RaceComp Engineering Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 What do you think about Öhlins? http://www.roadandtrackbyohlins.com/en/product-range/ They seem to have a kit "SUS MI00", so they have at least considered the Legacy. But they will probably have to modify it for the '10. Nope. Front height is different, rear is very different. IF someone tries this it wont be a good result. Mw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leggy10 Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 how did testing go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 I have just spent 72hrs in a 2010 Legacy GT( 6speed). Thanks Jeff N. First impressions were more relaxed than when I drove the car at my wife’s dealership. Knowing I had some time in the car I decided to be open minded, and let it impress me. The car grows on you for sure. The first feeling you get is one of large platform, not as heavy as it "feels" looking out over a hood that "seems" long, but actually isnt. The bottom line is the car has tons of potential. Front suspension is loosely based on the GH Impreza with 5x100 hubs and a new designed front sub frame that has the sway bar mounts ABOVE the sub frame instead of below it. Sedans get a 23mm front sway while Wagons get a 24mm sway. 3.6 Sedans get the 24mm front. Looks like the Whiteline ALK( caster bushings) will work from the previous Leg and the current Impreza( GH). The car when driven spiritedly, wants to push a little, but then HOOKs in and really takes, but that requires some commitment from the driver. So as usual the car in the hands of a good driver will work well. No commitment and the front will just push, which is the typical factory engineered " cant let a novice have too much fun safety factor" that is designed into the handling. Mid corner lift near the limit only results in a neutral feeling of...." ok, so I wont die" type feeling( which is good). This will change in favor of the enthusiast with a thicker rear bar and that is what is needed for the car to handle better. ( of course keeping it safe, but increasing feel and decreasing body roll). The Hummer like ride height is simply due to the car being larger than the previous car which had a wedge type shape. The new car has more of a Camry, tall, feeling ( stock) and has alot of pitch and roll. But here is where it gets touchy. This car is limited on travel like the previous Legacy. It has 12mm more front travel than the previous, BUT the wheel well openings are ROUND( in case you hadn’t noticed) and this gives an illusion of even more HUMMER like height. So while our eyes say.....LOWER ME FOR THE LOVE OF GOD !! .....alot of design discretion needs to be used here if the car is retain good functionality. Sure if you want it to look kool.....then the springs that some will make will be great and lower the car 1.5 inches or more...but that WILL put the car on the bump stops when not moving. The issue there in my opinion is the choice of these HUGE wheel wells and the smallish 18inch wheel choice. 19's on this car will look like 18's on the previous model. So 19's and a conservative drop will be the ticket. This car also wont want short side walls either. 19’s with a decent conservative sidewall will work well. Rear suspension is IDENTICAL to the GH Impreza. Sway bar rear shocks, mounting points, dimensions etc. Newer version of a good multilink, but with a hair less travel than previous gen. So Subaru is opting for better handling of the stock platform and limiting the amount of lowering that can be done. To m this spells mainstream audience/buyer attempt. But that’s debate for another day. The rear works well on this car. You can feel the rear has TONS of grip and the reduced overall travel doesn’t become obvious in the stock car, unless you have a full tank and two 250 lbs people in the back seat over the very rare type of large dips. So some of you know that if you lower this car too much…..then bump stop engagement will be happen often. One thing that is noticable right away is that Subaru learned from the past. They have made the natural rear ride height taller by 8mm than the front and from the previous model. This is awesome because when we filled the tank, had our test springs in the trunk 80 lbs for 2 sets and two 250 lbs adults....the car was level !! The previos generation car would be on the bump stops almost. The shocks seem to be valved very mildly. Again…if spring companies make a 1.0 or lower spring for this car and only raise the rates a hair…..you will have an intimate relationship with your bump stops ! I have a new set on the way and will dyno those to see how much of a ceiling there is for rate increase. Do to the new locations of various parts under the car the front sway bar has room for a major increase…but I don’t think that’s the way to go. I think this car will greatly benefit from a good rear bar to make it very neutral. We did confirm our new GR/GH( STI and WRX) chassis REAR 25.5mm hollow sway bar will fit this car. As does our new TARMAC 2 coilovers as well. Overall I really like this new car. I feel it has potential. Once you get over its much larger visual size…it starts to grow on you. It needs some type of trunk deck flat style spoiler to make the trunk longer. Good brake pads, lines and fluid would help pedal feel which is a bit spongy yet fitting for the way the car is stock. But once you do some springs and a sway bar, I think most of us would want a tighter pedal.My son who is almost 10, after about 1 mile said..." so will you do springs or shocks to this car dad..." I asked him why?..and he said..." well with the soft interior it doesnt need much to be better,just stop it from leaning so much...".The leather interior is very supple and could be paired with an Alcantara steering wheel for a more Euro feel. Knowing the owners last car, I know he will agree with me too ! Thanks to Jeff N. from Virginia for letting us use his car to do our measurements for future projects. Our plans were to install our existing 08 STI Regular guy springs but we have to make a special front spring for the 10 Leg. Wont be long. Myles Williams RCE http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs112.snc3/15943_177692579222_59572734222_2735757_8038907_n.jpg http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs092.snc3/15943_177616464222_59572734222_2735386_6737973_n.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ride Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Excellent write up. Thanks for posting this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 Do I need to make a road trip once my T2's come in? Will have your coils assembled tomorrow and boxed up. fedex should get to you by Sat ! Myles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legacy360 Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 How much, if any, will the coilovers affect overall ride height? Is the pic of the car you posted with them installed? Bryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rutchard Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Will have your coils assembled tomorrow and boxed up. fedex should get to you by Sat ! Myles yay! Hopefully the weather will cooperate with me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuBiElOvEr Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 my BC Coil-overs are going in this weekend. I'll post up some more pics and info on lowering and overall feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 How much, if any, will the coilovers affect overall ride height? Is the pic of the car you posted with them installed? Bryan Nope, pic is NOT with coilovers installed. We installed 1 rear to gauge ride height for future settings. We have enough travel in the Kw's to get within 10mm of stock ride height. Myles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 my BC Coil-overs are going in this weekend. I'll post up some more pics and info on lowering and overall feel. are you going to slamm it? Front stock ride height from ground to center of fender on a GT is 27.5, rear is 27.75....... Curious to see how low you go. I ask because its hard to resist the urge to make the car look visually better. Most coilovers with the JDM style "collar" normally.......cant come close to stock ride height since they use a shorter shock body with the collar. Post pics when you get them. Myles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legacy360 Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Nope, pic is NOT with coilovers installed. We installed 1 rear to gauge ride height for future settings. We have enough travel in the Kw's to get within 10mm of stock ride height. Myles Alright, thanks. I thought that it didn't look any lower than stock I know you mentioned that the coilovers from the 08+ WRX & the STi will fit the new leggy. But when I look on your website, RCE division, the Tarmac 2's come in two variations. The Clubsport, for the STi, which are about $2,300 and the normal, for the WRX, which are about $1,900. I'm guessing the ones you test fit in the rear are the ones for the WRX? Bryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leggy10 Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 so whats the verdict on the shocks than? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuBiElOvEr Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 i'd like to start out at a .5 in drop and take it from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 Alright, thanks. I thought that it didn't look any lower than stock I know you mentioned that the coilovers from the 08+ WRX & the STi will fit the new leggy. But when I look on your website, RCE division, the Tarmac 2's come in two variations. The Clubsport, for the STi, which are about $2,300 and the normal, for the WRX, which are about $1,900. I'm guessing the ones you test fit in the rear are the ones for the WRX? Bryan correct. The STI version WONT fit. WRX version WILL fit. Myles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 so whats the verdict on the shocks than? testing soon. Once I knew the Regular Guy springs wouldnt fit the front I wasnt going to hold the car up. Plus I am testing 3.6 shocks and GT shocks at the same time. Its alot of work to do the fronts as our ROEHRIG shock dyno doesnt have the attachments for OEm perches and so I have to cut the front perch off. Takes an hour on each perch. Gauging feel?......better than Impreza and not as good as STI. So some rate increase, but not alot. Will still allow for a handling improvement, but not the way our springs are on the STI. Myles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 i'd like to start out at a .5 in drop and take it from there. yeah, well it goes south from there....literally ! Mw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuBiElOvEr Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Ok..... so in the middle of this install...... 2008 WRX top mount bolt pattern is different. This is not a bolt on install right now. I will post all the info later on tonight with PICS..... Alex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rutchard Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 the front? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuBiElOvEr Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 yes... front only. rears dropped right in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rutchard Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Word, I'm still waiting for FedEx to show up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted November 22, 2009 Author Share Posted November 22, 2009 Ok..... so in the middle of this install...... 2008 WRX top mount bolt pattern is different. This is not a bolt on install right now. I will post all the info later on tonight with PICS..... Alex. Yeah that was the benefit of getting a car in the shop to test and measure and see the differences. Myles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuBiElOvEr Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Myles, a little heads up would have been cool. Your post says that your Tarmac coil-overs fit but you never mentioned the top hats.... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted November 23, 2009 Author Share Posted November 23, 2009 Myles, a little heads up would have been cool. Your post says that your Tarmac coil-overs fit but you never mentioned the top hats.... ? Uhhhh.......are you serious? How am I to know that whomever and what ever brand you have didnt know that? Not being a dick about it...but is that my responsibility? If you search between Nasioc, IWSTI, 2.5 RS and this forum we spend ALOT of time sharing info on what fits and what doesnt. Hell...we even have a full thread on nasioc just for that. Its a new car and there is alot of development work to be done. Alot of assumptions have been made by alot of manufactures and its not until you get under the car that one would see some things. Myles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
808LGT Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 k i'm a new owner of the 2010 GT premium coming from a 2005 GT unlimited... from what i've read so far, and from test driving the car (its being prepped ready on tuesday for pick up) it is on the softer side of a ride but can be pushed and not have to worry about losing grip (salesman was a friend so he let me go off in it) i fell in love with the car, immediately after that, it may be bigger but that's not necessarily a bad thing...which brings me to my question i live in a hawaii and changing ride height would require me to get recon for it and our roads just plain suck too, so not looking to change that anytime soon but i'm wondering if you'll engineer a front sway bar also to complement the rear? and imo anything that would stiffen the chassis further than the stock would be well in vested with the new legacy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuBiElOvEr Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Uhhhh.......are you serious? How am I to know that whomever and what ever brand you have didnt know that? Not being a dick about it...but is that my responsibility? If you search between Nasioc, IWSTI, 2.5 RS and this forum we spend ALOT of time sharing info on what fits and what doesnt. Hell...we even have a full thread on nasioc just for that. Its a new car and there is alot of development work to be done. Alot of assumptions have been made by alot of manufactures and its not until you get under the car that one would see some things. Myles Myles, excuse my tone. Comment really wasn't meant to be taken seriously. I wasn't being a dick at all. Alex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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