from Android store, with video & data logging. If you are going to do lapping, I'd get a AiMData Solo instead of a cell phone app. I used the taxtrics to hook throttle, steering & braking info. Of course, that would only play back later. Mount the camera (on wide, hi-rez) above your rear passenger seat as high as you can get it (in the wagon, this was the rear corner of the sun roof) to get the most view of you, the wheel & the course. If you can make a solid, no vibration mount in the middle, even better. Now that you recording, you need to watch them. Before every run, watch the video. Over & over. Note where you missed a cone. The datalogging part helps you find the slow sections. See where you are braking. Try to find a route with less braking. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 I think Boxkita's been over this at least once -- See the Rulebook and build your mods according to the class you'd in which you'd like to compete. Build your car to how you'd like it, and you'll end up outclassed very quickly. TL;DR - Most modified LGTs end up out-classed with "inexperienced" drivers behind the wheel. That, and, after you've got mods, you're often up against cars with much more power and mechanical advantages. If you are building your "Autox" car without the rulebook in front of you, expect to punted to a non-competitive class. I ended up in SM with a supercharged Cadillac on slicks. I might as well have driven a delivery truck for how close that wasn't. I never went back. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTris Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 If you are building your "Autox" car without the rulebook in front of you, expect to punted to a non-competitive class. Near the top of the list of things I learned from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattsl Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 Well, in short... my first event is the 3rd of May. http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/04/22/31b2f0c8ae5678286cebe4c71125a08d.jpg entered as ASP class and so far it's just me and that hawkeye wagon. So, gonna try and possibly get my ss lines installed before then, but very low chances. Unless I'm off the Saturday before the event. http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/04/22/8b1a1b0dedc3b431b7f81e617586f603.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoplightAssassin Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 Were you ever able to figure anything out with you suspension? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattsl Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 Were you ever able to figure anything out with you suspension? I mainly have it aligned. Maxed the rears on the stock setting for the least camber (-1.2) and my fronts will go to (-1.0) before the event. I haven't gotten time to fully adjust the rears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 whitetiger/stoplightassasin - did you set your toe to be more twitchy than normal for autox? Curious if making the front toe like a V instead of A would help with turn-in? Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoplightAssassin Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 Toe out in the front will absolutely help turn in. I would highly caution against toe out in the rear if the car is street driven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 whitetiger/stoplightassasin - did you set your toe to be more twitchy than normal for autox? Curious if making the front toe like a V instead of A would help with turn-in? you can do some toe out in the front if you want some turn-in. in the rear, id be very careful. if you are not running r-comps, you probably want 0 toe back there until you can get more negative camber back there. i was running over -3 per side with r-comps and had done some toe out to aide rotation. you shouldn't really do this on street tires because it makes the car very unstable at high speeds as SA eluded to above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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