BSB legacy Posted June 3, 2011 Author Share Posted June 3, 2011 did anyone install AVO 380 or BNR on JDM 2.0T 5EA/T? What are the results? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 did anyone install AVO 380 or BNR on JDM 2.0T 5EA/T? What are the results? There are not many owners of JDM cars on this forum. I believe you have a twinscroll TD04HLA but you could have a couple of different turbos on your car. Could you post a photo of the stock turbo and intercooler? If you are twinscroll you will need a different header to fit a single-scroll turbo, and you'll need to swap the intercooler or get creative with adapters and pipes. There's another thread on the JDM 2.0 in the turbo powertrain forum. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bugblatterbeast Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 Hey Paul, This might illustrate what you have been trying to point out to everyone. The data is from my temp comp experiments. Same car, same supporting mods, avo380 with tmic, then with fmic. The vertical scale is in g/rev. Data was taken at different temperatures over several months. I didn't get a -20 + fmic point this year though.... was out of the country at the time. it is about 1000ft asl here. If you compare the tmic -10 vs fmic -10 plots, you can see just how much the tmic is holding the turbo back. Also note that the avo380 tmic 20c plot was done at wastegate pressure only. The vf40 plot was taken at temps just above 0. It probably should be noted that this turbo was an early prototype. it had an avo400L sticker on it. I also cut back about half of the turbine and compressor housing bolts. Gee, 1st and 3rd graph were TMIC vs. FMIC. Odd that the one graph where it was FMIC to FMIC, the results were much closer. I wonder why? Regards, Paul Hansen www.avoturboworld.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bugblatterbeast Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 and another thing.... the second dyno plot (posted by sumfoo 1) has the avo380 spooling curiously late. almost as if the tune was using the cobb stage 2 AVCS table rather than one optimized for a 380. when I first played with a 380 I did the same thing. spool up was terrible (and quite similar to that plot) till the avcs table was adjusted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSB legacy Posted June 4, 2011 Author Share Posted June 4, 2011 There are not many owners of JDM cars on this forum. I believe you have a twinscroll TD04HLA but you could have a couple of different turbos on your car. Could you post a photo of the stock turbo and intercooler? If you are twinscroll you will need a different header to fit a single-scroll turbo, and you'll need to swap the intercooler or get creative with adapters and pipes. There's another thread on the JDM 2.0 in the turbo powertrain forum. thanks...ill post my stock turbo later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSB legacy Posted June 6, 2011 Author Share Posted June 6, 2011 somehow i cannot upload the picture to this thread ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeleodee Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 I've heard alot of Avo turbo hate here so i'm interested to see what mine will run. I've got the 450 and going to be running e85 through it. Just waiting on back ordered injectors but I will post results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSB legacy Posted June 7, 2011 Author Share Posted June 7, 2011 Cant wait to see the result...all the best mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 I've heard alot of Avo turbo hate here so i'm interested to see what mine will run. I've got the 450 and going to be running e85 through it. Just waiting on back ordered injectors but I will post results. I don't hate your turbo... I just think it's overpriced. Would someone please help the OP with the info on whether or not this turbo will even fit his car? Pretty pointless discussion (for him) if it doesn't... Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Pointless? I think alot of people would be interested in a quality ball-bearing turbo? *insert BNR fanboy statement here* - Oh wait... The number of BNR failures has me second guessing ... lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Don't buy the AVO380. It's slow to spool for the power you get, and that power is a lot less than AVO claims. The one advantage is has over the other bolt-ons is the BB cartridge. It will last basically forever. IMO, not worth it. HKS downpipe is nice but overpriced for what it is. Keep on shopping. What is your power target and how much are you willing to spend on supporting mods? Recommend you read the BNR bolt-up turbo thread in the turbo powertrain forum. Really Keep in mind most people including myself DYNOED on a LOWER READING MUSTANG DYNO and are using LGT TMIC. NOT a FMIC. Video below is on an STI with a large TMIC, and conservative off the shelf map/tune. FMIC would yield more.... Contrary to common believe because ALMOST ALL the AVO380's were tuned with a TMIC, this turbo is very similar to a 20g but Ball Bearing. Not to mention AGAIN this is on a mustang dyno, some report they read 10% lower than the dynojet http://gallery.me.com/gregnauman/100026/Work-20151/web.jpg? [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJa_0gT6HAg&feature=player_embedded]YouTube - RalliTEK Stage3 Kit R&D[/ame] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legend Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 ^^ Don't know about the mods on that plot or a baseline but that really looks pretty darn good. My '05 LGT My '07 Supercharged Shelby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 I don't hate your turbo... I just think it's overpriced. Would someone please help the OP with the info on whether or not this turbo will even fit his car? Pretty pointless discussion (for him) if it doesn't... You mean like this one from Deadbolt: TD06H-20G - $1795.00 + shipping VS. AVO380 LGT Ball-bearing Turbo $1,849.00 + shipping If its LGT fitment its going to be expensive no matter what you buy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Its not that spool is that bad, its that there is IMO an excessive amount of lag for the amount of power made. And its $2k Example:http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1867573&highlight=avo380 It barely makes more than a Stage 2 STi with more lag, on pump. You people need to do some research, you obviously do not know what your talking about. Are there newer turbos that spool faster and put down more like the HTA68 yes. Newer comp wheel and 47LB turbo as opposed to 44. There are NUMEROUS versions and two main versions of the 20G. I have seen the AVO380 put down as much as a 20g when EXACT comparisons are done on similar DYNOS, not some airboy spreadsheet. Above video from Tim Bailey proves that. Mustang dyno STI TMIC 375/430 people were saying what you are saying in this thread but they were never comparing like cars with like cars on same dyno, only difference being the turbo..... http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/avo-420-380-dyno-graphs-logs-discussion-p2168351.html#post2168351 Plus on top of that it is an LGT fitment turbo. Most early tunes done with 20g for example were ALL FMIC because they were STI fitment. MOST ALL the tunes of the 380 have been the dinky LGT FMIC, like mine and I still put down 350/373 on E85 with a good tuner on a MUSTANG LOWER READING DYNO Its all about intercooling, FUEL, FUEL, FUEL, the tuner, and the dyno you are on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Odd, doesn't the writer of that post say: "The bad news with this was the 93 Shell Texas gas was CRAP! Calvin even asked where did you get this gas. So the first disappointment was I somehow got some crappy gas and he could not get it to not knock without pulling the timing." Not sure that's the greatest link to support your opinion. ding ding ding we have a winner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 EFR is going to come in around this price point too... far more bang for your buck. I'd still like to hear from the OP what his power target is and how much he wants to spend in total... turbo plus supporting mods. For sure he could get a lot more supporting parts by NOT buying the AVO380! http://efilogics.com/dyno/graph.php?gb=0&hp=1&torque=1&boost=1&rpm=1&sl=1&sln=1&runid1=517&rgb1=000000255&runid2=627&rgb2=204000000&runid3=695&rgb3=000153000 Nothing to brag about on this plots... certainly not at that price. 2 LGT TMIC, and one FMIC with no idea what fuel he was running Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 And a SMALLLLLLLL TMIC at that, no where close to the STI TMIC or a FMIC The problem is that most people use the 380 with a TMIC, a bottleneck which limits nearly every turbocharger to 320whp. Rallitek and Surgeline saw 360whp at 22psi with a fmic and 380, and it's got a bit more in it in terms of boost. Regards, Paul Hansen http://www.avoturboworld.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 When I get my built motor in the car later this year, a FMIC installed and up the boost to more than 21 PSI, Ill be sure to post the results...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Now could you guys help the original OP, Hell the second post was bashing the AVO380, not answering his questions at all...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 When I get my built motor in the car later this year, a FMIC installed and up the boost to more than 21 PSI, Ill be sure to post the results...... Yeah, because running an FMIC with a turbo who's reason for existence is to bolt up to a stock location TMIC makes so much sense. I understand you'd get defensive about a turbo you'd spent that much money on... so would I. Let your dyno numbers speak for themselves. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Lets see, I see the sarcasm in your post.... so lets try to answer that..... yes it does make sense if you do not want to, or hadn't planned on changing out the intake manifold for STI style, or you have a new WRX with same style turbo or if you purchased your turbo and planned on staying TMIC....... At the time the AVO turbos were the only stock location turbos on the market for the LGT. Interesting now that the WRX is out with the same setup, BNR and everyone else is making the LGT style turbos and companies are making FMIC to go with them...... I guess that is dumb and they are not making any money.... Cause we know that EVERYONE wants to swap their intake manifold for the STI style...Right??? I would correct you by saying that the reason for existence is due to the intake more than the Intercooler. Any more intelligent comments????? I like your "location" its fitting from the second post of this thread you have started into bashin the AVO380 without any real knowledge of the subject........so can you answer the OP yet??? Im not trying to be a jerk here it just seems you have offered nothing to the OP, and I guess consider anyone with a AVO380 or thinking about one is well just plain stupid. I for one disagree...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Post number 2, NUMBER 2 WOW!! Don't buy the AVO380. It's slow to spool for the power you get, and that power is a lot less than AVO claims. The one advantage is has over the other bolt-ons is the BB cartridge. It will last basically forever. IMO, not worth it. HKS downpipe is nice but overpriced for what it is. Keep on shopping. What is your power target and how much are you willing to spend on supporting mods? Recommend you read the BNR bolt-up turbo thread in the turbo powertrain forum. A lot less than AVO claims.....interesting False advertising I guess. At least you got the BB part correct! Ding Ding Ding Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 from the second post of this thread you have started into bashin the AVO380 without any real knowledge of the subject........so can you answer the OP yet??? Yes I was being a little sarcastic, but that doesn't beget rudeness. Well that's funny you mention the OP, because until I went and dug up another of his threads, no-one knew he was in a JDM car that probably had a fitment issue. I see very clearly the spin you're attempting here: Criticizing your precious high-dollar turbo is bashing. Attempting to introduce a build around the turbo in which it might face the cheaper competition is leveling the playing field. When this doesn't quite work out, you want to divert back to the question I in fact raised, which is whether or not your favorite turbo will fit the OP's car. If your AVO isn't shining with a TMIC in place then why push it on the OP who is obviously looking for something that bolts up? IIWY I'd leave the marketing to Paul as he probably knows what to claim and what not to. I was really hoping he'd actually answer this question about fitment since he has so much knowledge of JDM cars but he hasn't seen fit to do anymore than market the turbo. Of course if you want to carry on raving about a turbo that very likely doesn't fit the OP's car then feel free to do so. I just don't see how it helps the OP any. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apexjapan Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 I already answered the OP in pm, as the thread has gone so far off track, the train pretty much missed the station and hit Nebraska. All JDM cars from 2004 upward use a twinscroll turbocharger, which has a exhaust manifold, uppipe, downpipe, and TMIC that are unique to it. So to bolt a 380 or any other turbocharger on the car, the OP will need to replace all those parts at the same time. We've got a conversion kit that minimizes the amount of parts that need to be replaced in the Japanese market. Regards, Paul Hansen http://www.avoturboworld.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 I already answered the OP in pm, as the thread has gone so far off track, the train pretty much missed the station and hit Nebraska. If you'd mentioned this at the time, so others could benefit from the info, I'd have dropped the subject right there. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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