My ‘05 OBXT journal

[RumblyXT]

Hmm.. I will repeat the smoke test, dang it.

[RumblyXT]

1 hour ago, Febreze Mee said:

I'm thinking the RPM drop when coming to a stop is a vacuum leak. Replacing gaskets/seals and hoses solved this issue for me. Did you skip replacing any of these on the new EJ20?

Except for the big turbo Intake hose, most all vacuum lines if not all are new.. hmm..

 

[Febreze Mee]

2 hours ago, RumblyXT said:

Except for the big turbo Intake hose, most all vacuum lines if not all are new.. hmm..

 

Let us know the results pf the smoke test.

My culprits were the intake gaskets between the risers and manifold, and/or the metal gaskets between the risers and engine block. All were replaced when I performed my recent swap, and I have no more RPM dips. 

[xt2005bonbon]

What are your long term fuel trims?

[RumblyXT]

7 hours ago, xt2005bonbon said:

What are your long term fuel trims?

Waiting for the A/C radiator fan, I’ll run another LV then.. 

[RumblyXT]

14 hours ago, Febreze Mee said:

Let us know the results pf the smoke test.

My culprits were the intake gaskets between the risers and manifold, and/or the metal gaskets between the risers and engine block. All were replaced when I performed my recent swap, and I have no more RPM dips. 

Will do. Yes, I remember replacing those gaskets (and they were in very good condition) the metal/rubber ones between block and I/M and the round orange ‘risers’ were new as well.. 

Dang, I’m hoping there’s no vacuum leak down there where I have to take everything off/on again..

Other than from the big turbo intake hose, is a vacuum leak test performed somewhere else on the engine? I’d imagine pumping smoke from the turbo intake would rule out leaks in other parts like I/C, I/M, waste gate, etc..

I’m going to double check around the bigger aluminum port, as it had come off and I had to glue it back.

Edited September 6, 2023 by RumblyXT

[Febreze Mee]

Did you smoke test it from the turbo inlet the first time around as well?

[RumblyXT]

On 9/4/2023 at 2:39 PM, subisubisu said:

I am getting nothing but hot air from the passenger side ducts.  Good luck to you that your problem is solved.

This is likely a blend door actuator.

[RumblyXT]

13 minutes ago, Febreze Mee said:

Did you smoke test it from the turbo inlet the first time around as well?

The test I performed was done from one of the small rubber ports off the big turbo Intake hose.

[RumblyXT]

Well I'll be darned.. my father in law took apart the A/C, Condenser fan and ended up fixing lol "He mentioned something about the carbons in the motor not hooking up" or something along the lines.. Necessity is truly the mother of inventions/creativity, especially when you lack materials/parts and you have to come up with your own solutions. It's a small example of how we used to face certain challenges and had to come up with ways to make things work. I know it's something trivial, but I really admire that..

Anyways, I installed the A/C fan it was running great, connected the PC, and ran some RR logs while driving. I didn't want to take the car about 60 mph (62 actually), because I could feel boost kicking in. Drove for a while, even took the car on the hwy. I'm not really sure why the IAM doesn't get to the value of 1 yet.

Sorry for the bad pictures, wasn't easy driving and taking shots of the PC screen.

Notice the coolant temp going up a bit, it went up to 217, not really sure why, everything else seems to be working fine. At least that's what it looks like to me.. I may be wrong.

Edited September 8, 2023 by RumblyXT

[xt2005bonbon]

where's the LV

[RumblyXT]

4 minutes ago, xt2005bonbon said:

where's the LV

The 2nd pic? Isn't that the LV (Learning Table Value)? 

Maybe I'm not doing this right. I was driving and had to stop to bring up the LV table..

Comments/suggestions/critiques all accepted.

Edited September 8, 2023 by RumblyXT

[RumblyXT]

I also noticed whenever I open RR, I don't have Turbo Boost monitoring among the RR values.. nor Engine Oil pressure..

26 total Knock Sum.. is that bad?

Edited September 8, 2023 by RumblyXT

[xt2005bonbon]

The LV screenshot was not there when I checked your post. Now it is.

Well, your learned values are pegged to 15%. B is not, most likely because you have not spent much time in that specific range of rpm/engine load. You may still have a vacuum leak somewhere. did you try this simple test described in the first post of this thread?

Regarding your coolant temp, were both fans spinning when you took that LV? At idle, the coolant temp should not climb that high. Although I can see that your intake temp was quite high (143F). Should be around 203-208 I would say. Fans should have been spinning quite fast at the time.

Also, I do reach 217F when I push the car on a long uphill grade, going like 60-80 mph with intake temp above 95F. I have even reached 230F! Again, that's driving on long steep grade, 5 people in the car, intake temp of 105-115F, 3000F+ altitude, 200 lbs tongue weight, rooftop box, and lots of crap in the trunk, trying to maintain 80 mph..

 

Edited September 8, 2023 by xt2005bonbon

[xt2005bonbon]

re coolant temp

I am idling right now with an intake temp of 150F. My coolant temp is 190F. AC on.

[RumblyXT]

4 hours ago, xt2005bonbon said:

Well, your learned values are pegged to 15%. B is not, most likely because you have not spent much time in that specific range of rpm/engine load. You may still have a vacuum leak somewhere. did you try this simple test described in the first post of this thread?

Regarding your coolant temp, were both fans spinning when you took that LV? At idle, the coolant temp should not climb that high. Although I can see that your intake temp was quite high (143F). Should be around 203-208 I would say. Fans should have been spinning quite fast at the time.

Also, I do reach 217F when I push the car on a long uphill grade, going like 60-80 mph with intake temp above 95F. I have even reached 230F! Again, that's driving on long steep grade, 5 people in the car, intake temp of 105-115F, 3000F+ altitude, 200 lbs tongue weight, rooftop box, and lots of crap in the trunk, trying to maintain 80 mph..

 

Last time I did the vacuum leak/smoke test it was fine, I have to repeat it.

I hadn't seen that thread before no, thanks for the link, will read it now. Yes, both fans were working ok, on High and then Low.. The LV pic was taken after I got off the Hwy and parked the car at home while idling. During the Hwy drive, the engine behaved Ok, no subtle heating (maybe because of the increased airflow while driving). Driver side/left fender of the car keeps getting hotter than passenger side for some odd reason. Maybe that HVAC coolant bypass/cylinder 4 cooling mod is restricting the flow there?? Remember I have no heater on the car.. not that I needed in Miami anyways.

Today before going for a drive, I bled the coolant air bubbles, cross pipe has a brand new coolant temp sensor, it has a new thermostat, rad caps are both new, fans are both operational. I honestly don't know what it can be, not sure if these higher compression 2.0L motors maybe require a bigger size radiator (oem stock size is installed now).. or the fact the ECU hasn't been tuned could be affecting the car to where is slightly overheating.

I get what you're saying.. Your car overheated a bit with a lot other factors putting stress on the motor and that would make sense..

But on my car, I'm not even stepping on it hard (never into boost yet).. timing seems to be fine too, no weird engine knocking sounds at all (unless that 7 degrees retarder time I did on the ex cam gears) could be creating this slight overheating? I remember reading somewhere a bad Timing belt job/accessory belts being too tight could create strain on the motor and overheat it? Sighs.. 

Will keep doing research till I figure it out lol.. thank you again XT2005bonbon.

Edited September 8, 2023 by RumblyXT

[xt2005bonbon]

6 hours ago, RumblyXT said:

Maybe that HVAC coolant bypass/cylinder 4 cooling mod is restricting the flow there?? Remember I have no heater on the car.. not that I needed in Miami anyways.

I also have the cylinder 4 mod. I don't think this should cause problem regarding overheating.

I did forget that you are bypassing the heater core. I am not sure how this would affect overall cooling performance.

And I don't think you should worry about your timing belt. If you know your timing belt guides are spaced correctly, as per the FSM, then you should be fine. That part is important. Ask me how I know (previous owner put them too close to the belt. Slowly messed the belt up and jumped a few teeth later on ).

 

[RumblyXT]

6 hours ago, xt2005bonbon said:

I also have the cylinder 4 mod. I don't think this should cause problem regarding overheating.

I did forget that you are bypassing the heater core. I am not sure how this would affect overall cooling performance.

And I don't think you should worry about your timing belt. If you know your timing belt guides are spaced correctly, as per the FSM, then you should be fine. That part is important. Ask me how I know (previous owner put them too close to the belt. Slowly messed the belt up and jumped a few teeth later on ).

 

Thanks.

Hmm.. I thought T/B guides were only for manual Trans models only? I don't remember installing them on this motor..

I took my time to do things correctly and yet I end up with a similar issue I had in the past (a slight overheat) and also a vacuum leak (which should be much easier to find/resolve).

I really like this car, wrenching on it, troubleshooting it and fixing things but damn it, it's getting to the point I'm running out of options.. at times I feel like throwing it off a cliff. I drove it it to/from work last night, it was fine. I noticed the fans stayed on way High speed most of the time after the engine is warmed up, they almost never go back down to low speed, I could even hear them while driving. And yes, the driver side fender still gets very hot (way hotter than the passenger side).. this still has me puzzled.

Right now, that slight overheating is my main concern. It doesn't happen all the time, mostly while seating in traffic or idling..

Possible overheating causes:

• Rad caps (both are new)
• water pump (coolant is circulating fine, upper rad hose gets hot and so does the bottom one)
• big rad hoses (both get hot and are uncompressed)
• thermostat (brand new, fans turn on at warm up temp, meaning is opening) could it be getting stuck open?
• Coolant reservoir tank (has coolant to upper level).. I will check for possible plugged overflow pipe and possible clogged overflow small hoses.
• no leaks whatsoever in the cooling system
• Radiator (brand new stock size, no debris in front of rad/condenser either)
• system was bled of air bubbles (will repeat this step just in case)
• Fans do start on operating temp, but stay on high mostly, sometimes switching to low.. possible Relay malfunction?
• I will swap out the passenger side fan with the new one I will receive today.. just in case my father in law did something wrong when fixing the fan motor.

It's makes a Subaru, a Subaru...

 

Edited September 9, 2023 by RumblyXT

[KZJonny]

1 hour ago, RumblyXT said:

Thanks.

Hmm.. I thought T/B guides were only for manual Trans models only? I don't remember installing them on this motor..

I took my time to do things correctly and yet I end up with a similar issue I had in the past (a slight overheat) and also a vacuum leak (which should be much easier to find/resolve).

I really like this car, wrenching on it, troubleshooting it and fixing things but damn it, it's getting to the point I'm running out of options.. at times I feel like throwing it off a cliff. I drove it it to/from work last night, it was fine. I noticed the fans stayed on way High speed most of the time after the engine is warmed up, they almost never go back down to low speed, I could hear them while driving (not normal). And yes, the driver side fender still gets very hot (way hotter than the passenger side).. still has me puzzled.

Right now, that slight overheating is my main concern. It doesn't happen all the time, mostly while seating in traffic or idling..

Possible overheating causes:

• Rad caps (both are new)
• water pump (coolant is circulating fine, upper rad hose gets hot and so does the bottom one)
• big rad hoses (both get hot and are uncompressed)
• thermostat (brand new, fans turn on at warm up temp, meaning is opening) could it be getting stuck open?
• Coolant reservoir tank (has coolant to upper level).. I will check for possible plugged overflow pipe and possible clogged overflow small hoses.
• no leaks whatsoever in the cooling system
• Radiator (brand new stock size, no debris in front of rad/condenser either)
• system was bled of air bubbles (will repeat this step just in case)
• Fans do start on operating temp, but stay on high mostly, sometimes switching to low.. possible Relay malfunction?
• I will swap out the passenger side fan with the new one I will receive today.. just in case my father in law did something wrong when fixing the fan motor.

It's makes a Subaru, a Subaru...

 

Timing belt guides are on AT and MT, at each of the cam pulleys. Sort of on the outside corners. It’s just the timing belt guide on the crank pulley that doesn’t come on an AT.

Have you considered it might be the ATF that is causing the drivers side fender to warm up? The filter for it is rather stupidly buried inside there. Until you get moving and the trans fluid cooler in the rad can do it’s job, it’s going to radiate some heat.

Edited September 9, 2023 by KZJonny

[RumblyXT]

1 hour ago, KZJonny said:

Timing belt guides are on AT and MT, at each of the cam pulleys. Sort of on the outside corners. It’s just the timing belt guide on the crank pulley that come on an AT.

Have you considered it might be the ATF that is causing the drivers side fender to warm up? The filter for it is rather stupidly buried inside there. Until you get moving and the trans fluid cooler in the rad can do it’s job, it’s going to radiate some heat.

Hmm.. I will check on those T/B guides again. If I remember correctly it came with two on them on the ej20x, but didn't install them thinking it had been on a manual car before. I should be able to install them by just removing the plastic covers right?

Regarding the ATF filter/lines, I have in fact thought about it as the cause of heat, but had ruled it out thinking the filter being so small could not create so much heat around all that area, but I could be wrong.. the car has 212K miles on it, I think it's definitely time to replace it. Now that you say it, those Trans lines there have a lot of dust/oil around them..

Edited September 9, 2023 by RumblyXT

[RumblyXT]

This is from the ej20x FSM (note the ex cam sprockets). I'm going to double check the left over parts I have.. it seems to only bring the T/B manual trans guide #2.

[KZJonny]

Easy to install once you have the plastics off, but annoying since you need to remove the accessories to do so… I don’t remember how many guides the auto has, so it may be worth double checking that, but when I pulled down the AT engine from my old parts car, I’m sure it had some at the corners. Engine had been replaced at some point tho, so it could have been from a MT. Someone with an auto can surely confirm.

The AT filter is just a thought, and you’re right, it shouldn’t be *too* hot, but it sits close to the skin of the fender and seems the most likely culprit. If it’s got that many miles on it, probably worth changing anyway. I think there is enough of an air gap between the heating core hoses and your cyl 4 cooling mod stuff and the fender bulkhead that it’s not likely it could heat up the exterior of the car enough to be measured with a laser thermometer from the outside. That would have to be a *lot* of heat. Air is a crap conductor of heat, and it would have to be getting hot enough to heat up a lot of metal before it was measurable from the outside.

[KZJonny]

6 minutes ago, RumblyXT said:

This is from the ej20x FSM (note the ex cam sprockets). I'm going to double check the left over parts I have.. it seems to only bring the T/B manual trans guide #2.

Cool. I’m happy to be wrong on that one, and don’t know much about the 20X!

[RumblyXT]

7 minutes ago, KZJonny said:

Easy to install once you have the plastics off, but annoying since you need to remove the accessories to do so… I don’t remember how many guides the auto has, so it may be worth double checking that, but when I pulled down the AT engine from my old parts car, I’m sure it had some at the corners. Engine had been replaced at some point tho, so it could have been from a MT. Someone with an auto can surely confirm.

The AT filter is just a thought, and you’re right, it shouldn’t be *too* hot, but it sits close to the skin of the fender and seems the most likely culprit. If it’s got that many miles on it, probably worth changing anyway. I think there is enough of an air gap between the heating core hoses and your cyl 4 cooling mod stuff and the fender bulkhead that it’s not likely it could heat up the exterior of the car enough to be measured with a laser thermometer from the outside. That would have to be a *lot* of heat. Air is a crap conductor of heat, and it would have to be getting hot enough to heat up a lot of metal before it was measurable from the outside.

Yes, if I remember, it may have brought two upper corners T/B guides, besides the main T/B guide on top of the crank sprocket. I will check.

Hmm.. That makes a lot sense now. Heat by conduction from the ATF filter/ lines can be more of a possibility than heating that area by air. I have a laser thermometer, will point it at the ATF filter next time the engine is warmed up. I just thought because I have that HVAC coolant bypass/cylinder 4 mod could create the heating issue around there..

[RumblyXT]

12 minutes ago, KZJonny said:

Cool. I’m happy to be wrong on that one, and don’t know much about the 20X!

It was actually reassurance for me lol.. ever since covid my memory is not the same.