First snow, VERY disappointed

[specialB]

Its allllll about the tires. I went two years ago into the first snowfall with my stock RE50A's and it was a nightmare. Slipped on the winter Blizzak LM25's and it was a night and day difference. Winter tires are made for just that, winter. Cold temperatures and slippery conditions. I was doing food delivery my senior year of school last year in upstate new york (lake effect region) during the winter time and we'd regularly see 6+ inches of snow on the ground and she never failed me. I've had the car for three winters now and with even trying I have yet to get the car stuck. I'm talking two feet of snow uphill on a seasonal road, three feet of snow across farm roads sideways completely blind and even around my buddies hilly rutted property in a foot of wet snow in New Hampshire.

 

I love love love the LGT in the snow it blows away my old ram, it handles so predictably and I never feel unconfident. Soo much fun to get on a fully snow covered road and just give it some juice and let her snake her way down the road tearing up the snows.

 

Long story short, get yourself some snow tires and come back and tell us how you like driving in the snow.

[__raj]

Our LGT was excellent in winter in conditions with Nokian WR G2's and okay with the current Conti DWS. The RE92a's were okay for the first 15k-20k in winter but after that feel off pretty flat.

 

Also lack of VDC/traction control vs your 2.5i likely has also makes a difference.

[ssbtech]

You can't blame a Civic for not performing like a Corvette.

 

You wouldn't take a Civic to the track if you were going up against Corvettes. Similarly you shouldn't take the RE92s out in the snow if you expect any safe level of operation from them.

[carguyco]

I haven't had the 92's so I cannot comment, but I can comment on crappy driving.

 

I bought my car just before a winter.....it had new-ish Nankang Sport NS tires on it.

 

Not all season tires....not winter tires....strictly sporty weird tires. I hate them....but...

 

 

I live at 10,000 in altitude....I drove daily at that time to 6000 feet in altitude and back up a fairly steep mountain pass......I also traverse a very steep hill that is about 600 feet long to get to my house...

 

I never slipped going up.....I also didn't slip going down....

 

In fact.....when I hit boost leaving a stop light at a 90 degree turn to get ahead of traffic in snow, slush whatever....the ass end tried to slip out but indeed it would end up tracking back to where it should be.

 

No way the 92s can be worse than these tires in snow....and I felt safe.

 

25k later and it's time for some new tires because they are crap and it is winter again and they look like slicks....even I don't need to take that chance.

 

Drive different in the snow..and you don't need winter tires....are they better, absolutely...I had them on my Honda Accord and loved them....are they a necessity? Not really...and I live in Colorado. I see bad driving daily.....go a little slower, give yourself some room in front to stop.....and don't take corners like you do in summer and you'll be fine, these cars do quite well in the snow on any tires.

[ehsnils]

Drive different in the snow..and you don't need winter tires....are they better, absolutely...I had them on my Honda Accord and loved them....are they a necessity? Not really...and I live in Colorado. I see bad driving daily.....go a little slower, give yourself some room in front to stop.....and don't take corners like you do in summer and you'll be fine, these cars do quite well in the snow on any tires.

 

You would be surprised what you would be able to do with a set of real winter tires on the car then.

[Kodax]

Here is my debate.

 

RE92 cost like $285 bucks per piece and the competition has better tires out there that can beat RE92. I would say RE92 suck because I can get better tires for that price

[BAC5.2]

That's fine when buying a tire. But they are included with the car.

 

So now you are comparing a tire that costs you $0, to something you'd pay for. You can get a better tire for $0?

[BAC5.2]

You wouldn't take a Civic to the track if you were going up against Corvettes. Similarly you shouldn't take the RE92s out in the snow if you expect any safe level of operation from them.

 

But a Civic isn't going to explode, or decide it wants to kill you if you take it to a track.

 

In fact, you could drive it to the track, have fun flinging the car around a little bit, then drive home without a scratch. You shouldn't expect to compete with a Corvette, because the Corvette isn't in your class.

 

The RE92 isn't a winter tire. I never said it was. But at full tread, and up to about 25-30k, it's an admirable all-season in it's category that works just fine in the snow. People hate on it, because they want a scapegoat to excuse their driving.

 

Lets do a case study. You lost complete control of your car going 5mph in a half-inch of snow on full tread RE92's. I drove a 400whp car through an entire winter on exactly the same tire with no issues. How did I do it? Because I chose to drive within the capabilities of the tire. I didn't expect them to perform like a winter tire. I'm not at all sure why you had such problems, but it definitely wasn't the tire.

 

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii287/bac52/5e54e148.jpg

 

To reel us back on topic, to the OP. If the RE92's have more than 25-30k on them, consider picking up a different set of tires more suited to what you want out of the car. The Conti ExtremeContact DWS is popular, but keep in mind that it turns into a DW after a few thousand miles (when the "S" wears off of the tread, you've worn through the designed-for-snow siping on the tire). The Pilot Sport is more expensive, but is a better "long-term" all-season from things I've read. I'll head into this winter with 20k on the Pilot Sports, and I don't expect any issues driving in the snow with them. That said, I'm going to probably run the Conti as my next tire.

 

If it snows a LOT where you are, then consider a set of dedicated snow tires. In any and all winter situations, a snow tire will outperform, or at least perform comparably, to a fresh UHPAS tire. In fact, a proper winter tire will have a much longer high-performance snow usage life than any all-season will, and that will extend the life of both sets of tires.

 

If you go the snow tire route, consider getting the Continental ExtremeContact DW (non-S) as your 3-season. The non-S is a better dry/wet performer than the S-version of the tire is.

[__raj]

You wouldn't take a Civic to the track if you were going up against Corvettes. Similarly you shouldn't take the RE92s out in the snow if you expect any safe level of operation from them.

 

Depends if the the track has snow......Then the challenge of Corvette vs Civic turns to driver skill.

 

Actually a Civic SI with a great driver vs a Corvette with a mediocre driver a dry track it turns interesting.

[ehsnils]

And on gravel road an excess of torque and horsepower is just causing you trouble.

[Kodax]

That's fine when buying a tire. But they are included with the car.

 

So now you are comparing a tire that costs you $0, to something you'd pay for. You can get a better tire for $0?

 

I am trying not to speculate and keeping to the facts.

 

However, I am pretty sure the tires doesn't cost the dealer $0. They probably bought it at some discount since it was bought in a bundle from the manufacturer. The dealer probably also included the cost of the tires into the price of the car. If not, they will be making a loss for selling the car!

[ehsnils]

The tires delivered on the car are mounted at the factory, and it's a bulk deal there with a compromise tire that's good enough for the average person under average conditions.

 

And probably they get the complete wheels in bulk so the factory just mounts them.

[mwiener2]

It's not a compromise, it's a numbers thing. The RE92's are a low rolling resistance tire and Subaru needs every tenth of a MPG it can get.

[hmmrdwn]

Think if Subaru's came stock from the factory with Blizzaks. What would people be saying then? Noisy, won't corner in dry, won't stop in dry, can't handle wet weather, don't last and rides like crap?

 

http://www.tirerack.com/images/tires/bridgestone/bs_blizzak_ws70_ci2_s.jpg

 

What if they put on summer extreme high performance?

 

http://www.tirerack.com/images/tires/bridgestone/bs_potenza_re11_ci2_s.jpg

 

Then people would complain about wet and cold weather performance.

 

Instead Subaru goes with all season tires that satisfy most peoples needs right from the start. At least the potenzas can get you around until you buy other tires.

 

It's always interesting to see people who are accustomed to driving on dry pavement go out during the first snow and slip and slide. Pretty normal to blame something other than yourself. That's expected when you haven't driven in the snow for 8 months.

 

It's also great to hear people who get new tires, say how much better they are then the old ones (comparing a set of brand new tires to ones that had 10, 20, 30K miles on them).

[SWP XT]

Oh they really ARE that BAD!!! The re92s are just horrible at everything. My wife's 08 legacy 2.5i ltd came with some yokohamas that are simply night and day over the re92s. Find a bag of rusty nails and repeatedly drive over them so you can justify replacing the re92 tires. It will be the best thing you ever did for the car. All OEM tires suck in comparison to a real performance or good all season tire but the re92s are the pits!

[dcris]

+1 for DWS's, unless you have the room/cash for dedicated winter setup. I only had one potentially hairy situation during the recent snowstorm, which where I am was bad enough to give us a week without power, but I was able to get out of it unscathed.

[ssbtech]

How did I do it? Because I chose to drive within the capabilities of the tire.

 

When you have to drive so slow to be within the capabilities of the tire that everyone is passing you and giving you dirty looks, you're a danger to other drivers and the tires are to blame.

 

I don't care how much power your car has, when the car plows to the outside of a low-speed turn because the tires had no grip, the only blame that can be put on the driver is for not putting the right tires on the car.

 

 

I didn't expect them to perform like a winter tire.

 

What, you mean like provide safe traction in snow and ice?

[hmmrdwn]

Both these vehicles had the right tires for the conditions:

 

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT-7ZsJuqNv98bWRewM3hyFZsMrWBFEP3TU5IcHCReZaDwd6YeV

 

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTUZ9wfxhCNunTzZjm_TNM12-g_p0Q-XIXQaeiWLpwfEhOvYgI-

[Bbc84]

RE92' come stock on the Yaris and Insight. They shouldnt be on a LGT.

[BAC5.2]

When you have to drive so slow to be within the capabilities of the tire that everyone is passing you and giving you dirty looks, you're a danger to other drivers and the tires are to blame.

 

And yet, that was not the case during my first writer in my OBXT or in my first gen.

 

What, you mean like provide safe traction in snow and ice?

 

I never had any problem. The tires carried me safely without incident. A snow tire would have been better, as a snow tire would be in all snowy conditions, but the RE92 worked perfectly fine for an all-season. They definitely performed better in the summer than a snow tire would have.

 

But, hey, keep making excuses. Clearly you have an axe to grind and nothing I say will curb your crusade. I'm not suggesting that the RE92 is the best tire in the world, nor am I downplaying the usefulness of a snow tire. I'm simply saying that the RE92 is completely undeserving of its common "it sucks" description. Its a great tire.

[ShadowImg]

Agreed on all points. I've driven RE92s in various sizes through several seasons. I've never tossed them out before they were worn out. When I started Autocrossing in 09, I actually put the RE92s on dedicated fall/winter driving duty, and had no issues again through St. Louis & Chicago winters. Know what the last thing my RE92s saw was?

 

http://www.joethorn.net/wp-content/uploads/snowmageddon-2011.jpg

 

They did fine through snowmageddon. No dirty looks, except maybe for the fact that I was actually driving through it while others were stuck.

[SP3C7R3]

+1 Contact DWS. I really hated the RE92s.

[SWP XT]

Ok. Lets just level with each other.

 

RE92's aren't the worst tire in the world. They are far from the best tire as well. I drove my 02 wrx through two sets of them. It definitely makes you drive more responsibily than if you had dedicated summer tires. Subaru elected not to equip the car with dedicated summer tires for one reason or another that we will never know.

 

BAC is right - the tire isn't going to get you killed if you drive the car as a normal car. If you drive it with respect for its handling qualities it will never strand you. I've never gotten stuck in over 45k miles on re92s.

 

Everyone else is also right. The RE92's are no performance tire compared to non OEM choices. For what they cost you would be crazy to buy another set. We as driving enthusiasts push the car to a level beyond what the average buyer would. Therefore we should buy the tires that allow us to drive that way. We don't care as much about road noise, rolling resistance, and treadwear. I buy a tire to enjoy the car as the only thing that touches the road are some very small pieces of rubber.

 

 

So - drive how you want but put the right shoes on the car. The average person does not buy the turbo car to whip around corners and im sure Subaru knows this.

 

 

Drive hard and stay safe!

[ShadowImg]

Actually, we do know why -- mwiener is spot on, they're a very low rolling resistance tire, which steals a couple fractions of a MPG for Subaru who desperately need it with the standards in the US.

[ssbtech]

I never had any problem. The tires carried me safely without incident. A snow tire would have been better, as a snow tire would be in all snowy conditions, but the RE92 worked perfectly fine for an all-season. They definitely performed better in the summer than a snow tire would have.

 

 

My Nokian WR and WRG2's outperformed the RE92 in every condition.

 

They were both better in the wet for cornering and braking, both provided better feel when reaching their limits of grip and were both more controllable when they did start to slide. When the RE92 let go, that was it.

 

Their tread pattern makes for piss poor standing water and slush evacuation, their rounded shoulders make for crappy stability in snow and their stupid 3-season compound gets nice and hard in the winter.

 

So when the WR/WRG2 (which aren't true "snow" tires) ran circles around the RE92 in every condition, you can't possibly tell me that the RE92 is a good tire.

 

But by all means, keep putting the RE92s on a pedestal

 

You may be "fine" driving in a straight line with them thanks to the AWD, but you're driving significantly closer to their limits than you would be at the same speed on a proper set of tires.

 

I'm clearly not the only one who thinks the tires suck:

 

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Bridgestone&tireModel=Potenza+RE92&partnum=145ZR7RE92