iPod Direct-connection successful! (but VERY difficult)

[Ken S]

The headunit on the USDM models have an antenna cable with a non-standard connector. Craig and some others modified this connector by soldereding on a standard Motorola connector. Rumor has it that Metra will soon be selling an adapter for our antenna connector. In either case, it is quite possible to tap directly into the FM antenna cable. Ken

[jp928]

Ken, going back to my first question, is there somewhere to tap into the aerial without pulling the head unit? My head unit also has a non-std aerial connector, so I suspect its the same as USDM cars, even if the capability of the unit differs. The manuals I downloaded show the aerial amplifier is on the rear gate, but I havent yet found the actual route the cable follows... jp

[Ken S]

Possibly, but from what I've read so far, most people have removed the head unit to access the antenna connector in the back. The removal of the headunit is not too difficult and it would make sense to tap into the FM antenna at that point. Whatever you intend on adding in will most likely be located up by the driver. Try looking through this thread: [url]http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2901[/url] Ken

[lucamercati]

does anybody knows something about [url="http://www.mp3yourcar.com"]www.mp3yourcar.com[/url] ?

[lucamercati]

I think that if we all ask to mp3youcar.com to do something for our subaru legacy they we'll do in a shorter time (and better price for us !!!)

[orangerory]

[quote name='lucamercati']I think that if we all ask to mp3youcar.com to do something for our subaru legacy they we'll do in a shorter time (and better price for us !!!)[/QUOTE] Well - I did it. Hopefully more will follow.

[Ken S]

[quote name='lucamercati']does anybody knows something about [url="http://www.mp3yourcar.com"]www.mp3yourcar.com[/url] ?[/QUOTE] The problem is that there is no easy direct connection into the stock HU. If there was something other than the FM antenna, more folks would have a solution by now. Looking at their website with very little info, it's not clear to me if they offer only direct connection solutions. Ken

[bikerboi911]

Sorry if someone already suggested this, I didn't read all 14 pages. What about opening the left and right audio lines having an input and output side with shielded RCA cable (CD side and Circuit board side), audio ground soldered to the shields of the RCA cable (have a good 2-3 feet extra run out of the radio) Use 2 SPDT relays to switch audio and avoid having to play blank CD's and keep all your favorites in the player. Here is how to wire it. Pin 30 of the relays would go to the circuit board side of the radio (L audio for one relay and R audio to the second), pin 87a would go to the CD players audio output, 87 would be the Positive audio input lead from the IPOD, 86 goes to chassis ground, and 85 to a 12v fused ignition source via a switch (toggle or 2 way decorative switch). This approach would yield higher audio signal, complete isolation, less audio noise from electronics in car, and most importantly no need to play a blank CD. All shields of RCA cables should be soldered to the audio ground of the radio. I would think this would work perfectly as I have done it on many other types of vehicles, not a Legacy as of yet but see no reason it wouldn't. Hope this helps. Just flip the switch while in CD mode to toggle between the IPOD and CD player audio.

[JonFo]

[quote name='bikerboi911']Sorry if someone already suggested this, I didn't read all 14 pages. What about opening the left and right audio lines having an input and output side with shielded RCA cable (CD side and Circuit board side), audio ground soldered to the shields of the RCA cable (have a good 2-3 feet extra run out of the radio) Use 2 SPDT relays to switch audio and avoid having to play blank CD's and keep all your favorites in the player. Here is how to wire it. Pin 30 of the relays would go to the circuit board side of the radio (L audio for one relay and R audio to the second), pin 87a would go to the CD players audio output, 87 would be the Positive audio input lead from the IPOD, 86 goes to chassis ground, and 85 to a 12v fused ignition source via a switch (toggle or 2 way decorative switch). This approach would yield higher audio signal, complete isolation, less audio noise from electronics in car, and most importantly no need to play a blank CD. All shields of RCA cables should be soldered to the audio ground of the radio. I would think this would work perfectly as I have done it on many other types of vehicles, not a Legacy as of yet but see no reason it wouldn't. Hope this helps. Just flip the switch while in CD mode to toggle between the IPOD and CD player audio.[/QUOTE] Excellent suggestion. Care to post a diagram of what you propose? One question: does you proposal address the need to fool the HU that the 'CD' is actively playing? Or does the HU not care and as long as it's in 'CD' mode, it will amplify the audio signal from that connector?

[bikerboi911]

I dont think the head unit will have any issues needing to be fooled into thinking a CD is playing. It should sense audio from the IPOD and not mute. I have performed this countless times on external CD changers and even with the audio leads open the units still knew what track the were on and correct time of track as well. I will try to get a diagram up within the next few days. As I said I have not done this on the Legacy as of yet and just picked mine up last night but have done it on a few GM vehicles, aftermarket HU's, and a couple of others without an external changer using the same technique with no issues.

[bikerboi911]

It may play a bit louder but not be amplified. It will see less resistance (minimal) by not seeing the CD players audio output even with no signal and this may appear to play slightly louder and cleaner. I don't think it will hurt anything by not cutting open the lines and playing a blank CD but this may sound a bit better and there is no risk of causing damage.

[c_hunter]

You need to play "a" CD, whether it's blank or not, to get the radio to switch/use the CD input (whether it's for a CD or it has been hijacked for aux-in). If you are physically hijacking the connection, any CD will do, but audio will cutout when it changes tracks (or skips). The idea behind the blank CD, more than the "blankness", is that is has one long track (the full length of the CD) to minimize interruptions.

[bikerboi911]

I have never had any issues of audio dropping out between tracks using this method. The Legacy radio may in fact be different but I have never seen this be an issue with any other vehicles.

[c_hunter]

Yeah, the Legacy radio (and the one in the Forester as well) mutes the amp whenever you change tracks or when the CD skips. Probably under a few other circumstances as well. The main thing to keep in mind -- you cannot select the "CD" input on the radio unless a CD is loaded. For instance, if you are in FM mode with no CDs loaded and you press the "CD" button, nothing will happen (keeps playing FM). A CD has to be physically loaded in the changer and playing for the radio to acknowledge the CD input (whether you're playing a CD or piping aux-in through the hijacked connection).

[bikerboi911]

I never said you didn't need a CD in the player..... You need to fool the radio into thinking the CD is still playing. I don't think the amplifier is actually being muted. I think the D/A converter senses a low signal (0) and does not pass any analog audio to the preamplifier section of the radio. I believe it is the CD player dropping out analog audio when it is between tracks or skipping. The analog input of the radio comming from the CD player can only sense AC voltage and has no way of knowing if it's between tracks or a quite passage in some music (such as classical). The CD player itself tells the microprocessor on the circuit board what to display via a data lead in the 14 pin ribbon cable. The method that Centerpunch used utilizes the analog input so I would think by opening the audio leads with relays the audio would always continue to play regardless of a regular audio CD or blank CD being played. The radio would always sense an AC signal. [u]What about a CD that has no pause or silence between tracks (live recordings for example)??? Does the audio drop out when it advances to the next track?[/u] That is why I think this method will work, as long as there is an AC signal present on the Audio input of the circuit board side I see no reason for it to mute the amplifier. I have not tried this as I just got the car and don't even know if I will even do one as I don't use a MP-3 player personally. I have however done this in some Video installation to avoid the use of an FM modulator and degraded sound quality. I have not experienced any drop outs between tracks if it was an audio CD playing while switched. C_hunter have you confirmed that the amplifier is muted when it skips or is between tracks? Any CD player drops out audio when it is between tracks or skipping. Does the radio have some sort of a noise gate when no signal is present? If it sensed audio on these lines it may in fact still play.

[mvigneau]

So does that mean that the CD keeps on playing then? If so, then it really is no better than Centerpunch's method since you use the laser in the CD Player which is one of the things we are trying to avoid.

[c_hunter]

[quote name='bikerboi911']I never said you didn't need a CD in the player..... You need to fool the radio into thinking the CD is still playing. I don't think the amplifier is actually being muted. I think the D/A converter senses a low signal (0) and does not pass any analog audio to the preamplifier section of the radio. I believe it is the CD player dropping out analog audio when it is between tracks or skipping. The analog input of the radio comming from the CD player can only sense AC voltage and has no way of knowing if it's between tracks or a quite passage in some music (such as classical). The CD player itself tells the microprocessor on the circuit board what to display via a data lead in the 14 pin ribbon cable. The method that Centerpunch used utilizes the analog input so I would think by opening the audio leads with relays the audio would always continue to play regardless of a regular audio CD or blank CD being played. The radio would always sense an AC signal. [u]What about a CD that has no pause or silence between tracks (live recordings for example)??? Does the audio drop out when it advances to the next track?[/u] That is why I think this method will work, as long as there is an AC signal present on the Audio input of the circuit board side I see no reason for it to mute the amplifier. I have not tried this as I just got the car and don't even know if I will even do one as I don't use a MP-3 player personally. I have however done this in some Video installation to avoid the use of an FM modulator and degraded sound quality. I have not experienced any drop outs between tracks if it was an audio CD playing while switched. C_hunter have you confirmed that the amplifier is muted when it skips or is between tracks? Any CD player drops out audio when it is between tracks or skipping. Does the radio have some sort of a noise gate when no signal is present? If it sensed audio on these lines it may in fact still play.[/QUOTE] Yeah, I am not sure if it is in this post, or on another forum, but someone tested the signal and there is quite a busy relationship between the CD player and the amp. The amp is not sensing anything over the audio leads -- the CD player is communicating its status via different signals on a data bus. Wait, here is something from centerpunch: [url]http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showpost.php?p=47053&postcount=20[/url] This confirms what I have heard. It also reminds me that there is not a simple way to "trigger" the CD input on the amp -- it's more complicated than that. Anyway, I think centerpunch's solution with the blank CD is probably fine for most cases. Use switches or relays to flop the input from the CD changer to the aux-in, and you're all set. Craig

[bikerboi911]

I can't lie, I'd be highly interested in seeing if with the audio lines open that it may not mute the signal. Is it possible that upon skipping the audio lines drop to a low state that could cancel the audio signal from the IPOD? I do wonder if they are opened wheather this would resolve the issue. Man, technology is getting a bit out of hand with this stuff. I hope someone tries it just to see.

[bikerboi911]

[quote name='mvigneau']So does that mean that the CD keeps on playing then? If so, then it really is no better than Centerpunch's method since you use the laser in the CD Player which is one of the things we are trying to avoid.[/QUOTE] Even if it's blank or silent tracks you still use the laser......Anytime it has to interpret the data on a disk it uses the laser. Why are you trying to avoid using the laser? It should in fact last longer than the car. The relay way adds complete isolation of the signals so they do not see eachother (CD player and Ipod) and should improve signal quality and minimize injected noise.

[RoundBoy]

sorry if i missed it, but has there been any discussion of the 'SAT' light on the radio, or if the 'down' position on the cd-fm-am selector has any function of the block was removed?

[c_hunter]

[quote name='RoundBoy']sorry if i missed it, but has there been any discussion of the 'SAT' light on the radio, or if the 'down' position on the cd-fm-am selector has any function of the block was removed?[/QUOTE] Somebody looked into that, and unfortunately it was a dead end. Craig

[centerpunch]

FYI-- after six months this solution is still working and sounding great.

[n8gray]

Ok folks, it looks like nobody's going to be reverse-engineering the Changer-HU protocol any time soon, so why don't we pursue c_hunter's solution: [url]http://legacygt.com/forums/showpost.php?p=48567&postcount=58[/url] I would be willing to pay somebody to build one of those for me. BTW, here's one bit of info that I haven't seen posted yet. The CD changer seems to use the Panasonic MN662785TBUC as its main chip. The data sheet is available here: [url]http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/datasheets_pdf/M/N/6/6/MN662785TBUC.shtml[/url] I'm no EE whiz so it's not useful to me, but maybe somebody can find something interesting...

[taddison]

>>has there been any discussion of the 'SAT' light on the radio The fourth unmarked position on the source selector is for the satellite, but it doesn't work even if you physically unblock it. It probably only works if the sat player is present. On the circuit board I can see where the sat input would be, but a number of components are missing from that section of the board, presumably to be added in a future next model year. For those who are planning on switching the CD player output with a relay or switches, you might be better off switching the tuner output instead, that way you don't have to have a CD playing to unmute the sound. The CD is muted if there is no CD playing, but the sound from the tuner comes through even if it's not pulling in a good signal. I think there is a good place to do this - on the big tuner module, the 5th and 6th pins from the front appear to carry the tuner's audio output at suitable voltage levels. FM and AM both come out on the same pins. I tried injecting my IPOD output here without cutting any traces and I did hear the sound OK, albeit with the radio noise mixed in. I decided not to actually wire it in because I ran out of time but I'll get around to it someday.

[n8gray]

Very interesting! Using the tuner channel would be much nicer than the CD, but I don't know if I'm up to splicing into the pins of ICs. Is this as tough as it sounds?