Subaru, Toyota will build small sports car

[chenc544]

The 20-25k price range will probably be appropriate for the RWD, non-turbo Toyota version, which makes sense. With a special AWD GT4 model, if they want.

 

If the rumors of a Subaru model along side are true, it could go $24-28k, with AWD standard, and optional turbo. It would be alongside the Impreza, and Legacy 2.5i, but less expensive than the Legacy GT Limited (non-limited is gone) and would sell differently by being a coupe.

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Civic SI, GTI, and MS3 are all PREMIUM trim lines of their respective models. And I would imagine that a similar high-trim line of a Toyota coupe would have more power, and possibly AWD. Regular Civics, Rabbits, and the base Mazda3 don't have as much power as their premium variants.

 

Civic SI, GTI and MS3 might be the premium trim but they all start at $20-$23k. Smack in the middle of the non-turbo RWD price range you speculated. Even with the 2.5 NA's 170 hp you are still down about 30-100 hp from your competition that weights about the same. Which ever way you slice it, the performance bang for the buck is not good if that's the price point.

 

If it takes away a couple of ugly hunchback 5-door, or boring-as-ever 4-door sales, it will be a small price to pay for a unique product on the market. An AWD, Turbocharged sport compact coupe. NO ONE ELSE HAS ONE!!! Not even MITSUBISHI!!! How would that NOT create a stampede of sport compact buyers into Subaru dealers? Especially if it is clear that the aftermarket is already in place, for the WRX, Legacy GT, and STI, and can almost instantly adapt to this car.

 

This car should attract new buyers from other brands that Subaru hasn't seen since the US introduction of the WRX in 2001, coincidently when the AXED the 2.5RS coupe. Gaining sales is great, even if some people choose to buy a coupe version over a 5-door version, which isn't a "lost" sale, if both cars are Subaru cars. If Toyota does it, or Subaru BOTCHES it, Subaru will lose sales to Toyota.

 

How many buyers are NOT considering the WRX now, because of it's body style, or it's ugly design? How many sport compact fans prefer coupes, and don't buy Subaru, or Toyota, because of that? How many people over the age of 25 would LOVE to have such a car as either a fun daily commuter, OR a weekend tuner sporty car?

 

Count me as one... Not sure whether I would keep the Legacy as a daily driver and tune up a sport coupe, or Keep the Legacy nice for longer trips, and slog on a lighter coupe every day instead.

 

Well, I suppose here lies the "$25,000" question. Will an AWD coupe result in a net increase to Subaru's bottom line. Subaru obviously didn't think so based on their previous experience with the SVX, 2.5RS etc. If Toyota is footing the bill for the development and sharing the cost of manufacturing, then I suspect this equation has changed enough for Subaru to reconsider.

[IwannaSportSedan]

Civic SI, GTI and MS3 might be the premium trim but they all start at $20-$23k. Smack in the middle of the non-turbo RWD price range you speculated. Even with the 2.5 NA's 170 hp you are still down about 30-100 hp from your competition that weights about the same. Which ever way you slice it, the performance bang for the buck is not good if that's the price point.

 

Well, we are speculating on price. Who knows... maybe we'll see a new iteration of the naturally aspirated Boxer engine.

 

Maybe with DI, certainly possible with higher compression, and dual AVCS. Maybe the 2.0i will get closer to 100hp/liter, and the 2.5i will get a 2.5R designation, or something, and break 200hp or more.

 

I am not saying it will happen, but it could, and we're talking about a car that will likely not be on the market for at least 12-24 months.

 

Or the price could be lower than we think, and a turbo model offered in the 20k range... I have a feeling Toyota/Subaru are watching the Genesis coupe turbo, to see how it will fare until then.

 

Well, I suppose here lies the "$25,000" question. Will an AWD coupe result in a net increase to Subaru's bottom line. Subaru obviously didn't think so based on their previous experience with the SVX, 2.5RS etc. If Toyota is footing the bill for the development and sharing the cost of manufacturing, then I suspect this equation has changed enough for Subaru to reconsider.

 

See, that is the kind of logic that I understand, but I hope Subaru sees beyond.

 

SVX was not platform shared, not even really engine-shared, despite the 3.3's derivation from the 2.2. That made it an expensive car. It was a good car, but Supra and 300ZX were sportier and more powerful with turbos. None of them survived, nor did the RX7 or Porsche 968.

 

I understand that SVX probably still weighs on their decisions, but some of that was market softness. (which is a factor again, but favors smaller cars now, rather than favoring SUVs before.) Some of that wasn't the product's fault, some of it was the fact that the product was expensive to build, sell, and support.

 

The 2.5RS is a bit different. It seemed to be fairly popular when it was canned with the end of the GC8 chassis. If it suffered at all, it was because there wasn't a hotter WRX turbo version, that the rest of the world did see. It was an aging chassis, and was ready for update. Strangely, the coupe didn't make the jump. BUT, that was also in the doldrums of the coupe market, where few coupes survived at all. Toyota's Celica did fine, and still got canned unceremoniously.

 

I am not sure why Subaru left the coupe style off, just as I am not sure why they didn't maintain and ultimately dropped the Legacy wagon, while there are so few other wagons around also. Moderate or low sales in a vacant market is different than low sales in a booming segment.

 

2.5RS coupes are still sought out as tune-able cars. Turbo swaps are common. Imagine if the bugeye had a coupe variant, with a WRX Turbo trim line, and it had never gone away.

 

With the popularity of sport compact tuning, and drifting, I would think that a RWD coupe would be quite popular. and aside from being too grippy for drift, an AWD version would be quite popular with people who know what Subaru AWD is capable of. There is a reason that Audi R8, Lambos, Bugatti Veyron and Porsche 911 variants are AWD. A turbo boxer coupe with AWD and a 6-speed stick is otherwise unavailable under the price of the 911 Turbo.

 

It would be especially amazing if it were to get an STI model with 300+hp and torque, and variable-bias DCCD, brembos, and forged BBS wheels... in a 3000lb sleek coupe package. Who else has that, or anything close? Pontiac Solstice GXP Targa coupe might be the only thing close, minus even small rear seats, and minus the AWD. Genesis coupe weighs more, and the turbo doesn't have that much power, although the V6 might come close on power.

 

And regarding Subaru competing with other turbo coupes... Solstice GXP Targa is possibly getting 300hp from it's turbo ecotec. Hopefully Toyota, but especially Subaru step up. Autoblog: Solstice Coupe to pack 300 horses

[ScoopMan]

Who needs Toyota?

 

How about this?

http://vintagespyders.com/turnkey.html

 

Not quite the same, but looks pretty fun to me!

[IwannaSportSedan]

If it doesn't come with a turbo, it still has potential, especially if the chassis remains intact enough to fit AWD, although RWD is just as tuneable. The key is the engine and suspension.

 

If the car is powered with a boxer engine, and has the Legacy/Impreza suspensions. An engine swap puts a VERY powerful little turbo engine under the hood, and suspension mods already exists to fit the subaru suspensions, and more will come if the coupe is worth tuning. It would have to be a complete failure to be not worth tuning as a light little RWD coupe. IF they botch this, I keep wishing for a Mazdaspeed Kabura from mazda (strangely without ANY coupes, either... from "zoom-zoom" what the heck is that about? RX8 isn't *quite* a compact coupe), or saving for a Solstice GXP Targa.

 

The rumor is that Toyota is working with Subaru to fit a better rear differential into the chassis and rear suspension, in order do cope with channelling the driveline's power just to the rear wheels. A non-turbo H4 between 150-200hp would not overpower the rear diff Subaru already uses in the STI, and they would not be spending the R&D money on it if that were the sole case. That leads me to think that perhaps they are engineering this to handle more horsepower in rear-drive configuration. Non-turbo may not be the only option. But that is just my logic working, I could be wrong in interpreting this.

 

It is possible that the Toyota coupe ends up being cheap. I will blast it if it is, although the AE86 was a cheap little car that is still a performance value even as a 20+ year old used car. I thought the MR2 Spyder had a very cheap interior, in addition to being completely and absolutely impractical, without enough cargo room for a pack of gum.

 

and I love your idea of a Legacy based coupe. I have long wanted a new SVX, this time less expensive, and sharing a lot with the Legacy.

 

But that isn't what they are rumored to be building. I wish they were.

 

I wholeheartedly agree with your last sentence about TVs, table saws, etc... Legacy wagon is gone, Legacy sedan doesn't have a 5-door arrangement, nor a 3-door hatchback coupe (my old fox Mustang and Probe GT held more cargo, but less people. The Ranger of course had a truck bed. I have wished my Legacy had a hatchback on the sedan body style.)

 

I am not disagreeing with what you want, I just don't think that is what is coming from these rumors, and we haven't been hearing other rumors.

[SLegacy99]

I'd dig a Legacy coupe.

[IwannaSportSedan]

I think the number of people who will buy this car because they can do an engine swap will be VERY few...

 

I guess it depends on what it looks like, but I'd suspect people do swaps into older (early '90s) legacies and late '90s Imprezas. Sure there will always be a few people who swap engines into brand new cars, but saying that this is tuneable because you can change the most expensive component is a bit of a stretch.

 

I am sometimes amazed at the amount of money people put into tuned cars. People tune expensive cars, as well.

 

The engine swap crowd is probably small, but still, if it is possible, or even easy, it will steal WRX's thunder.

 

Why buy a 35-38k WRX STI, when you can buy a ~22k non-turbo coupe that is lighter and looks better, and put a turbocharged EJ25x engine, brakes, wheels, suspension parts, and visuals in it for less money than the $13-16k price difference? And still have a lighter, quite possibly better looking coupe, rather that a hunch-back 5-door pushing 3500lbs.

 

That also doesn't take into account an aftermarket turbo kit that wouldn't involve swapping an engine. Granted, it would probably be light-pressure, but it would be very easy to tool up for, with subaru and aftermarket parts.

 

That is somewhat moot, if there is a turbo engine offered, which instantly makes it much more attractive and ready, before mods, or instead of mods.

 

Are they targeting males 30-40 with this thing? I suspect most of them want something a little more refined and upscale than an Impreza based coupe.

They can't possibly be targeting the 40-60 range with a cheap, NA 2.5l eco sport coupe...

 

30 somethings would probably buy such a car for a commuting daily driver, or fun project. Probably not their "main-duty" or traveling car. I am 30. I would consider it for either role, along side my main Legacy traveling and passenger car.

 

40-60 year olds that are buying coupes as second cars are likely Retro cars. Corvette, Mustang, Challenger, and someday Camaro. Who else are those cars pushing toward? Those designs harken back 40 years, as well.

 

That leaves 20-30 year olds who have a lot of cars to chose from already with more tuning potential. (I think it is out of reach for most 25 year olds to do engine swaps...) They're either buying used Celicas because they look pretty cool and have a good reputation, used Imprezas because they can mod them (a used WRX is definately in this price range) or other little cars. I guess I am not complaining about what they are making, but I just don't see there being a big demographic interested in this thing...

 

I think you would be surprised. Look at the news story out of California about 150 sport compact drivers being targeted in a unfounded police raid. (discussion of that probably should go into an off-topic thread dedicated to it.)

 

Look at our own guy, 05GTGuru... an early 20-something, or maybe he's even 19, and owns not one, but two tuned high-output cars, a Firebird and a tuned Supra.

 

The thing is, that sport compact buyers typically turn over. People who own sport compacts today, buy larger cars later, as they start families. Some of them continue to own project cars, which RWD or AWD in a sleek coupe body will be attractive. RWD has a few options, AWD has none so far. FWD is far more common, but not as credible in terms of true performance for those who are in it for more than looks.

 

But the sport compact scene also brings in new buyers. people in, or just out of high school and college, with a bit of income to be able to afford a car. THAT is who are going to be primarily attracted to this, as they don't need a lot of practicality.

 

The thing is, also, you talk about used cars. If those cars weren't built and sold new in the first place, they wouldn't exist as used value buys. What if we'd never had a WRX in the first place, there would be no used market for a car that never existed.

 

Not all 20 somethings are into cars only for looks, and almost all of the "fun" cars in that segment are either boxy scions, or FWD Hondas or Hyundais. Those not convinced by boxy styling, or FWD dynamics are very likely to jump on a RWD option.

 

The 350Z started to go down that road, but is slightly out of reach of the 20-somethings, and is more geared toward 30 or 40 somethings who want a secondary car. This project will also appeal somewhat to that, as being easier to afford as a second (or third) car. The Solstice Targa GXP coupe will probably fit the same segment, perhaps a touch less expensive.

 

Hyundai's Genesis is aimed squarely there. 2+2, RWD, turbo or V6. Toyota/Subaru are probably looking at something slightly smaller, much lighter, more efficient, and more affordable. A bit of an undercut to the Genesis coupe and base Mustang and GT.

 

 

Subaru needs to spend R&D dollars to bring over more economical cars while making existing cars a bit more exciting and competitive.

 

if they are talking about a non-turbo, lightweight coupe, that IS more economical and efficient. A turbo version would be more exciting and VERY competitive.

 

I wish they did better with the Legacy's details, but the basis is already there, and has been since MY2005, which is why we own them.

 

They badly need to fix the styling to be competitive with the WRX and drop the price of the STI a bit.

 

So far, I have yet to see ANYTHING from Subaru itself lately, aside from the modified-Outback Exiga, which is hardly a clean-sheet for a new Subaru offering, it was an existing car modified for 7 passengers and auto-show bling.

 

I agree with you that Subaru needs to up it's game. I hope they use this coupe for that opportunity.

[IwannaSportSedan]

NEWS!!!!

 

http://www.autocar.co.uk/contentImages//Car/Subaru/Concepts/84885250.jpg

Autocar Article

 

http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2008/04/948895225_250-op.jpg

autoblog.com subaru/toyota coupe sketch surfaces

[IwannaSportSedan]

My comments on Autoblog:

 

I guess I am going to start saving some cash.

 

I seriously hope that they mean that the Toyota will be RWD, with GT4 being AWD, but that Subaru will be ALL AWD. RWD is good, but it doesn't fit Subaru.

 

I also hope that Toyota gets the econo-model, and that Subaru sees fit to market this coupe alongside the Impreza lineup, as a 2.5RS, WRX, and WRX STI coupe lineup.

 

They should ditch their ugly little impreza 4-door, let the 2.5i, 2.5GT Turbo, and Spec B turbo models handle the 4-door market, and just have impreza 5-door wagon-wannabe, and 3-door coupe that looks like the rendering here.

 

IF Subaru doesn't put a turbo in this thing... I'll be saving up for an STI driveline swap, after the car is out of warranty. This car BEGS for 305+ horsepower, DCCD AWD, 6-speed stick, SI-Drive, and Brembos/Bilsteins with BBS wheels.

 

If it weighs ~3000lbs so equipped, it will be one of the performance values of the century, and make the Genesis coupe, and the Mustang GT look like also-rans, let alone front-drivers like Eclipse that has fallen from it's Turbo AWD perch long ago.

 

About the only other car with that sort of power to weight ratio is looking to be the Solstice GXP Targa coupe.

 

"Build it, and they will come." -Field of Dreams, but applies here, too.

[SC GT]

NEWS!!!!

 

http://www.autocar.co.uk/contentImages//Car/Subaru/Concepts/84885250.jpg

Autocar Article

 

http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2008/04/948895225_250-op.jpg

autoblog.com subaru/toyota coupe sketch surfaces

WOW! That is one of the best looking designs to come off of a Subaru sketchpad . . . ev4r! To everyone that thought Toyota's input would add teh suck to Subaru, so far you are way off base. The design makes me think of a mini-Aston Martin (as well as a nice face lift to the old Celica). Clearly the body design must be most, if not all, Toyota's influence because I think Subaru fired all of their good designers after the Legacy GT came out. If they actually produce that top design (without watering it down), I think they will sell more than a few.

 

(But I'm anticipating that the Subaru version will add an ugly grill, warts, etc.)

[IwannaSportSedan]

as long as the sheetmetal is good, there is hope for aftermarket bumper covers and grilles.

 

I noticed the aston-esque upswept quarter window treatment. Not bad, and there are only a few good ways to do a quarter window treatment.

 

*Here is hoping they don't tease us, and then produce something un-fixably ugly.

[SLegacy99]

I like it.

 

I'd still like to see the return of the 2.2L to offer some efficiency, but I would definately prefer an AWD Subaru version to a RWD Toyota version. Just not my thing.

 

I think starting small with RWD N/A 2.5L is a good idea for Toyota. Though I definately think there would be some buyers of a 224 - 243 hp version and perhaps even a 305 hp version. However, I would still very much so like to see direct injection in Subaru's boxer engines, especially when it comes to debuting new models.

 

I wonder what kind of tranymissions will be in there.

[CTlegacy06]

Why does Toyota need to go to Subaru for a RWD? Don't they have the Lexus line that is mostly RWD made by them? I'm guessing they are mainly going after the boxer technology and a suitable transmission that can deliver the power. Personally I feel they are taking a slice of a the Niche Subaru dug itself in.

 

That sketch it looks to me like the Eclipse (front), Tiburon (side), and M6 (rear).

[SLegacy99]

Why does Toyota need to go to Subaru for a RWD? Don't they have the Lexus line that is mostly RWD made by them?

They have a 2.5L V6. Guess they don't want that.

[chenc544]

The NA EJ20 in current form is rated at ~150 hp. I wonder if there is really 25 extra hp to be had from the NA version of that mill. Once upon time the target weight for this car was 2500 lbs, don't know if that's realistic with a Legacy platform. If it comes in at 3000 lbs it should be close in terms of performance with the likes of the Civic Si and GTI.

I don't think there is anyway Toyota will call this thing Corolla regardless of what its inspiration is. With possibility of a AWD GT4 version, it's probable that this car will be the 8th gen Celica. What's more interesting is what would Subaru call it? A name from its past, maybe Alcyone?

[chenc544]

Why does Toyota need to go to Subaru for a RWD?

 

I have a feeling the Legacy platform + H4 boxer engine is much lighter and cheaper than the Lexus platform that they have.

 

That sketch it looks to me like the Eclipse (front), Tiburon (side), and M6 (rear).

 

I see Ferrari 456GT, which is where Tiburon got it's inspirations from anyway.

 

http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/ferrari-456-gt-1.jpg

 

http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/ferrari-456-gt-2.jpg

 

http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/ferrari-456-gt-3.jpg

[IwannaSportSedan]

Let's hope that it looks better than the 456. I think the rendering is cleaner than that particular over-styled ferrari. It will probably be half the size.

 

Lexus' IS chassis is probably much more expensive without much of a benefit over using the Subaru chassis. Plus the Subaru chassis will fit AWD more easily (and yes, I know IS250 has it as an option) and boxer engines.

 

Lower, lighter, cheaper, ready made with factory space at Gunma to go with it. That is why.

 

It would be interesting to see a Subaru and Toyota pair together. the Toyota stripped down to a bare minimum club-racer trim, thin or composite panels, bare interior, no sound deadening, etc... with RWD, and the STI's turbo engine. 2700lbs or less, and 300+ horsepower through a limited-slip rear differential, obliterating the rear tires on the pavement. holy hell, that would be a great power to weight ratio.

 

And the Subaru version with the same engine, plus the rest of the STI trim, including driveline, DCCD/6MT/SI Drive, Bilstein PSS10 adjustable suspension (maybe even airbag ride-height control), alcantara interior, gold slotted Brembos, BBS forged wheels, the whole works. 3000lbs with 300+hp on ANY road or weather conditions. The ultimate in performance versatility.

 

Toyota painted TRD red and white, and the Subaru in STI-spec WR Blue.

 

It had better have frameless windows, though.

[CTlegacy06]

It had better have frameless windows, though.

I think that will be the only way to distinguish Toyota's and Subaru's in the future!

[SLegacy99]

Thinking about it, there are alot of die hard All-Trac Celica owners/enthusiasts out there. Toyota should offer an AWD version.

[IwannaSportSedan]

OFFICIALLY OFFICIAL!!!!!

 

Autoblog: Toyota/Subaru RWD sports car confirmed for 2011 with boxer engine

 

Woo HOO!!!

 

At a press conference in Japan today, Toyota CEO Katsuaki Watanabe finally confirmed that his company is jointly developing a pair of rear-wheel-drive sports cars with Subaru. Each brand will get its own version of the car, which will be powered by one of Subaru's boxer engines, though the engine's displacement, power output and even number of cylinders is not yet known. We're also not sure if the Subaru version will feature the brand's trademark all-wheel-drive system either as an option or standard equipment, or whether Toyota might offer AWD as well in an homage to the Celica GT4 (we hope so!). The styling will most likely resemble the sketch that was leaked out yesterday, though we don't expect one car to be a rebadged version of the other. Mark your calendars for 2011, which is when the new sports cars are scheduled to arrive. They'll be riding on a brand new platform and be built in Japan at a new plant by Fuji Heavy Industries, the parent company of Subaru. Toyota also confirmed rumors this morning that it will be buying up more of Fuji, raising its stake in the company from 8.7% to 16.5%.

 

These RWD sports cars will mean a lot for both companies, as Subaru hasn't offered a performance coupe since the slightly odd SVX, and Toyota all but abandoned performance models after the Supra, Celica and MR2 were cancelled.

 

Ummmm.... what do they think the Impreza 2.5RS coupe was?

[slimjoe]

So if both Subaru and Toyota are releasing version of this car, I'm going to call it like this right now:

 

Subaru will have its standard symmetrical AWD system in them.

Toyota will release it in a RWD platform but then if they offer an AWD variant, it'd probably be some halidex system instead of what we have in our cars.

[IwannaSportSedan]

Agree with you except the haldex.

 

This is going to be built in a Subaru factory. If the toyota variant gets AWD, it will get exactly the same parts that the Subaru AWD variant gets. It cuts variable costs and complexity of manufacturing.

 

It costs less to assemble one better AWD system than two different AWD systems, even if the second has slightly less expensive parts. The additional manufacturing process costs would eat that cost savings up without even noticing, and would end up making the cars more expensive than just putting Subaru's AWD in the toyota variant, without having to adapt the sub-assembly line.

[SLegacy99]

As I recall, part of Toyota's desire to invest in FHI was the AWD.

[IwannaSportSedan]

It better not be ugly, it better not be ugly, it better be close to SVX size...

 

IF the sketch is accurate, it shouldn't be ugly. I have my fingers crossed on that, too.

 

Some auto-mag renderings other than the sketch have been ugly, but they were also completely wrong in their 08 WRX predictions. It was ugly in a whole different way than they thought it would be. Not a great consolation, but it leaves a sliver of hope that this won't be ugly.

 

As for the SVX size... I have a feeling it is going to be nearly SVX size inside, without being SVX size on the outside.

 

With the Impreza being roughly as large inside as the Legacy, and this being drawn from the same general platform... it should be similar in size in the front seats, and appropriately roomy, sans doors in the rear seats.

 

The SVX was a big car overall with a nice sized interior. I have a feeling this might be about Legacy sized in the front seats, and about market-average size in terms of "+2" coupe rear seat size. probably similar to Genesis, 1/3-series, Mustang, and others in the rear seat area.

 

The nice thing is going to be the tauter exterior dimensions. SVX had huge overhangs, and was wider outside than inside by a generous margin.

 

And if the Toyota sells 10:1 over the subaru, a Subaru will be rarer, but just as well supported by the factory and the aftermarket. Unlike the lone-wolf SVX. Toyotas will help Subaru's model stay viable, and hopefully well supported.

 

Plus SOA will have less say over mangling it for the USDM, if it is built in Japan. If the Impreza lineup were built at SIA under SOA's direction, we probably wouldn't have a WRX STI, either, like we don't have the Tuned-by-STI Legacy, and other JDM-available options.

 

Here are my mantras:

 

It better not be ugly, it better not be ugly, it better be a 3-door hatch, it better be comfortable, and it better be modest in weight.

 

Maybe we'll even be lucky, and the "window-in-a-window" will make another appearance. If done well, I wouldn't say "no."

[chenc544]

it better be comfortable.

 

Sports car buyers don't usually look at that as a requirement. So I don't think it's going to be high on Toyota/Subaru's list either. Remember it's suppose to be cheap so I don't think there will be too many amenities. And the suspension certainly will not be Lexus like.

 

Maybe we'll even be lucky, and the "window-in-a-window" will make another appearance.

 

Please no, that was one of the silliest design decision ever.

[IwannaSportSedan]

Sports car buyers don't usually look at that as a requirement. So I don't think it's going to be high on Toyota/Subaru's list either. Remember it's suppose to be cheap so I don't think there will be too many amenities. And the suspension certainly will not be Lexus like.

 

I mean comfortable enough that a 6'2" guy can drive it for an extended period of time without being claustrophobic, or the seat killing one's back or legs, with enough head, elbow, knee and leg room. A sport coupe (it isn't a two-seat sports car, it's a 2+2 Sport Coupe, no matter what the headlines say) should be able to be driven without the comfort penalty that the Miata and other two seaters sometimes have.

 

I didn't say plush or luxurious. But it should be driveable by the driver. If it is as comfortable as the Legacy's driver's position, with a tad better supporting seat, and a straight forward interior design, somewhat like the Legacy's layout (rather than the more oddly styled Impreza/Forester) it should be quite good. Standard cloth sport seats are fine, epecially with a bit of open weave for airflow (like perforations on the leather in the Legacy GT.)

 

And I didn't mean to insinuate anything about the suspension tuning with that comfort remark, which I hope is sporty without being teeth-jarring. I hope it doesn't hit frost heaves in the road the way my Legacy does. I HATE that. It sounds like the front suspension is going to cave in over a short sharp edge on the pavement. No damage, but it sounds like it is tearing the suspension off and breaking the front wheels.

 

I love driving the Miata. But it just isn't comfortable after two hours, and not bearable after 3. A 2+2 coupe should be a bit more generous with interior space, and hopefully seat support.

 

Please no, that was one of the silliest design decision ever.

 

I'm not holding my breath for that. Mostly it was a little joke for throwback to the SVX.

 

...but if it can mean a glass canopy roofline with the minimum of door and window edge seams and trim edges for better surface aerodynamics, I would gladly have some inset windows. That was the big reason for them on the SVX, was so that the upper fixed glass pieces could be larger, and flush-mounted over the door frames, B and C pillars, and make the glasshouse smoother entirely. Low drag and high peripheral visibility.