LegacyGT 05 Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Name: Howard Make: 05 Legacy GT wagon Mileage: 27,000 ish (on 4th turbo Time Out Of Use: about 40 days total, but that included the engine Problem And Likely Cause: first one, no idea. The rest, dealer incompetence Modifications: none affecting drivetrain Submitted For Warranty Work (Yes/No): yes Reason Given For Denial (if applicable): approved Your Story: I posted this when it happen about 18 months ago, but will recap here. I don't frequent the boards here much at all, but if someone might be able to do something with this I'll throw my info in. If you need to contact me for more info feel free to email me through the forums. In March 07 I was on the way to work and it starting sounding a lot like popcorn - I thought I had a bag or something caught in the intake. I stopped, and checked, but could find no problem. Started up and within 2 miles the turbo died (I have a boost guage and as it would not go out of negative it was a good indicator . It was towed to a dealer and they found the turbo died and they would replace it under warranty (I was pleased as I had seen many cases where they wouldn't at the time). A week later I pickup my car - the new turbo starts making noise so I turn around (got all of 1 mile tops). A tech took it out and it died. They gave me a loaner and I got the car a week later. It was fine for a week. The following week the car died again and I thought it was turbo. Towed to Kennedy Subaru in Plymouth Meeting, PA (mentioning them as they are horrible!). The engine was dead. It took almost 5 weeks to replace. The week I was supposed to pick up the car, I got a call that the technician working on the car stuck his had, accidentally in the drive belt - he heard a noise and took the cover off while the car was running, and stuck his hand it to see if anything was loose. I believe they now call him lefty. I know people make mistakes, but any sane mechanic wouldn't be that absurd. Anyway, the told me the problem, attempted to finish the job and had to replace the turbo yet again as they felt that was making the noise after the new engine was put in. I got the car and the engine/turbo has been fine since. On a side note - to explain my comments about Kennedy Subaru. They damaged my front end, refused to admit it, and only offered to give me $300 on a $700 repair. I had no choice, but certainly won't be back. Then, 3000 miles later my clutch dies. Took it to another dealer and they gave me crap saying "if you abused it, we'll know...." and such as they gave me a loaner. They called the next day and didn't even hint at anything I did. Cause? Kennedy Subaru reassembled the cluch, most likely, with an impact gun. The clutch was on way too tight - they had to drill the bolts out as they couldn't remove them. So far it has been running fine, but I have a hard time really trusting it. Theoretically, I should have an extra 30k miles on the car as at 27k I got the engine and turbo replaced and at 30k the clutch. So far a 45k its still running well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniStiGuy Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Sounds to me like the main failure here isn't subaru's in general its the people that put them together and fix them that cause most of these issues. OEM HID's Rx330 Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPU1 Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I just registered for my.subaru.com and on my home page there is a link to "Caring for Turbocharged Subaru Engines"... in this pdf it clearly states the oil change interval is 3,750 miles under normal driving conditions. it also says that if attending a "track day" the old should be changed before and after such an event. guess this issue is plagues them still and to cover their asses they are creating more strict maintenence guidelines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krzyss Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 The way they word it it seems like suggestion not requirement (at least 2005).Probably afraid of lawsuit. Krzys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Code Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 44k and mine went last night. Hauled it to the dealership today. "Striving to better, oft we mar what's well." - Bill Shakespeare - car modder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubiGT Posted October 10, 2008 Share Posted October 10, 2008 44k and mine went last night. Hauled it to the dealership today. Deets? Mods? Many Shuvs and Zuuls knew what it was to be roasted in the depths of the Slor that day, I can tell you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedHorizon Posted October 14, 2008 Share Posted October 14, 2008 I was wondering after hearing about everyone’s problem and the dealerships and SOA not honoring the power train warranty because of lack of service records, receipts etc; would I have less of a problem since I bought an extend warranty from a non-Subaru party? On my warranty papers it says my car can be taken to any dealership or garage as long as they are ASE certified. I have changed my oil every 4,000 miles and I have about 34k but I do not have receipts. Moreover, I bought the car from a dealership with about 30k on it; does this mean I only have to worry about service records since I purchased the car for work to be covered under my warranty? If I were to start keeping receipts and or having the dealer change my oil will I be good if something were to happen in the future? Thanks for the help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYtoVT Posted October 14, 2008 Share Posted October 14, 2008 I'm curious to know if there is a relevance factored in of OE catted uppipe and aftermarket non catted uppipes of the blown turbos; knowing that the cats in OE uppipes deteriorate after time. Is my chances of not blowing the turbo improved by having an aftermarket uppipe? *no, I didn't read through the whole thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniStiGuy Posted October 14, 2008 Share Posted October 14, 2008 having a blown turbo due to lack of lubrication is totally different then having it fail due to a up-pipe cat deterioration. to answer RedHorizons question: You must have ALL service records since your time of purchase of the vehicle and the vehicle must not show signs of neglect or abuse for warranty to even be considered. OEM HID's Rx330 Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjundi Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 44k and mine went last night. Hauled it to the dealership today. How do you know it blew? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Code Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Update to my earlier post: Twelve days ago the turbo failed. Drove the car home about 4 miles and had it flatbedded to the dealership. They call the following monday and tell me that the turbo failed due to lack of oil. I had just checked it two days earlier when I got home from a long road-trip, it was a little low so I topped it off. The service manager tells me that he would like to see maint. records. I just bought the car in April so I provide a reciept for the only oil change that I have ever done on the car. Tell him that the dealership serviced the vehicle when I bought it. Outside of that I have no knowledge of the maintainence records. A few days later he calls and tells me that SOA is going to cover the repairs as a warranty claim. The car will be done asap but they are waiting on parts...a shortblock and heads...the turbo is in stock As of right now the service mgr. says it could be another week until its done, but they are giving me a loaner tomorrow. I feel lucky. "Striving to better, oft we mar what's well." - Bill Shakespeare - car modder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubiGT Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Good for you. I'm at 59,900miles, so I'll get to upgrade myself when the stocker goes:) Many Shuvs and Zuuls knew what it was to be roasted in the depths of the Slor that day, I can tell you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackwave Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Name: Make: 2005 Legacy GT Wagon Limited Mileage: 58,000 Time Out Of Use: 1 month Problem And Likely Cause: Lack of Oil Modifications: None Submitted For Warranty Work (Yes/No): Yes Reason Given For Denial (if applicable): initially, no maintenance records. Your Story: I battled with Subaru to have them cover the repair since it was in fact under warranty and the mechanic had resonable doubt that the busted turbo shaft and lack of oil could have been related to the broken shaft at freeway speeds...they warratied the turbo but CURRENTLY less than 8 months after the warranty my motor blew due to a whacky turbo installation. They are denying warranty and service related to the turbo. They quoted me 8,000 for a motor repair. I just bought the car as the second owner and it's been terrible. Two of the worst possible repairs in just 18 months of ownership. I bought it from the dealer ship. What a joke. Currently the car is in the parking lot at the Reno dealership where I am waiting to decide what to do with it. I owe 11K on it. If anyone wants a wagon parts car pm me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Code Posted October 31, 2008 Share Posted October 31, 2008 I got my car back yesterday! New motor and turbo on warranty. I had them replace the clutch/throwout bearing and timing belt. soooo I guess we'll see how it holds up. "Striving to better, oft we mar what's well." - Bill Shakespeare - car modder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjundi Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 I got my car back yesterday! New motor and turbo on warranty. I had them replace the clutch/throwout bearing and timing belt. soooo I guess we'll see how it holds up. Maybe stupid question from me, but why a new timing belt if you got a new motor. Doesn't a new motor include the timing belt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
friviz68 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 when i had my turbo and new motor,subaru wouldnt cover my belt i had to pay for it .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeAldea Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 I wonder if this also awaits Subaru http://www.shulaw.com/documents/complaints/VW-Audi%20Complaint.pdf They accuse VW/Audi for: 1. Making engine with not big enough oil capacity 2. Underspecifying oil 3. Increasing maintenance burden on owners ("9. The modified oil maintenance recommendations for class vehicles impose more burdensome and costly maintenance than those set forth in the owner’s manuals and/or maintenance booklets for class vehicles supplied by Defendants.") 5% failure rate (so far) is dangerous rate. I expect removal of Subaru turbocharged cars from recommended list of Consumer Report vehicles (if anybody here cares). Krzys PS There could be design issue with oil pick up tube too. After reading so many pages of this thread, it sounds like the owners who have had their turbos fail should be contacting the lawyers handling the VW/Audi case and see if they are interested in starting a class action against Subaru. If the action is won the owners might be compensated for their expenses when their Turbos failed and the rest of us might get some further protection against having to assume the cost if ours fail in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniStiGuy Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 well my turbo luckily didn't fail but the oil return line was busted and had a hole in it. currently I have to go back every 1000 miles to have everything looked over again, and again so they can be sure everything is ok. OEM HID's Rx330 Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spec B Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 Just read through the whole thread..sigh. I think mine is on it's way out. My turbo just started whining (Dentist drill sound) while under boost, performance has not been affected at all..just noise. Pulled the DP and everything looked fine (no shaft play, no oil leaks, turbine spins freely). Anyone have the dreaded dentist drill sound before the turbo died? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniStiGuy Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 dentist drill is more of an up-pipe leak. OEM HID's Rx330 Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spec B Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 I hope so..I will have to check. The sound is only under boost..nothing under vac. A lot of folks on the forum are telling me the turbo is on it's way out. The odd thing is that I cannot find anyone who had the noise before their turbo actually died. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeAldea Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 <snip> Subaru turbocharged engines suffer from a starvation of oil, which results in a turbocharger failure, due to a oil filter screen built into the factory oil feed banjo bolt at the cylinder head. More information on this can be found at http://store.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=Info_SubaruOil or you can reference supporting Subaru documentation with bulletin number 02-103-07 which was released on 10/19/2007. I believe this to be the manufactured defect that lead to a mechanical failure in the turbo. <snip> I went to my local (Liberty Subaru) dealer's Quick Service center on Saturday to get my first oil change since buying my 2005 Legacy 2.5 GT. I brought a copy of Subaru Service Bulletin #02-103-07 - Turbo Oil Supply Screen which is available at the above referenced link plus Forced Performance's write up. I asked for them to show me exactly where the banjo bolt is for future reference and to be sure to pull the bolt to examine the screen. Well even though the Service Bulletin is a year old they had never checked the banjo bolt mesh screen before when doing an oil change on a turbo and it took them over 30 minutes to admit that they couldn't find it. They said I would have to make an appointment with the main service department to have them examine the mesh screen. But they still wanted to do my oil change. I thanked them and said no I'd have the main service dept do all the work at the same time. So much for the convenience of quick service without an appointment. I then went to the main service dept and made my appointment. They at least were familiar with the banjo bolt and the service bulletin. They said the banjo bolt on the rear of the cylinder head is not easily accessible and is not checked as part of an oil change unless requested by the vehicle owner. Which I guess means I'm going to have to pay a sizeable labor charge for them to pull the bolt and inspect it when they do the oil change. I mentioned to the mechanic that Forced Performance recommends leaving the mesh screen out of the banjo bolt. He pointed out then you have no protection from larger particulate getting into the turbo to do damage. Of course if that particulate clogs the screen and starves the turbo of oil it really won't make a difference. I'm thinking leaving the screen out is the way to go then at least I won't have to worry about whether it was inspected each time the oil is changed. I wonder if most other dealer service depts despite the service bulletin never check the banjo bolt mesh screen when they do oil changes? How about everyone here, are you inspecting the banjo bolt screen when you do oil changes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NatesGr8 Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 i have no banjo bolt screens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniStiGuy Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 I think the dealer here never checks these. I'll be bringing the tsb with me this next time OEM HID's Rx330 Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AirSix Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 I brought the same TSB to my local dealer and asked them to check the screen. I counted at least 20 seconds of blank stares. I was told when I picked the car up that they inspected it but there was nothing indicated as such on the invoice so I'm sure they did not do it. Between this turbo fiasco and the inferior TOB issues in the 5MT I'm losing faith in SOA's owner care. I tell myself that an N/A Forester is just an STI without all the fluff like, power, handling, style, racing heritage, and curb appeal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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