Joon525 Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 Does anyone else think there's some flawed logic in the removal of these filters? I think you're f*cked either way if debris comes into play?? Scenario A: Remove the filter You remove the filter and some debris somehow makes its way into the line. This debris will eventuall make it to your turbo's CHRA at which point it can't be good. Scenario B: Leave the filter You leave the filter in place and some debris somehow makes its way into the line. This debris then clogs the line and IF it's clogged enough will now starve your turbo of oil. I would think that if you removed the filter it would just allow more contaminants than normal into the CHRA. At this point I think I'm leaving mine in place. I'll check on them at the 50K mile mark and maybe replace them then. For the people that had their turbo's fail...Where did the material that clogged up the filter come from? Wouldn't you want to know that? I doubt it's just normal debris since there are other LGT owners without a blown turbo (or two). Otherwise, you get a new turbo, no filter and the root cause is still untouched. Just thinking out loud here. I'm not really trying to say anyone's right or wrong for removing them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted May 15, 2007 Author Share Posted May 15, 2007 I do not believe that you can buy the filter separately I think that the part number for the Banjo Bolt WITH filter is 14445AA090. Once I know for sure and find the part number for the banjo bolt WITHOUT a filter I will update the first post of this thread. Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rc0032 Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 Is the filter cleanable with a solvent? I would think you would want to check it every other oil change Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2005garnetGT Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 I do not believe that you can buy the filter separately I think that the part number for the Banjo Bolt WITH filter is 14445AA090. Once I know for sure and find the part number for the banjo bolt WITHOUT a filter I will update the first post of this thread. I bet mcmaster has it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeeeeeYa Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 Is the filter cleanable with a solvent? I would think you would want to check it every other oil change Laughter, indeed... This had to be one of the most frustrating things I've ever done on this car, and I have done a bunch. I couldn't take it another post, so I went at it. Yes, filter was there. It didn't go as rao described, tool wise, no socket and wrench was going to work on that banjo bolt, the turbo was in the way; boxends for me. To get the bolt out past the turbo I had to move the oil line a little (which later caused a slight misalignment and made getting the bolt back in with the tips of the fingers on one hand...difficult). Inspection showed my screen nice and clean, but further scrutiny and flushing onto a paper towel revealed a few tiny, ferrous, particles. The filter had trapped them doing its job. I put the filter back. I use synthetic and the screen was working. However, it is now on my maintenance list. But definitely NOT every other oil change. At 47k with my anal oil changing it was still ok, it will wait until I get a BB turbo. What was so damned frustrating?? Getting that copper gasket (that dropped the first time into the towel I'd placed on the up pipe to catch any oil) back in place and getting the bolt through it. I dropped it several times before finally succeeding. My forearms are chewed up, I'm still concerned, and I had to choose between taking it out and putting it back, BOTH with issues! So that I don't suffer from mechanicus interuptus I am now going to change my oil and filter..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted May 15, 2007 Author Share Posted May 15, 2007 You can't use a socket on the banjo bolt - that's what the 17mm stubby wrench is for Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeeeeeYa Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 You can't use a socket on the banjo bolt - that's what the 17mm stubby wrench is for Dang, in my haste (gotta blame something ) I read "shorty socket" which DID make me wonder. Thanks, rao, for your input. Previous information was .......... well, at least we now know for certain. Good work! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeeeeeYa Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 I do not believe that you can buy the filter separately I think that the part number for the Banjo Bolt WITH filter is 14445AA090. Once I know for sure and find the part number for the banjo bolt WITHOUT a filter I will update the first post of this thread. Is this it? http://scoobymods.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=4272&d=1131460148 Seems odd that Subaru would find this a problem in what seems ALL BUT the Legacy GT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted May 15, 2007 Author Share Posted May 15, 2007 ^^^^^ Those are different filters that were located at the other end of the oil pipes. Those filters were never installed in any Legacys. That TSB lead to a lot of confusion. Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REM87O Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 So RAO do you have any other wide angle shots of the banjo bolts I should be checking? I assumed it was the same as that TSB that Seeyaaa just posted. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted May 15, 2007 Author Share Posted May 15, 2007 So RAO do you have any other wide angle shots of the banjo bolts I should be checking? I assumed it was the same as that TSB that Seeyaaa just posted. Thanks! I don't - I couldn't get a good picture of it in the car. It is NOT what is shown in the TSB. Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pillboy Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 I'm just gonna keep changing my synthetic every 3000 miles and maybe find religion. Thanks for the write-up rao. It is still ugly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balrock Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=36949&d=1179018790 here is a picture of where it is located Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeeeeeYa Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 http://scoobymods.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5782 Here is the thread where I found that TSB. Now that you mention it, while the filter looks like the same filter, the banjo bolt does look different from the one I took out this morning. This information was posted some time back when the turbo-oiling issue first came up. Whatever, due to rao's initiative which I can verify, we now know conclusively that our Legacy's have these filters. While a true PITA to check these little buggers should be on our maintenance radar. Although I haven't read everything everywhere concerning failed stock turbos, some were in unmodded cars using non-synthetic oil. We already know those oils can coke in high heat, i.e., turbo applications. Synthetic oils have been in my cars for over twenty years and has saved me at least one Suby motor. Why anyone uses anything else is beyond me. Now, while I have verified my filter is clean I am uncertain if I should leave it in or take it out permanently. In that TSB Subaru apparently thought it was more trouble than it was worth relative to the AVCS system. It would be nice to have an official decision specific to the turbo oiling system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeeeeeYa Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 So RAO do you have any other wide angle shots of the banjo bolts I should be checking? I assumed it was the same as that TSB that Seeyaaa just posted. Thanks! You really don't need more than rao provided. Just follow the oil line and there it is.........hidden under that bracket, tucked away where you will need the tools he specified. That magnet on a wand became a third hand Also, put a towel beneath the bolt over the uppipe to catch oil drops, or in my case the copper gasket behind the fitting. You lose that and you are SOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REM87O Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 Ok, so just follow the hard line from that location to the top of the turbo? Thanks for the pics balrock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAMMER DOWN Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 How does one change an oil filter twice as often as the oil... top it off? Yep, fill oil filter, top the oil to the dipstick shows full. This takes around 1\2 a qt. of oil. most filter are only rated for 3k. I could buy 2 Fram oil filters cheaper then I can buy Mobil1 Extended service filter. Now I use Amsoil & filter every 15k. With 2 Subbies to take care of. I cut my oil change in half. Mileage:331487 Retired/Sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobY Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 Ooh I wouldent go with Fram... Fram is pretty much synonymous with the crap that floats off the crap in the bottom of the toilet and sticks to the rim of the toilet bowl. http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilterstudy.html http://people.msoe.edu/~yoderw/oilfilterstudy/oilfilterstudy.html#fram-ph8a http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilter-fram1.txt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSFW Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 Any chance we could put a small filter into the oil line, and locate it where it can be inspected / swapped more easily? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobY Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 would not even bother. Its redundant. If the main oil filter does its job this is completely unnecessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2005garnetGT Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 Ooh I wouldent go with Fram... Fram is pretty much synonymous with the crap that floats off the crap in the bottom of the toilet and sticks to the rim of the toilet bowl. http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilterstudy.html http://people.msoe.edu/~yoderw/oilfilterstudy/oilfilterstudy.html#fram-ph8a http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilter-fram1.txt theres another really good one by a taurus SHO guy. I remember that oil filter study back when I had a turbo lebaron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
praedet Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 Now the question is, what is the likelyhood that the second in-line filter gets clogged, and how do we get rid of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted May 16, 2007 Author Share Posted May 16, 2007 So all of those millions of cars using Fram filters are tempting fate Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balrock Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 Now the question is, what is the likelyhood that the second in-line filter gets clogged, and how do we get rid of it As far as I know the only one that has an issue is the turbo side. I dont know if all the heat from the turbo and the extended OCI is why the filter can have an issue or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 I'm still in disbelief that the "vacation pics" don't mention any of these filters. Also, I'm not sure how much good they would do - the engine oil comes through the filter and through the oiling passages to the turbo, so there's not a lot of places to pick up grit. Perhaps on initial startup some metal could be generated? Even then, the filter should get it first as the turbo oil doesn't go through any bearings. I've attached the engine oil flow diagram. -Ryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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