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Found lots of great clutch replacement info here, but still need advice...

TimGinCentralNJ

By TimGinCentralNJ
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AndrewZ Collaborator

AndrewZ

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In the Subaru it is in the flywheel which is way easier than if it is in the end of the crankshaft.

 

???

 

I have two flywheels, the OEM dual mass and the ACT streetlight. Neither have a pilot bearing in the center, it's an open hole.

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JoeFromPA Grand Master

JoeFromPA

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Ridgeracer/Rao - Aside from one vendor on here stating that the 08+ WRX setup has 20% more clamping force, I haven't seen anyone (with or without documentation) claim anything period. Aside from that they both are exact fits for one another.
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Boostin1657615274 Experienced

Boostin1657615274

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I'm sorry, but this is incorrect with clutches. Clutches wear out from:

 

1. So much slippage that the surface glazes over and can no longer lock against the flywheel.

 

Why do you think I would mention an aftermarket clutch wears faster? You just told me I was wrong, then explained why I was right. You have to slip an aftermarket clutch more because they are made for more abuse and have a heavier gripping surface. And as most aftermarket parts go, higher performance leads to shorter lifespan.

 

P.s. It's fairly unusual for a 2wd N/A car with a properly sized clutch to get less than 75k out of the life of the clutch, and plenty of folks get 100-150k out of them. When driven properly.

 

Depends on the car. Had a V6 Mitsubishi Eclipse. 45k is not uncommon for a stock clutch. Also 50k was when my rear main seal went out. Its a mitsu - anything is possible. Dont believe me? Spend some time on http://www.club3g.com , its a very large forum, and there is plenty of documentation to back my claim.

On the search for a new DD...
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AndrewZ Collaborator

AndrewZ

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I just finished the clutch install, and would like to add a few things

 

1.) With the ACT flywheels, and I have to again thank Rao here, you need to press into the center a pilot bearing. Oriley's auto parts had two different brands in stock! You don't need a press to install it, I used the ratchet-side of a 27mm socket and a hammer. Use locktite on the outer surface. Pushing it from the clutch side and making it flush with the opening gives the proper seat, leaving 0.250 on the other side and room for the seating edge on the crankshaft.

 

2.) I found this job much easier with two floor jacks than when I was trying to use the transmission jack. I put one jack just forward of the subframe. Then remove the subframe (this makes everything much easier). Place your second jack at the rear of the transmission (though not on the sheetmetal that surrounds the tailshaft).

 

3.) My engine and transmission were fused together. Hammering with 2x4s did not help, nor did wiggling the tail end of the transmission. There is a dowel on the driver and passenger side, these were a bit rusted on mine and caused the binding. I was able to separate the engine and transmission by hammering a thin screwdriver at the interface. File down whatever edges are formed.

 

4.) The turbo caused the most problems when reinstalling the transmission. If your clutch is on the way out and so is your turbo you might want to do both at the same time.

 

5.) This job is really best done with two people. I wouldn't suggest doing it alone and won't bother trying next time.

 

BTW I was using the transmission-back method

 

EDIT: to add, you do not need to remove the axles

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Ridgeracer Mentor

Ridgeracer

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Ridgeracer/Rao - Aside from one vendor on here stating that the 08+ WRX setup has 20% more clamping force, I haven't seen anyone (with or without documentation) claim anything period. Aside from that they both are exact fits for one another.

 

The documentation comes in the part #s. We need to see if the 07-09 LGT uses the same part numbers for the clutch components as the 08-10 WRX. BTW...all this clutch talk must have jinxed me or maybe its all the city driving vs highway that I have been doing. Damn TOB is getting a litttle noisy I believe. I guess at 109K that my be enough for the factory unit. Will confirm tomorrow.

"Gimme mines Balboa...Gimme mines".....Clubber Lang - Mr. T
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JoeFromPA Grand Master

JoeFromPA

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More grip = accelerated wear, there is no way to get around that. Just like tires, if you want additional grip, you could go from a 400 treadwear rating to a 200 treadwear rating, but dont expect to get more than 10-12k miles out of 200 treadwear tires. The same trade-offs apply to clutches.

 

Boostin - This was your original post. My point was that more grip does not equal accelerated wear. More slipping = accelerated wear (common with lightweight flywheels, for example).

 

The 45k or whatnot wear on your previous car is from either hard driving, improper driving, or an improper clutch design. To give an analagous situation: the clutch in a 1993-2003 BMW 540i 6-speed is under-sized for the car. Many owners get 60k out of them, some more, some less. But that's a design problem....the engine needs a larger surface. The upgrade option is to switch to a whole new clutch that has 50% more friction area.

 

My only point is that an upgraded full-face clutch does not, by itself, give you more or less clutch life. Your "more grip = accelerated wear" is not accurate.

 

And I mean no offense by this, just stating what I believe to be correct.

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psucaptainkickass Veteran

psucaptainkickass

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The documentation comes in the part #s. We need to see if the 07-09 LGT uses the same part numbers for the clutch components as the 08-10 WRX. BTW...all this clutch talk must have jinxed me or maybe its all the city driving vs highway that I have been doing. Damn TOB is getting a litttle noisy I believe. I guess at 109K that my be enough for the factory unit. Will confirm tomorrow.

 

From FredBeans...

 

The parts between the 08+ WRX along with the 07+ LGT are the same. Clutch Disk, Pressure and Flywheel are all the same part #'s. So the 07+ LGT kit is the same as ordering the 08+ WRX kit

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Ridgeracer Mentor

Ridgeracer

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From FredBeans...

 

Unfortunately they are. I'm going to take everyone's advice and maybe try an ACT clutch too. I really hope this thing doesn't chatter to hell and grabs/engages as well as my old Honda clutch.

"Gimme mines Balboa...Gimme mines".....Clubber Lang - Mr. T
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JoeFromPA Grand Master

JoeFromPA

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Totally anecdotal, but it seems like owners who have gone with the OEM SM Flywheel, ACT Clutch, and TSK3 TO bearing kit are less likely to experience any noises. This is from like 2-3 examples, so bearing that in mind....

 

I swear my stock TO bearing was rattling (not whining, rattling) yesterday when I was driving around. Everytime I started to push the clutch pedal down about 1-2", I'd get a bit of rattle. Completely independent of drivetrain speed, gear selection, or car temperature.

 

I'm going to swap my first clutch in the coming weeks on a 2001 Subaru Outback, and I'm looking forward to applying the knowledge gained there to a future LGT endeavor :)

 

Joe

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psucaptainkickass Veteran

psucaptainkickass

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I love the TOB noises...rattles when cold, squeals when shifting. Makes an interesting symphony when driving...when it is cold out.

Goes something like..Rattle Rattle Rattle, Squeeeaaaalll, Rattle Rattle Rattle, Rest (Gear noise), Squeal, (Gear noise)

I am ordering the 07-09 OEM Clutch kit momentarily.

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TimGinCentralNJ Rising Star

TimGinCentralNJ

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I love the TOB noises...rattles when cold, squeals when shifting. Makes an interesting symphony when driving...when it is cold out.

Goes something like..Rattle Rattle Rattle, Squeeeaaaalll, Rattle Rattle Rattle, Rest (Gear noise), Squeal, (Gear noise)

I am ordering the 07-09 OEM Clutch kit momentarily.

 

Man, I'm not getting this "symphony" yet; only a slight occasional rattle when I depress the clutch and the car's warmed up. Guess I have this to look forward to? :spin:

 

Can't wait:mad:

Tim

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TimGinCentralNJ Rising Star

TimGinCentralNJ

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As far as the TOB goes, we already know there is an issue

 

Well, I sure think there is anyway :)....that was kind of my whole point; if in my mild mannered driving style I'm still not driving my car correctly and causing undue wear on my clutch, why is it the TOB which is crapping out and not the part which bears all the wear and tear?

 

I've seen a very small number of people who've chimed-in about only their TOB. Most posts I've run across seem to involve the clutches themselves failing--either that or the owners failed to make the distinction between the two.

 

Personally, mine did not look very worn and everything looked fine at 55k miles when I switched clutches. (I don't need to drive smoother - I know I work my cluch a bit and I am perfectly satisfied with 50k mi)

 

I guess this comes down to "expectations"; you are obviously an enthusiastic driver and are ok with getting 50k out of your clutch because of the performance you get out of your car. I'm not an enthusiastic driver, I take it easy on all my cars and expect them to last a long time...an expectation which has held true in probably 95% of my past cars. Maybe there is something to AWD putting more stress and strain on a clutch, but then again--why it it my TOB and not my clutch which is failing?

 

Regardless, I do appreciate your comments...

 

Rgds,

Tim

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rao Grand Master

rao

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Whatever what, dude? :lol:

 

No one has anything other than unfounded theories as to what the "problem" is with the stock TOB. The aftermarket TOB makes lots of claims, but ask for a warranty that covers parts and labor and see what you get.

 

You can speculate all day long (and most people here do :lol: ) but that will not prevent a new TOB from failing "early" or cause one to last forever.

Rob

 

 

 

IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT

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