Daniel Stern Lighting and Subaru headlight options

[TSiWRX]

^ Yes, I have.

 

So theoretically, there shouldn't be much, if any, difference, but I still wonder if maybe somehow the different factors are interacting enough that it's causing some benefit. Dunno!

 

I think that since you're only getting flashed in those specific cases, you're fine.

[SubLGTaru]

I know there is a write up on how to realign your headlights, but I don't know if I am going to do that after I get my swifts on. Do you think the majority of the members on here actually do that?

[MiniStiGuy]

its my write-up and its stickied in the exterior section.

[SubLGTaru]

Thanks! I may eventually get around to doing that. I think I am too lazy though. I never realigned my headlights on my civic si after I got lowered and everything was fine...never got flashed.

[TSiWRX]

^ I really don't think you'll get flashed - I drove for a while like that, and certainly did not receive any flashes from oncoming traffic, nor any "evil looks," including from enforcers.

 

If anything, as long as the front/rear drop is proportional, it stands to reason that the drop would actually lower the beam-throw/pattern just a tad, and thus maybe even further help you avoid annoying oncoming drivers.

 

I simply realigned as I had some front-end work done on my car ( my boo-boo :oops: ), and wanted to make sure that the body-shop did their work properly, as well as thought that the realignment may also give me just a tad more light-on-road, properly.

 

Brother MiniStiGuy's write up is awesome!

[SuperhawkLGT]

My justification for getting these are for the back roads I drive on to get home and to work. I want to see Bambi better so I don't hit her.

Bambi was a boy.

[LegacyMUN2k6]

I just ordered mine today from suvlights.com

Osram 65w Raylle

Edited July 23, 2008 by LegacyMUN2k6

[MiniStiGuy]

^ I really don't think you'll get flashed - I drove for a while like that, and certainly did not receive any flashes from oncoming traffic, nor any "evil looks," including from enforcers.

 

If anything, as long as the front/rear drop is proportional, it stands to reason that the drop would actually lower the beam-throw/pattern just a tad, and thus maybe even further help you avoid annoying oncoming drivers.

 

I simply realigned as I had some front-end work done on my car ( my boo-boo :oops: ), and wanted to make sure that the body-shop did their work properly, as well as thought that the realignment may also give me just a tad more light-on-road, properly.

 

Brother MiniStiGuy's write up is awesome!

 

Thanks! I'm OCD when it comes to headlights.

[c-lo]

you avatar is a little disturbing.

 

 

 

and right, Bambi was a boy, but damn what a prissy name for a boy:lol:

 

 

Bambi was a boy.

[f1anatic]

This is an exchange between Daniel Stern and I, with regards to upgraded light bulbs for the 2009 Subaru Forester.

 

Hey people. Apologies if this info has been shared before. Here is the copy-paste of my email exchange with Daniel Stern. I will buy without doubts his recommended bulbs. Two years ago he recommended me that I buy Osram Rally +65W for my Legacy GT and those bulbs keep burning bright and light up my nights. So to speak.

 

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45991&highlight=Daniel+Stern

 

This time I requested again Osram Rally but he suggested that I buy:

 

Narva® 12-volt, 65-watt, 2100-lumen H9 bulb for use in headlamps, driving lamps, and auxiliary lamps originally equipped with H9 bulbs. OEM quality, PGJ19-5 base. DOT-certified and ECE-approved.

 

Perhaps it is just a matter of convenience. Perhaps not. The OEM bulb in the 2009 Forester is an H11. But I listed to him before and I was very happy. Now, the headlight construction differes between all Foresters and the Legacy - we have a different projector design which is superior.

 

Here is the store link:

http://store.candlepower.com/h-9.html

 

And here is his email.

 

Greetings, BC. Glad to read you're still liking those Osram 65w bulbs. They are simply an H9 burner on an H7 base. The upgrade bulb for your Forester is the H9:

 

http://store.candlepower.com/h-9.html

 

The Narva and Osram bulbs are equal in every respect; both are OEM-quality, German-made bulbs. Same goes for Philips.

 

Your high beams can also be significantly upgraded if you will Replace the

existing 9005 bulbs with 9011. The new bulbs are not some tinted or

overwattage version of 9005, but rather employ a relatively new technology

called HIR, Halogen Infrared Reflection. The mechanical dimensions of the

bulb are all virtually identical to the 9005, but the bulb glass is

spherical instead of tubular, with the sphere centered around the

filament. There is a "Durable IR Reflective" coating on the spherical

glass. Infrared = heat, so the coating causes heat to be reflected back to

the filament at the center of the sphere. This causes the filament to

become much hotter (producing more light) than it can by passing

electricity through it, *without* the shorter life or greater heat

production that comes with overwattage bulbs (to say nothing of

overwattage bulbs' incompatibility with stock wiring.)

 

Here's the comparison:

 

stock: 9005, 12.8V, 65W, 1700 lumens, 320 hours

compare: 9005+50, 12.8V, 55W, 1830 lumens, 175 hours

new: HIR1, 12.8V, 65W, 2530 lumens, 320 hours

 

These bulbs are costly as bulbs go - $23.95/ea - but their cost is worth

considering in context: Any number of companies will charge you more than

this for a tarted-up 9005 with blue colored glass (PIAA and Sylvania

Silverstar come to mind) that doesn't produce more light and has a very

short lifespan.

 

The HIR bulbs have a double-wide top ear on the plastic bulb base, this is

to comply with the law requiring different bulbs to have different bases.

The extra-wide plastic top ear is easily trimmed or filed to make the bulb

fit your headlamp's bulb receptacle. Once that's done, they go directly

into the headlamp, and the existing sockets snap on. Please see

http://dastern.torque.net/Mods/HIRmod.html for details.

 

The direct order link for these bulbs is

http://store.candlepower.com/9011.html

 

Best DS

[SuperhawkLGT]

So H9 fits H11?

[f1anatic]

So H9 fits H11?

 

You gotta trim a little

http://dastern.torque.net/Mods/HIRmod.html

[SuperhawkLGT]

That doesn't help.

[akscooby]

I'm upgrading (maybe?) from the same Osram Rallye Hyper+65/HIR set up a lot of you have. I like the light output from both. The HIR's are pretty amazing, actually, and I'm not touching those. I am, however, going HID with lows and fogs as I keep losing a bulb here and there and I'm tired of replacing them. HID's should last years. I'll let you know an honest brightness comparison once the HID's are in. I'm not getting them for looks...I want reliable light, and I was perfectly happy with what I had, so I consider myself mostly unbiased.

[SuperhawkLGT]

Had my HID's for almost three yrs no issues, love em.

[SubieDoobieDoo]

Had my HID's for almost three yrs no issues, love em.

Are these HID's replacing the factory halogen incandescent bulbs? You know ... installing a set of ballasts, connecting YOUR OEM wiring to it, installing HID modules in place of the regular bulbs ... yadda, yadda, yadda.

 

If so, there is at least ONE serious anal-retent on this forum who thinks people like you have made the most horrendous mistake possible with YOUR car (after all, if these are P-n-P HID "upgrades", you have installed non-DOT approved lighting modules!) and that you should be locked up and the key thrown away.

 

Rgds,

[SuperhawkLGT]

Yes been there heard that, the name of this thread goes on a big rant about it. I understand the reasoning, if you look at you beam pattern of your lights against a wall you can see some slight scatter and glare of the light if you have HID bulb replacements. BUT, I have almost never been flashed, it is very rare so I don't think it is too bad of a tradeoff. Besides a full retro is hard to do and expensive, NM if you have a warranty.

[SubieDoobieDoo]

Yes been there heard that, the name of this thread goes on a big rant about it. I understand the reasoning, if you look at you beam pattern of your lights against a wall you can see some slight scatter and glare of the light if you have HID bulb replacements.

! agree. With YOU and to a degree, the retard on the forum who thinks he's "god".

 

There are SO many factors affecting ALL headlights - aiming, road grime, aging and hazing of plastic lenses, simply the motion and the car bouncing down the average highway, on and on and on ...

 

With the inverse square law in physics applying to headlight illumination, that also means any flaws and light scatter are also minimized over distance, too. And rather quickly.

 

And your observation that, yes, looking at the new headlights against a garage door show some slight flaws, they're meaningless over, say, 100 feet. And in a moving vehicle.

 

I went with THE brightest HID plug-in I could find and haven't regretted it a split second! I've passed every stste vehicle exam with ease and since my OEM bulb was a 9007, every HID "plug-n-play" I could find - except one! - killed my Hi beams and I refused to go that route.

 

Apexcone has an HID module with a solenpoid built in that "re-positions" the entire light globe back-and-forth inside the master HID module - and that does a VERY good job of mimicing the front and rear position of the elements in the 9007 bulb.

 

I appreciate 'ol "anal-retent's" opinions but I gotta SEE when I'm crusing down the highway! He insists I'll blind everyone approaching me and I, too, have been "flashed" exactly ONCE in more than a year of using them. Some people just don't like the look of those "Euro-white" headlights approaching them.

 

I used to run around with my fog lights on with the LO beams - regardless of the weather - and realised THAT might invite someone to flash me, too, so I run them ONLY when the weather dictates.

 

My MAIN reason for switching to the overly-bright HIDs was simply so I could see. The second was for durability. I was of the ilk to replace BOTH halogen bulbs when one went out - trying to keep the "aging" equalised - and found myself replacing an awful lot of PAIRS of bulbs! Now? I haven't replaced a bulb since the day I installed the HIDs.

 

Mission accomplished!

 

Rgds,

[TSiWRX]

ROFL!

 

Superhawk, he's speaking of me ( or maybe of our "everything must be legal" brother sebberry ? but I don't think so, for, as you'll see, ScoobieDoobieDoo apparently has a problem with me, since I was good enough to try to correct his mistaken ideas and beliefs, several times )- you know me, you know that although I've never advocated the bulb-and-ballast "plug and play" on the BL/BP, I've also never been against it, as our specific optics, in the BL/BP projectors, allow for a pretty decent and non-oncoming-offensive cut-off, even though the resulting output isn't as "good" as a full-optics retrofits'.

 

Search any of my past threads here, beginning since the time I've been here on LGT.com, and you'll easily find this to be the absolute truth.

 

Initially, when the plug-and-plays for the BL/BPs were first proposed, I had my doubts, just as many of us did. But after having seen the results, I've never been "against" such a plug-and-play. This is the absolute truth, and any amount of searching will prove this to be.

 

And I know you'e been here long enough to know what kind of person I am, and that I'd never claim to know all there is to know, nor "think [that I am] 'god.' ( To-wit, if I thought I knew everything, why would it be, in both of the following cited threads, that I: (1) bowed-out of rendering recommendations on an '08, for which I was, as I very well admitted, not familar enough with, as well as (2) thanked outahere when he corrected me on my then-dated understanding of some critical automotive lighting advances, then confirmed with him and our other hobbyists here as to the appropriate conclusions, and after that, immediately pursued modifying various aspects of lighting setup on both my vehicle and my wife's? )

 

:roll:

 

As for ScoobieDoobieDoo, just know who you're talking to, when you're taking to him:

 

Read through, if you will, pages 1 through 17 of this very thread here

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45991&page=11

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45991&page=12

(skip page 13, nothing important, there)

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45991&page=14

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45991&page=15

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45991&page=16

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45991&page=17

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45991&page=18

 

As well as the following thread, where he initially showed his complete lack of any vehicle-lighting knowledge:

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19050&page=6

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19050&page=7

 

(Yes, you read that right, Superhawk, he doesn't even know what kind of headlights he has, and mistook his '98's reflector/fresnel setup for our BL/BP's projector setup.)

 

For some reason, ScoobieDoobieDoo has taken it upon himself to always criticize as well as belittle me, when I've done nothing but try to educate him....

 

If you think I somehow wronged ScoobieDoobieDoo, Superhawk, please point it out to me. If, somehow, the information that I've presented is wrong or not based on current vehicle-lighting knowledge and know-how, please, again, let me know and correct me on such.

 

You'll see that his arguments are not based on logic (and that oftentimes, his arguments will come full-circle, and he will effectively disprove what he'd previously cited as his own reasoning), that his information is outdated, incomplete, or simply not technically correct, and you'll also see that despite my repeatedly having engaged him on a technical level to debate issues/topics, he's repeatedly chosen to belittle me as a person.

 

Oh, and BTW, in addition to the above examples, I'll now add:

 

If so, there is at least ONE serious anal-retent on this forum who thinks people like you have made the most horrendous mistake possible with YOUR car (after all, if these are P-n-P HID "upgrades", you have installed non-DOT approved lighting modules!) and that you should be locked up and the key thrown away.

 

To which, much earlier, he cited:

 

WRONG, WRONG, WRONG!!!!!!!!

2, If your city, town, county, shire, state or nation require a "vehicle inspection" - normally done yearly to catch those with worn tyres, etc. - YOU WILL FAIL WITHOUT FUNCTONING HIGH BEAMS! Essentially, you might receive a "citation" - such as one gets for speeding - and in many areas, one must then prove to a magistrate or DOT (Department of Transportation) that the "repair" has been made.

 

Where *I* live, this means the vehicle must be "made right" by a certified mechanic - who will install the exact same headlight bulb the owner should have (or an upgraded "bulb") - and certify this on the sale receipt that this has been done - ONE CANNOT DO IT BY THEMSELVES - THEN the owner must appear and present the paperwork, THEN get the vehicle re-inspected.

 

In which case, I propose - how would one be able to "make right," given that the said certified mechanic would note that you, ScoobieDoobieDoo, do not have a proper DOT setup, on your particular plug-and-play?

 

Or are you just BS'ing all of us here?

 

Yet again, your logic just doesn't follow through.....

 

---------------

 

 

Sorry for the rant, EVERYNOE.

 

But when someone calls me an "anal-retentive retard" and furthermore insults me in saying that I have, somehow, a "God complex" (and that's why I routinely apologize to others here, in saying that I don't know everything, right? and that's also why I've also always gone out of my way to try to help others on this Forum, right?) - and doesn't even have the courtesy to call me out by-name, so that I can come and properly defend myself?

 

Yeah, that gets me mad.

Edited September 21, 2008 by TSi+WRX

[SuperhawkLGT]

Yes been there heard that, the name of this thread goes on a big rant about it.

I meant Daniel Stearn, not you TSi. On his web page he explains why it is wrong to use PNP HID's and I completely understand the reasoning, but, as you stated the optics on our cars, read >05 projector beams are very good and use the HID light pattern very well, not perfect, but better than most.

[TSiWRX]

^ Oh, no, no, I wasn't speaking negatively - or even remotely thinking negatively - of you, Superhawk. You have nothing to worry about. I understood the intent of your statement, that you re-quoted above, precisely.

 

My problem is solely with ScoobieDoobieDoo - who seems to have me singled-out to represent all that's evil and wrong in his life.

 

I was just trying to make you aware of the person you were speaking to, as well as, of course, sadly, having to step up to the plate to defend myself.

 

As with your own observations, like I said, I initially (back when such p-n-p kits were first introduced for our BL/BP LGTs) had my doubts, but after seeing some of the first "beam shots," and then having seen some of such kits real-life, I also readily agreed that our BL/BP's unique setup did manage the light from these kits well-enough, and not only increased lumens-on-road, but prevented the dreaded glare to oncoming traffic by a good enough margin so that was not a worry.

 

To the vast majority of us, it's just that - good enough.

[Tommyh]

ah, the intorwebzors...a new and fascinating place for people to insult, correct, rebuke, argue, discuss, and "get all butt-hurt".

 

I'm just here to learn how to make the light that comes out of the front of my car optimal for seeing further down the road, while not pissing people off, or being cited for an infraction of the law.

 

Have fun.

[TSiWRX]

^

 

In your case, any of the three methods (increasing "OEM" capabilities, p-n-p blub-ballst HID "kit," or full-out complete-optics retrofit) will work, but none will absolutely put you out of the reach of "the law."

 

The problem with lighting code infractions is that their enforcement is very subjective, and very inconsistent. In some areas, you can get away with white or even green strobes, on the street, in plain view of enforcers - in others, if you've "cleared" your headlights or your headlights appear even the least bit out-of-code, you can get pulled-over and cited, and in some areas, yes, such fines and citations will "stick" in-court.

 

I've given, in my many posts here, various examples of such. I've even had friends and acquaintances stopped and cited, illegally, for a supposed violation of the tail-light "red-by-sight" code - one which, guess what? does *not* exist in our area, and also, ironically, were on their UNMODIFIED, factory-stock, vehicles.

 

Heck, with the BL/BP LGT, just the fact that the factory projector optics cause that "flicker" when the car takes a slight dip or bump in the roadway can potentiall annoy enough enforcers to pull you over. As a matter of fact, on one of my speed-detections countermeasures enthusiast Forums, there's currently an ex-enforcer (retired) who tells members there, specifically, of how his locals, his fellow LEOs, specifically targeted such "HID-retrofitted" vehicles.

 

There's just no truly safe way to go about this, but if not getting on the nerves of your enforcers or your fellow drivers is your utmost concern, proper AIM and light USAGE, as well as hardware selection, will typically do the trick.

 

Proper aim is critical, no matter what choice you end up making. This is a rule that should never be violated, and should be re-checked.

 

With increasing the output of the factory incandescents, just don't go overboard. This will both keep your lighting housings happy - as well as your wiring and charging system, too - and will mean that even if exposed to a full-on blast from a rise/dip in the roadway and other unavoidable circumstances, oncoming traffic will not have to endure *excessive* discomfort. A 65 watt solution truly is a very good alternative to our standard 55 watt lows, in meeting these needs, and as for our factory fogs, as long as you keep their aim low enough, boosting them up to even 80 watts shouldn't be a problem, and may be of help to some, in specific-use circumstances.

 

With aftermarket "plug-and-play" HID kits, the biggest concern will be to select one whose COLOR isn't going to attract undue attention. Luckily, this pairs well with the actual usability of the light, and typically, staying below 6000 Kelvin should give you a safe pass. However, if your local enforcers are more stringent - or if your budget mandates that you don't replace your HID bulbs for at least several years (and yes, the previous reference regarding "blue-shift" as HID bulbs age is very true, just look at the early-to-mid-90s Lincoln Mark VIIIs that are still on the road, for example - notice how blue-purple their factory HIDs now look, due to aging), then get as close to 4300-4600 Kelvin as you can.

 

With full-optics retrofits, be sure you've worked out any quirks of the selected optics/components, and also, be sure of the source of your retrofit hardware - i.e. if it is from a RHD location, you may have some additional work to do, to make the unit usable, for LHD.

 

Finally, an unexplored option here, exists.

 

That of getting an aftermarket driving (or fog, if that's your need/preference) light setup. Here, proper light selection (driving pattern versus fog) as well as proper mounting/aim - and even more importantly, proper USAGE - will be key in both getting the most usable light possible, as well as not tripping afoul of the local enforcers, or annoying - or even worse, endangering - your fellow drivers.

Edited September 22, 2008 by TSi+WRX

[fweasel]

wow, that;s some documentation. TSi never has been one for making idle comments.

[akscooby]

I just don't understand why people feel the need for HIDs...

 

Honestly, I've got the HIR high-beams and the Osram lows right now...and as I said before I'm happy with the light output. My issue is I spend $50-100 on bulbs per year between the headlights and fog lamps, and I'm tired of it. I want one setup that will provide good light and last for years without needing replacement. I'm getting a decent quality HID with a lifetime warranty professionally installed...if that doesn't solve the problem, then I guess I'll go back to changing out bulbs every six months and see if I can get a bulk discount somewhere....