Lets help Subaru redesign the Legacy (2012?)

[camber]

Actually, I just went and took a look at proper sport sedans(Yes, I know, I know SOA... the Legacy was never a sports sedan and always has competed against the Toyota Camry) like Jaguar XF, BMW M3, BMW M5, Audi RS4, Lexus IS-F, and Caddilac CTS-V. Most of them have fenders similar to bl/bp but just stretched and bulged to fit bigger wheels. None of this arch nonsense.

[camber]

Now it looks too Acura TL-ish. Which may not be a bad thing.

But you guys are proposing these looks to the wrong people. Subaru is incapable of offering us a car that we like - so better think elsewhere: market all these design ideas to all those aftermarket companies making front fascia and bumpers etc so THEY (the buyers of the 10+ cars) can sort the "looks" out. I am keeping my 05...

 

Problem is that interest in the Legacy is near all time lows, even with the introduction of the 2010 Legacy. With the new Legacy being nearly to big for Japanese streets, I can't see it being popular there and I'm not sure how japanese body kit makers will support it.

[TheWeatherWarrior]

Here is one with gun metal wheels, darkened headlights, and I returned the wingless grill and added red in the center emblem/logo for fun.

http://www.onlinejason.net/auto/photoshop/Subaru_legacyGT_alterations_stage2extra.jpg

[IwannaSportSedan]

Go to design school. Dozens of designers spent years designing this new Legacy. The new language of their design rests with the concept car, but the styling cues, dimensions, and functional elements remain. Aesthetics, such as darkened headlights, different wheels, less wheel gap, more aggressive underspoilers, or varied paint schemes are easy to do and will be done...in due time.

 

Bull. We didn't see anything until 3 months before the production model was out, and even insiders only claimed to see it 6 months prior...

 

And I am sure there are designers who design ALL the bland and ugly cars on the market. We all know there are plenty to go around...

 

Designers are not infallible, and good design is simultaneously not that hard to approximate, but true originality and creativity can be very ellusive... that is the problem with creative arts...

 

Redesigning an entire model because the roof is too high, the wheel arches are too prounced, the car is too big, etc. does undermine the character of this new model that hasn't even been seen driving around in multitudes. Give it time. The bugeye Impreza was unfavorably compared with the Neon when its design was first released, and now it's overwhelmingly loved by the Impreza guys. Subaru changed the headlight design in two years and nobody seemed to care. The less offensive blobeye is also the least loved between the hawkeye and bugeye.

 

Re-designing the car shouldn't be required, if the design had been acceptably pleasing to begin with. Bad design doesn't become good by being prolific. The current Accord is all over the place, and the new Maxima is out and about, and both of them are STILL horrible looking.

 

Bug-eye impreza WRX is loved because it is now CHEAP, reliable subaru power, and the revisions for blob-eye, and hawk-eye (with a schnozz the size of cleveland) weren't much more attractive. It is called making due with what is available, and looking past the things that can't really be changed.

 

If the '10 Legacy were a fantastic car other than the appearance, I might be able to do the same thing... but the options list is a shadow of what it was, and I wanted a couple more things, not less. It gets harder to over-look.

 

I think it's just too soon to think redesign until the aftermarket, the tuners, you, me, have been able to play around with all that is going for it...I'm not here to troll, just trying to provide insight. I actually like this car in real life, whereas pictures don't do it justice. I know it will look really good with simple mods, and will picture great going around racetracks.

 

Bad design is still bad design. It is not too late to criticize the minute one can see that it is bad design. Aftermarket and tuners, and such have all the much more to work against to make it even acceptable.

 

Bad design doesn't get better with greater numbers, nor with time of exposure. People can only convince themselves to accept less, if they choose to.

 

People have done that for far too long, and the Automotive industry has gotten used to that fact, and have taken it to it's logical end... bankruptcy and decline. The industry gets used to people "settling" for what ever crap they are offered, and rationalizing it, and the trend continues downward.

[TheWeatherWarrior]

Another Update:

This time I revised the rear fender to somewhat match the STi Impreza (2009). I kept the grill, headlights from the other version, but I can quickly change it back (it's all on layers in Photoshop).

http://www.onlinejason.net/auto/photoshop/Subaru_legacyGT_alterations_stage3extra.jpg

 

Again, the idea here is to just change what Subaru could change for the least amount of cost in the manufacturing process. Changing the dies (sp?) for doors and most sheet metal is expensive. I would think that reducing the amount of headlight might actually make is cheaper...but I could be wrong. I remember Mercury saying how expensive it was to produce the full width headlights in the late 80s and early 90s on some of it's cars.

[urfsin]

I like what you have done!

 

Please do us a favor and apply for a job with Subaru yeah??

[Throttlejockey]

Go to design school. Dozens of designers spent years designing this new Legacy. The new language of their design rests with the concept car, but the styling cues, dimensions, and functional elements remain. Aesthetics, such as darkened headlights, different wheels, less wheel gap, more aggressive underspoilers, or varied paint schemes are easy to do and will be done...in due time.

 

 

Which makes it even more sad if that is true. Are you sure the Pontiac Aztec engineers that got fired for that abortion weren't hired by SOA?

[TheWeatherWarrior]

Which makes it even more sad if that is true. Are you sure the Pontiac Aztec engineers that got fired for that abortion weren't hired by SOA?

 

http://www.easternuswx.com/bb/style_emoticons/default/lmaosmiley.gif

 

BTW....if anyone wants to see more of my photoshop auto creations:

 

Jason's Online World - Auto Art Studio

[The B4]

this is turning into a 2009 sti...

[MJ in PA]

Another Update:

This time I revised the rear fender to somewhat match the STi Impreza (2009). I kept the grill, headlights from the other version, but I can quickly change it back (it's all on layers in Photoshop).

http://www.onlinejason.net/auto/photoshop/Subaru_legacyGT_alterations_stage3extra.jpg

 

 

Definitely an improvement, though not nearly as good looking as the 2005 - 2009 Legacy imo.

 

Personally, I think the wheel wells are just fine on my 2007 Legacy - I don't need them to be any more prominent than that. But that being said, cars like the Pontiac G8 and Ford Fusion manage to have prominent wheel well arches that don't look so bad.

 

http://www.theautomedia.com/articles/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/2010_ford_fusion_4-500x358.jpg

 

Note how the arches are subtly blended into the body, rather than looking like a tacked on afterthought.

[bobbys402]

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=66698&d=1240409890

this looks pretty good i just think the front needs a face lift i hate the headlights

[vitaliy_08]

How about just offering the ROW/JDM version for 2012?

 

Seriously though, blacked out headlights, nicer body/less obtrusive arches, better stereo, more power, etc. etc.

 

 

I agree with offering the JDM version.

[iyalla]

+1 Just give us the JDM version. Unlike the previous Legacy the 2010 USDM Legacy does not wear the USDM parts well, particularly the flow from the fenders to the bumpers.

[ppettit2005]

that is true, the JDM is a much more acceptable car to me.

[shtbxr22]

...........wheels still look too small to me.

[MJ in PA]

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=66698&d=1240409890

this looks pretty good i just think the front needs a face lift i hate the headlights

 

Wasn't there a similar one where the chrome window outlines were changed to black? That makes it look better, imo.

[IwannaSportSedan]

JDM doesn't solve the problems. it is merely a fraction less bad than the USDM car.

 

The BL was a good car, and the JDM stuff was all the better. That incremental increase is not enough to raise the '10 Legacy to my consideration.

[Uberlegacy]

http://www.onlinejason.net/auto/photoshop/Subaru_legacyGT_alterations_stage3extra.jpg

 

This one's pretty good! I know my way around Photoshop, so if you'd like, I could give you a hand with them, or I myself could try out a few ideas of my own.

[SuperhawkLGT]

Now do something about the tailights.

[oddseth]

Great work guys just tuned onto this thread. Here is another idea - take a 2009 Legacy and use that as a foundation instead of the 2010. I know the proportions are totally different, but it is important to keep some character from the current model.

[LegGTLT]

It looks fine as is. Why eff with it? When the 2005 BL/BP came stateside, everyone compared it to its contemporary 2002- Camry. Guess you guys missed that AWESOME rhetoric. I stood up for that Legacy design as I am this one.

 

Have some patience, fortitude, and foresight fellow "Legacy" enthusiasts. Give this one at least a year before undermining its character...

Now maybe you just read the "What have people mistaken your car for thread" but if you wouldn't mind, please look up all the threads in the New members section and find where people were thrown by the looks of the '05 against the '00-'04. I don't see any. Myself coming from an '02 I can tell you that the '05 was a GREAT improvement. So please, don't start with the bugeye talk. Keep to the point at hand: '05 was recieved MUCH better over the '00-'04 compared to what we're seeing with the 2010. Keep the WRX talk out of here, not the same comparo at ALL.

[Guest]

But the car is so good, why would you mess up with such a winning formula?

 

I'll tell you what improvements the MY2012 will bring:

 

- no turbo

- manual parking brake

- HIDs but only on 3.6R limited with moonroof and navigation

- reduced color choices

 

[Bones]

The S402 should have been the next Logical Step in redesign for the Legacy. The new Design should only be for the 3.0 version for those that want a roomier car not a Sports car. I think that in 2012 if the new 2010 does well divide the Lines of Legacy Performance line.

[IwannaSportSedan]

I only wish that Subaru had a sense of itself. And that isn't a Camry/Accord follower.

 

If I had the power to direct Subaru's product planning, here is a very gloss-over look at I what I would do.

 

1: make sure that the Coupe is on track. I would space it between Impreza size, and Legacy feature set, more on that below.

 

2: re-design the Impreza to actually look good, and perhaps firm it up just a bit. It is otherwise mechanically sound.

 

3: Scratch the new Legacy and Outback's bodywork and interior, and make them much more attractive as cars, with nice, comfortable interiors, between mainstream plasticky, and Audi/Infiniti expensive. Leave the platform as is, but make the car much more attractive inside and out. Make the Turbo H4 and H6 eligible for a proper BTO sport package, like Spec B is overseas.

 

4: The coupe would be able to be optioned up to share the feature set with the bigger than GR-chassis, but lower and sleeker than the '10 Legacy sedan. The GR-based coupe would also have the optional H6 engine. (if BL Legacy can fit a 3.0R engine, a GR can too, and 3.6R is the same exterior dimensions...) Basically the coupe would bridge the gap between the Impreza base model, and the Legacy GT and 3.6R Limiteds, perhaps with some STI thrown in at the top. If they are only going to do ONE coupe for the whole brand, it had better run the gamut, in terms of configurability, from base 2.0 DI/DOHC, to 2.5T, to 3.6R, from efficiency to grand touring, to outright performance.

 

4: I would add an SUT to the Forester line, a new, correctly executed successor to Baja, although with a more masculine name, built on the Forester's format, not the Outback's format. Perhaps with some Tribeca driveline/brake hardware thrown in, and capable of accepting a Class III hitch, for 500/5000lb tongue/trailer weight ratings. Strong AT and MT options, base H4, and up-level H6 or Diesel boxer. Limited edition XT special sport model with H4T and STI/Spec B 6MT gearbox, for the people who like sporty SUV/SUTs.

 

5: improve Tribeca to a sleek alternative-to-a-boxy-SUV people hauler. Forester and Outback can really be the soft-roader focused machines, although Tribeca won't be ultra-low or anything. Somewhat like the Citroen C-Sportlounge concept from a few years back. Something for 5-7 people to cruise on the highway with, comfortably, and aerodynamically, and more sleek in appearance than a boxy minivan. Who says that more than 4 occupants requires a crate-shaped vehicle? Even the starship Enterprise had somewhat sleek looking shuttle-craft...

[rp3]

I only wish that Subaru had a sense of itself. And that isn't a Camry/Accord follower.

 

If I had the power to direct Subaru's product planning, here is a very gloss-over look at I what I would do.

 

1: make sure that the Coupe is on track. I would space it between Impreza size, and Legacy feature set, more on that below.

 

2: re-design the Impreza to actually look good, and perhaps firm it up just a bit. It is otherwise mechanically sound.

..

 

 

So what you are saying is, as of 2010, you do not like the looks of any car Subaru makes. I think this is a reasonable statement but it also shows a problem with what Subaru is dealing with. The Gen 4 Legacy was designed in 2003; the Generation 2 Impreza was designed in 2001. I look at those cars and see 90s generic Japanese sedan styling (with more rounded sheetmetal).

 

One of the things that is going to make cars not look the same is the european pedestrian safety standards. This is making the hoods higher (and more generic, as I've read here). I was looking at a few cars against the Legacy, the 2010 Buick Lacrosse and Acura TL. Both cars have the same higher hood style.

 

 

 

I wish the Japanese car was released in the US as is but the 2009 Japanese also had features that never hit the US (radar cruise control integrated with the SI drive).

 

If I were Subaru, here would be my 2012 Lineup

 

WRX - This needs to be the sports branding of Subaru. Not GT, or anything else.

 

New entry car priced @ 14000 with 2.0 engine, 2.5 normal as option.

 

 

Impreza 4dr

Impreza 5dr

GT 4dr/5dr

WRX 4dr/5dr

STI 5dr

 

Coupe,hatchback car - based on Legacy luxury but unique name... say Subaru Watchman

 

2.5 normal Engine ~ i and premium trim: 21-24k

2.5 GT ~ premium and limited trim, 25-28k

WRX ~ i, premium and limited trim, 27-31k

STI ~ Limited trim, 37k - Key thing is this shares parts with Impreza STI and nothing else.

 

Legacy:

Tune 2.5 normal engine to 200 HP and fill up a little more space

Cancel 2.5 turbo

Tune 3.6 to 300 HP (or halfway between WRX and STI engine HP) and 3.9 - to become market leader in power

2.7 normal: i, premium, limited 21-26k

3.9: premium, limited, touring (touring has all japanese features, GPS and a 7 speed auto) 27-35k

 

That's how I would plan out the model line for 2012. Should the Legacy take off by then, I would place a car above the Legacy to directly challenge the TL, Avalon and Maxima (in size and price point).