housemusic1 Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 bragging about toying around on the highway with another car is making it more user friendly? No, making you car more user friendly, is making your car more user friendly. It's just odd to me that everywhere on this forum, everybody so damn quick to judge, discredit, discount what other people are doing with their vehicles. Why is it a pissing match? When did everybody turn into Vin Diesel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 No, making you car more user friendly, is making your car more user friendly. Nobody knows what you mean by that. It's just odd to me that everywhere on this forum, everybody so damn quick to judge, discredit, discount what other people are doing with their vehicles. Why is it a pissing match? When did everybody turn into Vin Diesel? Quite the contrary to discrediting. We want specifics. How much power gains for how much dollar, time and effort invested. We get it, it feels awesome to talk about mods and do mods, but at some point you gotta come back down to earth. A 4-speed automatic, naturally aspirated 4-cylinder, full time AWD is just about the most challenging platform, just so I don't say the worst imaginable, to start wrenching on to get power out of. From a performance perspective, it has a shitty drivetrain with shitty gear ratios, it's slow as shit out of the hole because of the drivetrain load on the tiny naturally aspirated engine, which essentially makes it feel like you're trying to get out of a tar pit with an engine that's choking. Not to mention the AWD then becomes a power sucker and a drag AND the high stall torque converter is also fighting you by swallowing up gobs of torque, once you're out of said hole. To each their own, we get that, but the kill stories here are comedy gold. If OP had a Rex or STi that they allegedly dumped because it was too $$$, this thread makes very little logical sense. I would expect someone to have enough perspective to realize what they're doing is time and money wasted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegGTLT Posted March 1, 2016 Share Posted March 1, 2016 fishbone got good advice yo!!! house- I think there comes a time when the saying "been there, done that" truly does apply. Many forum members on here have "already been there, already done that" and this confused them why someone would post constantly about these amazing gains yet provide so little real life numbers. When you tie a tuner to it (and praise them like they gave you a first born son) it becomes even more confusing... maybe even cautionary. Add on multiple examples of shady dealings over time many of us have witnessed on here and you come to the reality that many people have an amazing bridge to sell you, you just need to send them $5k to see it. Basically, I'm saying we're not pessimists nor are we optimists. We're just realists. If you have a career and have seen something in your industry happen so many times with the same failed result, I'm sure you wouldn't encourage someone to do the same thing again. It's call learning from your experience and people with experience get paid VERY well in their specific industries for having experience. It's also better known as not repeating the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Please PM joeleodee For All Site Questions. He is the acting Admin and can resolve anything related to LegacyGT.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NORULZleggy Posted March 1, 2016 Author Share Posted March 1, 2016 Got a few miles on V5 so far, I have been busy with work, I will get some more updates soon. I am still waiting for some parts to come in and install. V5: Car is running great still. The weather is kind of weird here. 70 yesterday and sleet and rain today, so not fun . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasAyinde Posted March 1, 2016 Share Posted March 1, 2016 I guess I didn't realize how much of a dog the NA 4 banger Legacy is. I have a 6 cylinder Outback, and aside from the typical drive by wire lag, its got enough pep to keep me happy. I don't boast about it's capabilities, because it probably couldn't keep up to a stock 5MT Legacy GT. I do have a nice roof rack though. This is the right attitude. OP is doing the equivalent of hiring a makeup artist to enter Susan Boyle in a beauty pageant and boasting about how he got the eyeliner and lipstick on point but won't show a single picture. YES, there is progress to be made, but it's also a battle that was lost before it ever even began. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgoodhue Posted March 1, 2016 Share Posted March 1, 2016 This is the right attitude. OP is doing the equivalent of hiring a makeup artist to enter Susan Boyle in a beauty pageant and boasting about how he got the eyeliner and lipstick on point but won't show a single picture. YES, there is progress to be made, but it's also a battle that was lost before it ever even began. The dyno graph of a 8whp and 12wtq is a solid gain from tuning. Most of you mocking him have cars that are not very high up on the fast car food chain either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasAyinde Posted March 1, 2016 Share Posted March 1, 2016 The dyno graph is questionable also. Apparently OP is in MO and his tuner is in Barbados, so I'm wondering the circumstances around getting that graph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigger73 Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 I applaud the OP for all his efforts to improve the performance on a rather underwhelming car. The AWD 2.5NA auto is a bit of a slug. The extra weight of the AWD drivetrain coupled with an engine that has an average output for it's class leads to straight line performance that is pretty slow. Agree that it would be nice to get some real world numbers rather than butt dyno results that keep getting posted. Though if the OP is happy with how the car feels and drives really that's all that matters. I've been following this thread with interest as I'm heading down a similar path with my Gen6 2.5. After full exhaust (including custom headers and high flow cat) and a dyno tune I've picked up 5-10kW (8-14hp) power and 10-25Nm (7-18 ft-lb) torque. Although these don't sound massive numbers, combined with adjustments to the CVT transmission my car is running 2.0s faster 0-100km/hr (~0-60mph). Stock was 10.0s and now after headers and tune it's running 8.0s. These tests were run on the same road, similar ambient conditions and with a 10Hz GPS based timer with average over 8-10 runs in both directions. It's not earth shattering but they are decent gains and turn a car that is a bit of a slug into something that is half enjoyable to drive. 100% agree it's never going to be as fast as a tuned turbo car but it's getting close to a 3.6R though with a lot better fuel economy. Finally can we please keep the discussion on topic going forwards. If you want to talk about things other than 2.5NA tuning (whose dads/friends/non-legacy car is faster) I suggest you take your discussion to the forum area that is set up for this purpose: http://legacygt.com/forums/forumdisplay.php/general-chat-32.html /RANT Tigger73's MY15 2.5i build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 thank you for posting real data. ~15hp/tq is standard for gains on a NA 4cyl with boltons got about 20whp from doing a header back exhaust and ecutek racerom tune on my mx-5, but in a 2400lb car, you feel it alot more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NORULZleggy Posted March 2, 2016 Author Share Posted March 2, 2016 Finally can we please keep the discussion on topic going forwards. If you want to talk about things other than 2.5NA tuning (whose dads/friends/non-legacy car is faster) I suggest you take your discussion to the forum area that is set up for this purpose: http://legacygt.com/forums/forumdisplay.php/general-chat-32.html /RANT Yea, I totally agree with you about staying on topic. So what's done to your 2.5i? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Yea, I totally agree with you about staying on topic. So what's done to your 2.5i? read bish full exhaust (including custom headers and high flow cat) and a dyno tune Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GipsySpec.B Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 lol build thread. All that's happening here is OP talking about mods like cleaning his air filter and keeping up with a NA 240SX. I could probably keep up with a KA24DE on my racing bike. No, not a motorcycle, a bike. I didn't say it was a good "build" thread, there are no pictures and his "tune updates" read like terrible Fast & Furious fanfiction written by a 15 year old. regardless of power mods if he really put "gobs of money" into his suspension some pics of that would even be some undercarriage eye candy. I just get tired fast when people start talking about how "my car will shred yours in a 1/4 mile" "yeah well my fathers car will tear yours" "My sisters' husband's friend's car will kill that even more" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators BarManBean Posted March 2, 2016 Moderators Share Posted March 2, 2016 Several posts deleted. Please keep this roughly on topic, if you're not interested in the topic find somewhere else to post. "Bullet-proof" your OEM TMIC! <<Buy your kit here>> Not currently in stock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GipsySpec.B Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Several posts deleted. Please keep this roughly on topic, if you're not interested in the topic find somewhere else to post. Well it was bound to happen. I put in a K&N Filter and had zero change in noise. It doesn't change the airflow that much at all, and when there's no turbo to hear wooshing sounds from a modified intake I don't see how anyone could suspect it to be an LGT. I can't buy the legitimacy of this thread without pics of proof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTEASER Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Get back on topic gents! GTEASER's 2012 Legacy GT - Sold GTEASER's 2009 XTeaser - Sold GTEASER's 1992 Legacy SS - Sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigger73 Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 So what's done to your 2.5i? As whitetiger noted it has a full exhaust including conversion from single exit to dual exit (Y-pipe and second muffler). This includes a set of custom headers, a high flow 200 cell cat, 2.5" mid-pipe and replacement of the pancake centre muffler with a hotdog resonator. For details (including pictures) have a look at my build thread here: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/tigger73s-my15-2-5i-249141.html There's definitely some worthwhile gains to be had from exhausts/tuning a 2.5NA. It's never going to be a really quick car - it's more about making meaningful improvements to what you have. You're always going to get people say that you should have saved up and bought the GT/3.0/3.6 and in some ways they are probably right if you were chasing outright performance. Though if you have a 2.5 there is no problems making it the best it can be - that's what modifying cars is all about. Tigger73's MY15 2.5i build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Most of you mocking him have cars that are not very high up on the fast car food chain either. Who said you have to be high on the food chain in order to recognize the idiocy of modding cars that are just a bad, bad platform for performance? I don't have to drive a Shelby, my Stage 2 GT would still murder a NA Legacy lots and lots of thousands in mods. All you need is common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigger73 Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I agree that you always have to look at the level of investment that you're prepared to make in any particular base platform. From what I'm aware the XRT tune is $325 for the 2.5NA so relatively affordable and by all reports is providing some decent improvements in driver experience (yet to have the before/after dynos or 1/4 mile slips). Not everyone buys a car with the sole purpose to modify it to a street legal race car. If you were to do that then a 2.5NA Legacy is probably the wrong starting point. Given that the OP already has this car, he's just doing what many other members on this forum do and that is to make improvements to it for handling/power output and cosmetics. I agree you've always got to look at how much $ you're putting into a car and whether it's a good investment in terms of what you're going to get out of it. I would say from the way the OP is raving about his tune it was $325 well spent. If it makes him happy and he can catch up to cars that used to pull away then why wouldn't you do it? Tigger73's MY15 2.5i build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 ^its not that. its the fact he has no real world numbers to post. "the tune makes my car feel good" is pretty subjective. No dyno, no 1/4mi times. this is basically a butt dyno thread for the worst possible legacy platform to start with. OGs are gonna bring the skepticism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NORULZleggy Posted March 3, 2016 Author Share Posted March 3, 2016 Car is still running good, power is much better as always. I am kind of in a holding pattern till I get the Intake setup going and Kakimoto Chamber in from Japan. I have some logs to get and then this part of tuning will be done. Mean while I have purchased more bushing for the 2.5i. Yes this is not a power mod but for those with 2.5i this is something else you can add as a part to the car. Whiteline Diff Mount cradle insert busing, I do have the full replacement but have to lower the subframe and press the whole bushing out. I will wait till it get warm and sue my buddies lift. I will also be getting the tranny mount. It’s similar to rallitek one for the 2.5i 4eat. These should firm up the slop mounts, and improve the feel. I also have changed the oil from Amsoil 5w-30 SS to the Amsoil Dominator 10w-30. This oil is better for higher RPM and shock loads. This is their race version. Since I am a dealer I called and talked to them about my car and what I was doing and this is what I decided on. In case you wondering I have been a parts guys and Oil guy form years, so all the items bought for my car have been at a fraction of the price. So I have not been just burning money. I am going to write up another post about what I have done to the 2.5i here and post it in a few. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitetiger Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 ^you said earlier you went the drag strip. why have you not posted a time slip? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasAyinde Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 ^you said earlier you went the drag strip. why have you not posted a time slip? Because it's embarrassing to talk so much about how crazy fast his NA is and then post a 17 second slip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE RZA Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 What if this tuner in Barbados is really just swindling him for his money and every new map is really just placebo effect? I'll say this again, if you really want gains out of your car, you need to do the Rallitek Cams and Valve springs. They are good for a 50hp gain maybe more with the right tune. The other option is the AVO Turbo kit for 2.5i and you'll get a 100hp gain out of it. Otherwise everything you keep saying you're doing is futile, even the addition of a CAI that isn't going to give you any power gain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
housemusic1 Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 What if this tuner in Barbados is really just swindling him for his money and every new map is really just placebo effect? I'll say this again, if you really want gains out of your car, you need to do the Rallitek Cams and Valve springs. They are good for a 50hp gain maybe more with the right tune. The other option is the AVO Turbo kit for 2.5i and you'll get a 100hp gain out of it. Otherwise everything you keep saying you're doing is futile, even the addition of a CAI that isn't going to give you any power gain. RZA, I've got no problem with you dogging somebody for tuning their car, but unless you've got actually first hand experience with Ed, don't make this thread about his credibility. You may not agree with what people decide to do to their own vehicle, just like somebody may not agree with what you do to your own vehicle, but that doesn't give you the right to call a tuner's credibility into question. If you're not bringing anything valuable to this thread, why post here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasAyinde Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 RZA, I've got no problem with you dogging somebody for tuning their car, but unless you've got actually first hand experience with Ed, don't make this thread about his credibility. You may not agree with what people decide to do to their own vehicle, just like somebody may not agree with what you do to your own vehicle, but that doesn't give you the right to call a tuner's credibility into question. If you're not bringing anything valuable to this thread, why post here? Uh, you're wrong. I would call into question the knowledge and legitimacy of any tuner that posts a dyno graph that doesn't have the torque and HP curves intersecting at 5,252 RPM. How exactly did he get these dyno graphs? http://www.xtremeracingtuning.com/forum/download/file.php?id=1315 http://www.xtremeracingtuning.com/forum/download/file.php?id=1332 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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