hmmrdwn Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 People don't kill people, tires do. Guns kill people. Knives kill people. Cars kill people. Ladders kill people. Steps kill people. Motorcycles kill people. Snow kills people. Rain kills people. I think it's just nature culling the herd. Hey guys watch this! It's fun.... [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dsom6aI_AGI&feature=related]Daniel's huge trampoline accident!! - YouTube[/ame] Maybe Subaru using Bridgestones is their form of poopulation control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
__raj Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Sadly not everyone has their own skidpad to practice on until perfect. Most of us wake up to snow, hope in the car and drive to work without any practice. It helps to have good tires when you don't drive lots in the snow. Did you learn to drive where roads were not slippery? My wife/I grew up in New England driving on crappy all-seasons on crappy FWD cars. Both of us never have been in an winter driving related accident. I would say the majority of the driving public falls into that. We learned and both agree while the RE92's were not great they are usable in the winter. We next bought Nokain WR G2 which were superior and now on Conti DWS ExtremeContacts which are okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 You can drive on anything within their limits, but there is a point at which the limits are significantly lower than those around you. It makes you slower, less agile and less able to avoid trouble than if you had bothered to properly equip your car for the conditions. As for practicing in a parking lot - I don't need a stunting ticket, thank you very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maniaxzero Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Yes ditch the RE92's. I almost crashed last winter because of them. Absolutely piece of shit tire even in light snow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC5.2 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 You can drive on anything within their limits, but there is a point at which the limits are significantly lower than those around you. It makes you slower, less agile and less able to avoid trouble than if you had bothered to properly equip your car for the conditions. As for practicing in a parking lot - I don't need a stunting ticket, thank you very much. When I learned how to control the car in a snowy parking lot, it was with the blessing of the LEO and under their watch. After a while, they joined the fun. Even police need to practice. If the limits of the tire force you to drive slowly to the point of danger, and you feel you have no ability to control the car, then stay home. I never felt as though I was unable to maintain safe control of my cars, at speeds appropriate for the conditions with RE92's. I could have gone faster on snow tires, and I could have had a larger margin at the same speeds, and that's because snow tires are better in snow than ANY all season. The RE92 is not a snow tire, and should not be relied on to provide snow tire performance. And for all your preaching about snow tires, you said you use Nokian WRG2's in the winter. Not a snow tire, and it's subject to the same "wearing" of the effective snow tread as any other all-season. It's a better all-season than the RE92, in a completely different class, but it isn't a snow tire. The number one way to improve safety in snowy conditions, is to practice car control. Period. With that, you learn when it is appropriate to stay home. [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC5.2 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Yes ditch the RE92's. I almost crashed last winter because of them. Absolutely piece of shit tire even in light snow [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riptide Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Is the general consensus that the continental DSW are the best all season tire as far as snow performance goes? They look like they should be good with that tread pattern. But holy they are expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 When I learned how to control the car in a snowy parking lot, it was with the blessing of the LEO and under their watch. After a while, they joined the fun. Even police need to practice. Around here they chase you out pretty quickly. Parking lots are private property after all. If the limits of the tire force you to drive slowly to the point of danger, and you feel you have no ability to control the car, then stay home. Well, any time you don't have the right equipment for the conditions you should stay home. Bald tires in the rain? Stay home. And for all your preaching about snow tires, you said you use Nokian WRG2's in the winter. Not a snow tire, and it's subject to the same "wearing" of the effective snow tread as any other all-season. It's a better all-season than the RE92, in a completely different class, but it isn't a snow tire. Actually the WRG2 does meet snow tire standards as indicated by the mountain snowflake symbol that the RE92's clearly lack. If you and I were in the mountain passes together and the police were checking for snow tires, I'd get through and you wouldn't. We don't get enough snow here to warrant me putting dedicated snow tires on the car, I'd just wear them out too quickly. The WRG2 is perfect for our climate - longer lasting but significantly better than any other "all-season" in the snow. It may not snow much next to my house, but I sometimes get called out on service calls 20 minutes away where there can be a foot of snow on the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Is the general consensus that the continental DSW are the best all season tire as far as snow performance goes? They look like they should be good with that tread pattern. But holy they are expensive. I'd rather have an all-weather tire that has the mountain-snowflake symbol than an all season tire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 I'll add some more fuel to the fire. Just remembered the week after I picked up my 1998 GT wagon we had a big snow dump in VT. The car had new RE92's. I was taking friends back to there on the hill condo at Okemo from a evening party at our house in town. During the climb up West Hill road we had to pull over into the snow just before the train tracks to let the bucket loader come down the road. When it came time to move out of the snow, the first thing I had to do was turn the wheels to the left, then let the clutch out, the tires never spun. When we got to the Condo the lot was not plowed. When I got them to there door, they opened the car doors, which were pushing the snow, and got out. I backed around and drove back out without the tires ever losing traction. I had to stop on a up hill incline before I could pull out of the parking lot. I know I've said it before, you really don't need snowtires on these cars, it's all about having good all season tires with good tread. Snow's will be a improvement, but most people don't need them. You need to know how to drive in the snow, that's more important. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slickvic Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Is the general consensus that the continental DSW are the best all season tire as far as snow performance goes? They look like they should be good with that tread pattern. But holy they are expensive. I bought a set of Dunlop SP Sport Signature last year from Tirerack.com for $116 each. I am very satisfied with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 I know I've said it before, you really don't need snowtires on these cars, it's all about having good all season tires with good tread. What do you mean by "these cars"? Sure the AWD is nice to have to get going, but the braking and steering is no better than on any other car, FWD or AWD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTDogg MA Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Is the general consensus that the continental DSW are the best all season tire as far as snow performance goes? They look like they should be good with that tread pattern. But holy they are expensive. LOL, what? They're relatively cheap compared to the other UHPAS tires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riptide Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 What is UHPAS? If I look up all seasons on tirerack and check the reviews the continentals are by far the leader in snow performance. But they are $127 each in 225/45/17. So amongst the ones showing up in the search I'm doing they are definitely one of the more spendy options. I appreciate the feedback on this btw so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTDogg MA Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Ultra High Performance All Season = UHPAS Ultra High Performance Summer = UHPS Etc etc You'll get better snow traction from a high quality standard all season than you will a UHPAS because those tend to be geared more toward dry and wet performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
compsurge Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 UHPAS = Ultra High Performance All Season In for looking at good winter tires. I have Yokohama Avid H4S (Discontinued). They are not good in snow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riptide Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 You'll get better snow traction from a high quality standard all season than you will a UHPAS because those tend to be geared more toward dry and wet performance. Standard all season equals "grand touring all season", "standard touring all season", or "passenger all season"? Tirerack doesn't have anything but a single option in "standard touring all season" for my selected 225/45/17 size. And it's even more than the Continentals are. TIA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 What do you mean by "these cars"? Sure the AWD is nice to have to get going, but the braking and steering is no better than on any other car, FWD or AWD. That's where the knowing how to drive comes in. If you know you don't have the best tire for the condition, you begin to adjust how you drive. You use your head, you slow down and begin to brake earlier. You use your head and don't get into a situation where you become over your head very quickly. I have driven with all season tires, in some pretty bad conditons, even with a FWD Civic, with Michelin MXV4's, never got stuck or had a problem, even driving the car in white out conditions at night. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 That's where the knowing how to drive comes in. If you know you don't have the best tire for the condition, you begin to adjust how you drive. You use your head, you slow down and begin to brake earlier. You use your head and don't get into a situation where you become over your head very quickly. It's all well said and done until you hit a hill. If the tires don't grip, then I don't care how gentle you are with the throttle or brakes. If you have to begin slowing down 50 meters sooner than you would have to with snow tires, them I'm sorry - you're not properly equipping your car for the conditions. If you were walking down to the corner store in the snow you wouldn't wear your flat bottomed dress shoes and walk really slowly, you'd grab the hiking boots sitting on the mat next to them. I have driven with all season tires, in some pretty bad conditons, even with a FWD Civic, with Michelin MXV4's, never got stuck or had a problem, even driving the car in white out conditions at night. Someone get this man a cookie! Clearly you didn't try to get the car started on an icy hill. Again, no matter how skilled you are, if the tires don't stick you're going nowhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTDogg MA Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Standard all season equals "grand touring all season", "standard touring all season", or "passenger all season"? Tirerack doesn't have anything but a single option in "standard touring all season" for my selected 225/45/17 size. And it's even more than the Continentals are. TIA Standard touring, IME. I had the Kumho 795 A/S tire on my old Prizm (Corolla) and they allowed me to tread 6" of fresh powder at 40mph. I got them for $36 each in 2005, great tire. But then again, I wasn't driving as... enthusiastically as I do now. They were great for A to B, and in all weather conditions, but I doubt they would have handled very well if I really pushed them. Tradeoffs are everywhere. http://www.kumhotire.ca/tires/details.php?line=1&cat=4&ptn=795 Also, check out the wheels and tires forum, there's a good UHPAS thread in there as well, with many options not listed on TireRack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SurlyOldManMN Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 They'll tell you not to park on a hill. Watch... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 I've watched out of my window as cars couldn't make it up the fairly shallow grade in 2" of snow with shitty all-seasons on. You can't possibly tell me that's driver error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowImg Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 I've watched out of my window as cars couldn't make it up the fairly shallow grade in 2" of snow with shitty all-seasons on. You can't possibly tell me that's driver error. This is surely a solid argument. Can you present: Specifically what all seasons What cars How much tread was left on each tire Tire inflation Driver inputs Grade of hill Speed of vehicles Condition of snow. Also, I do not believe you in the first place. I have made it up "fairly shallow grades" -- arguably "reasonably steep grades" using pure summer tires in more than 2" of snow just by moving a car out of my garage, down the driveway, and back up to the other side. You are making ridiculously generalized statements that nobody can verify or argue. Please stop posting. I can tell you 100% for sure that *I* have first had experience driving: 1999 Subaru Legacy 2.5GT 2003 Subaru Impreza 2.5RS 2008 Subaru Legacy 2.5GT and 2001 Subaru Impreza 2.5RS ALL on RE92s, ALL up and down various grades of hills, ALL in more than 6" of snow, and mix in some ice, in normal traffic conditions, and I have managed to never have an incident or a situation where I was not in control of the vehicle. All of these were done with reasonable tread depth on the RE92s. To be fair, the ones that came on the 08 Legacy probably only got 1 season, they don't have very deep tread from the factory. I think they had like 10/32nds new, and I wouldn't drive in snow/ice under 8/32s. The rest seemed to have significantly deeper tread from the factory and lasted 2-3 seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riptide Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 The Conti DWS seem to get the best score in the snow of any all season on tire rack's website if you go by the surveys they have there. Even tires in the HPAS and GTAS categories - nothing scores as well as they do in the snow. Again, based on the surveys up on tirerack.com. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Clearly you didn't try to get the car started on an icy hill. Again, no matter how skilled you are, if the tires don't stick you're going nowhere. So I'm guessing your on studded tires. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.