Comments about the Spec B

[gdogg16]

The Spec B had every option I wanted, plus individuality, AND that Bilstien suspension is COVERED UNDER WARRANTY... something you can't get with aftermarket. Thats worth a little extra in my book. Also, the Nav was the best option I never wanted. I really didn't want to spend that money for it, but now that I have, I find it really usefull... I use it at least weekly to find places or to just give me quick easy directions across town... or even to look for a place to eat or an ATM...

 

Bilsteins come with a life time warranty on all of their shocks so it's no surprise it's "covered under the warranty." I've had a lot of conversations about the specB and I agree with most here that it's just overpriced with nothing really special about it. I love the subaru, but it is just a subaru... Subaru has never had the stigma of being a luxury vehicle.

[Acil]

and I agree with most here that it's just overpriced with nothing really special about it.

 

Wow, I missed that poll

[wukindada]

I have seen loaded Spec B's as low as 33k.... at that price I would buy one (If they came in other colors)

Plus Subaru made a mistake when they did not offer it in a wagon.

For 35K you guys name a sedan that is more refined & offers better performance.

Please do not suggest the P.O.S. Mazdaspeed:icon_twis

[rfd425]

For 35K you guys name a sedan that is more refined & offers better performance.

A well-tuned Legacy GT Limited, with $7-8K in enhancements.

 

I think that's the whole point of this debate.

[Acil]

A well-tuned Legacy GT Limited, with $7-8K in enhancements.

 

I think that's the whole point of this debate.

 

I don't know about invoice, but theres $5,200 between the MSRP of a Spec B and a GT, add another $1000 assuming you can get a better deal on the GT, and thats roughly $6k...I'd say theres roughly $4.5-5k of additional parts/features, so your paying $1-1.5k to get a limited production model AND all of these "additional parts/features" pre-installed (labor, either yours or theirs, is worth something) when you get the car. I would say its reasonably priced.

[rfd425]

I don't know about invoice, but theres $5,200 between the MSRP of a Spec B and a GT, add another $1000 assuming you can get a better deal on the GT, and thats roughly $6k....

Add another $1,000 for the factory incentive that is not available on the Spec B.

I'd say theres roughly $4.5-5k of additional parts/features, so your paying $1-1.5k to get a limited production model AND all of these "additional parts/features" pre-installed (labor, either yours or theirs, is worth something) when you get the car. I would say its reasonably priced.

*sigh*

I was answering the question "For 35K you guys name a sedan that is more refined & offers better performance." Whether the Spec B is reasonably priced or not is a matter of opinion, but I would agree that it is, especially at around invoice, which seems to be the current market price. The thing is, the regular LGT (readily available for $1,000 below invoice or less) is a screaming bargain in my opinion, compared to others in its class. But, hey, if you're not interested in doing mods, and you want the $2,000 nav, the Spec B is a good deal. I'd take it over anything else under $40K.

[Jedi Pimp]

My only beef with Spec B is NAV should have been optional which would have brought the price down a bit more in line with most enthusiast's expectations here.

[rfd425]

My only beef with Spec B is NAV should have been optional which would have brought the price down a bit more in line with most enthusiast's expectations here.

bingo.

[Acil]

Add another $1,000 for the factory incentive that is not available on the Spec B.

*sigh*

I was answering the question "For 35K you guys name a sedan that is more refined & offers better performance." Whether the Spec B is reasonably priced or not is a matter of opinion, but I would agree that it is, especially at around invoice, which seems to be the current market price. The thing is, the regular LGT (readily available for $1,000 below invoice or less) is a screaming bargain in my opinion, compared to others in its class. But, hey, if you're not interested in doing mods, and you want the $2,000 nav, the Spec B is a good deal. I'd take it over anything else under $40K.

 

I wasn't disagreeing with you, I was more trying to build off what you said to support my opinion.

[2006Specb122]

Despite what some believe SOA must have made some decent decisions. We're all here buying up all their high-end autos.

As far as the "comments about spec b." this had turned into more of a Spec B. VS. LGT. That isn't something I really want to get into. The two cars are both awesome displays of Subaru making their cars better as time goes on!

Obviously all the NON-Spec B. onwers argue that its is overpriced or that the LGT is basically the same wihout a couple of overpriced mods.

On the other hand the Spec B. owners all think they got a great deal. It is kin of a dead end.

Let me put it into perspective. I came at this from a non-biasted point of view. I never owned a subaru until I bought this car. I came from a long line of mustang ownership. Because of my new career my cars of recent have needed decent gas mileage (not the 15-18 my Saleen Mustang got).

I also decided because I occasionly visit the mountains and snowy areas to visit customer's I wanted AWD.

In addition some other people I know who have similar jobs have told me Navigation is the only way to go when you drive for a living. I used theirs and agreed it would probably be very beneificial.

So my list of criteria went like this.

1.HORSEPOWER

2. AWD

3. Navigation (yeah we could throw an aftermarket on the dash but who wants that)

4. Handling

5. Looks Good/ Fresh

6. Comfortable

7. Under 30k

8. Four Doors

 

That is literally how I started my search. Of course that drops off about 80% of all vehicles right there. If you notice a lot of the higher HP vehicles drop their AWD option like Lexus and G35.

 

Plus most cars with all those options come above 40k in price.

 

I started this search a year or two ago. I didn't really see anything that caught my eye. When the LGT first came on the scene I didn't even test drive it. Notice it had most of the criteria. It even had the same size motor the STI had. I thought I was going to buy one but NO NAVIGATION OPTION.

 

Then the 06 came out. My search began again. Now in 06 I quickly narrowed down the field again. Audi was close but price pushed it over what I wanted to pay. Plus reliability came into question when looking at Audi.

 

Again Subaru was the only one who could deliver.

 

Now it wa all about which LGT and how I was going to want it....

 

TO BE CONTINUED....

 

[2006Specb122]

Which LGT... that was the question.

Ok well all my cars up to this point were white.

After a week or so I finally realize after talking to a subaru salesmen. Subaru doesn't make a lot of white sedans. I could only find one in all of Northern California. So to find one exactly how I wanted it with correct options interior color etc. That wasn't going to be easy. OK so I could order one the way I want and wait for it to arrive. That might work. From the auto buying tips I've read ordering one the way you want isn't the best way to get the best pice. You're better off finding the one you like at the lot and then bargaining for it.

Then I start to think about auto vs. manual transmission.

I was sold on the auto until I read posts on this forum. Uh..oh... now I was looking at 5speed.

If I went with the 5 speed there was no way to get the Navigation. (That made me upset.)

If I want a 5 speed and NAVIGATION I would be forced to buy a Spec B.

Navigation was a must!

Then I did the math. Took the invoice numbers on both vehicles and did a compared them.

I was suprised at how close the price came out after comparing.

You have to realize that for me in my position since I had to have the navigation that I would have to get an auto $1200 and the nav $2000. So I'm already coming in at $3200 more. Then I'd probably want rims/tires at some point and I would have definatlely changed the suspension.

Instead of waiting till my brand new tires and suspension wore out to replace them (most economical thing to do) I would already have them with the spec b. and of course they'd be covered under the warranty.

To me the Spec B. was actually the "BETTER VALUE."

But it's all about what your needs are and what your preference is.

 

 

I don't like comments like some others have made like "spec b. isn't worth it." It is really a personal preference. So I hope I have made my comments clear.

I love the spec b. and I also would have been happy with any LGT although I would be driving an automatic with Navigation.

All in all I probably would have paid 29 or 30 for an LGT and for 3k more I got a Spec B. To me it was well worth it.

18 10 spoke alloy Rims/summer performacne Tires/Leather/Blistein Suspension/alum control arms and rear arms and upper links/Navigation/alum pedals/limited plaque/exclusive paint/

 

 

all installed now! with the car now! under warranty now! all for 3k...

 

couldn't have done it cheaper if I did it myself...

 

 

THANKS SUBARU!!!

 

Best car I ever drove!

 

[2006Specb122]

I was making a general comment.. I should not have used the word ALL or NONE.

 

However, after reading all 5 pages on THIS thread I believe that every non-spec b owner said it was overpriced except 2 and every spec b owner seemed happy with it.

 

That is normal and expected. Did you read that my whole point was I didn't want to join a spec b. vs. LGT argument because I love and respect both cars!

 

I just pointed out that I fell into a category that put the Spec b. as bascially my only option when it came to finding a car that fit my criteria. Unless I wanted an AUTO which would have been nearly as much money (within 3-4k) as the Spec B but with bad tires (from what LGT owners have told me) smaller rims and stock suspension.

 

My results... spec b. = only choice for me.

[LoveMySpecB]

Wow, I'm amazed at how long this thread has become. Thanks for the comments. I agree with 2006Specb122. These are the criteria I absolutely had to have in my new car:

1. Manual transmission

2. Fast

3. Safe

4. Navigation system

5. Reliable

 

The combination of manual transmission and navigation system pretty much excluded most cars. The Volvo S40 offers a built-in nav but good luck finding one. Ditto for Audi. The Mazdaspeed 6 offers both but it's a new engine and its safety scores were spotty last year, at best. As you can see from recent magazine reviews, the Mazdaspeed 6 doesn't even come close to the Subaru.

 

Is the Spec B perfect? Far from it. But, for the combination of features it offers, you can't beat it. BTW, I got mine for about 33,400. It was stickered for about 35,200. I'm very happy with it.

[IwannaSportSedan]

I am glad you have the car that fits your bill. I really genuinely am.

 

I may be happy with an '07 Spec b. Or an 07 LGT Limited... We'll see.

 

No one has disagreed with your contention that the LGT is one of the best cars in it's class. (recently agreed to by Road&Track magazine...)

 

In your first post, you seemed to be taking members here to task over non-fully-positive comments on this forum pertaining to the Spec B. Said comments almost always pertained to value in comparison, not to other cars, but it's LGT stablemate. The LGT and LGT Spec B are both so good, they compete against each other more than either of them compete directly with other cars.

 

(folks who want subaru will buy subaru, folks that like honda, toyota, domestic... will favor that, and etc. Drawing customers away from pre-conceived preferences takes a very good product and commensurate marketing.)

 

Subaru put the LGT and Spec-B too close in specification, and too far apart in price. Next year, with the 6MT, that disparity could be nicely equalized, at least for me. We'll see.

 

Plus with the rumors flyin' about the additional equipment in the 07 LGT and 6MT Spec B might actually have more of the details to really make some inroads against the Acura, Infiniti, Lexus, and Audi competitors.

[2006Specb122]

I'll admit they're basically the same exact car... spec b. is just fully loaded MT... can't get that without going spec b.

 

I'll even admit I think it would have been nice to make the "spec b." package that you can add at the dealer or order from the factory. I would have loved to get mine in white!

 

Anyways... its the same car only with more goodies which most of you put on the car anyways.... Let's all be happy we have a LGT !!!!!

 

They are the best bang for your buck!

 

One thing I am tired of... everyone dogging the LGT for having the 5 speed.

 

WHO CARES.. The only thing I'd like the 6 speed for is better gas mileage.

 

After driving 25k miles per year you know how many more shifts I'd do in a 6 speed?

 

I did the math 6,498 more shifts... per year...

 

Come on.. I don't need that extra work!

 

Plus it takes longer to get to a specific speed when you're shifting more...

 

0-60... ONE SHIFT!

 

thank you!

[GT2.5]

This thread has been an interesting read.

However, I don't understand how so many LGT owners can be so misinformed?

 

The Spec-B is actually priced quite well compared to other brands that it and the LGT compete against such as Audi, BMW, Volvo, Mazda, etc...

 

The B version when equipped as comparably as possible to the LGT limited is ONLY $2631 more. Now, the LGT limited can not even be optioned like the spec B as it does not have 18's wheels, aluminum suspension parts, or Bilstein dampers.

Where does this price come from?

The Spec B is $35,009 no options.

The LGT Limited with added body kit and aluminum pedals is

$30,378.

The NAV is $2000 as that is what Subaru charges for it.

Take an LGT auto with NAV and without and the base price diff. is $2000.

 

So, for $2631 you get the aluminum suspension components which are performance enhancements due to their lower weight, and quicker response. The Bilsteins are also performance enhancements as they provide better damping control over the vehicles motions providing better handling control and feel. The 18" Wheels/tires can be performance enhancers IF they are lower in weight overall to the LGT's 17's.

The NAV is a cool feature, which one may or may not like. I too think it should have been an option, but given the overall cost of all the items, the NAV is MUCH lower in cost to have than to get it in an LGT for $2000.

 

You can't buy Bilsteins, aluminum components, 18's wheel/tires, and a built in NAV system for $2631 retail. And, if you get a Spec B for invoice, you're all that for even less. A set of 18's wheels and performance tires will set you back at least $1200-$1500.

 

The LGT is a fine automobile and I'm considering it for my next vehicle.

I currently drive a BMW 325i. The Spec-B is a pretty awesome deal when comparing it to an LGT Limited fully optioned.

Plus, the Spec B is a limited production vehicle, which does have a certian sense of exclusivity and uniqueness.

 

I too would have liked to see the Spec B with more power, larger brakes, alternate suspension tuning, maybe the 6 spd., although I like properly spaced 5's.

But, for all the options loaded on this car, it's a great deal for the money.

 

If you take the $35,009 and take off $2000 for the NAV, that's

$33,009. A similarly optioned LGT limited is $30,378.

 

T

[rfd425]

GT2.5, there are a number of flaws in your logic. First of all, there is a $1,500 factory rebate on regular LGT's which does not apply to the Spec B. So, with that alone, your price difference becomes $4,131.

 

The Bilstein suspension -- the actual Subaru parts -- can be purchased for around $1,500-$1,800. You're right that a set of 18" tires and wheels will cost at least $1,200 to $1,500, but then an LGT owner would have those tires/wheels and his stock 17's. The Spec B does not come with the 17's in addition, so add the cost of the 17's back in, and you add another $800, conservatively. Adding the cost of the 17's back in makes sense to do, because many, possibly most, Spec B owners will have to purchase separate winter tires (and probably wheels) since the RE050's are not suitable for driving on snow and ice.

 

You mention that for the $2,631 (actually, $4,131) difference, you get built in Nav, but yet you are figuring in the $2,000 cost of the Nav when you arrive at that figure. you can't have it both ways.

 

If you had read the thread more closely, you would have realized that the major complaints about the pricing of the Spec B are related to (1) the fact that the LGT is available for $1,500 under invoice, whereas the Spec B was initially going for close to MSRP, and (2) the Spec B crams a bunch of options down your throat that a lot of LGT owners don't want. I don't care if I'm getting a great deal on an option I don't want.

[suba_rus]

To me it sounds like GT2.5 is working for Subaru.

[vet]

Spec B is a good deal compared to competing models from other brands (BMW, Infiniti, Audi, Volvo)

 

It's a little underwhelming, for the price, compared to the base/Limited LGT.

 

MSRP is not an accurate price comparison, need to compare out the door prices.

[rfd425]

Spec B is a good deal compared to competing models from other brands (BMW, Infiniti, Audi, Volvo)

 

It's a little underwhelming, for the price, compared to the base/Limited LGT.

I totally agree on both counts.

[ShakyJake]

Okay, are there any engine/exhaust differences between a spec.B and a regular GT? I just got the March 06 Road & Track where they compared several AWD sport sedans, and they list the spec.B 0-60 times at 5.1 seconds and 1/4 mile at 13.7. I've always read that a stock GT runs 0-60 in 5.8 and 1/4 mile times slightly over 14. This is a huge discrepancy!

[aldo ixnay]

The thing that I find strange is that for some people the price is ok if you include a six speed (which you can make arguments for and against whether it's really a performance upgrade, I personally don't want one) and boy-racer colored seats (which IMHO are not nearly as classy as the Brick Red and belong in an Impreza).

[IwannaSportSedan]

6MT would, or at least should offer better cruising ability (quieter, better mileage on the highway) while not giving up, and possibly slightly improving lower gear accelleration.

 

You can call blue-insert seats boy-racerish all you want. That is fine. I like the red, too. I would take straight black leather. I just don't want taupe interior in a sport sedan, I think dark, with or without color accents is sportier. that is a matter of taste.

 

I am sure that if it is a contention for someone, this forum would be the place to arrange a swap back to a black interior, so someone else could get the boy-racer seats of whatever color.

 

The big thing is, that with the 6MT, the AWD gets an upgrade, too. VTD AWD, or possibly even DCCD come with the 6MT, hopefully with the 06 STI's 64% default rear bias, rather than the 50/50 Symmetrical AWD in the 5MT, which is good. VTD is just better, and easier to integrate with VDC. (sensors in place for both, etc...)

 

At least it would be something substantial added to the drivetrain, along with the suspension, to be shelling out extra cash for, rather than just the priviledge of having your color choices limited.

 

I have to agree with RFD about the wheels and tires bit. If I get an 07 Spec B, I am going to have to figure out something for winter wheels and tires almost immediately after purchase, which is not insignificant.

[2006Specb122]

Okay, are there any engine/exhaust differences between a spec.B and a regular GT? I just got the March 06 Road & Track where they compared several AWD sport sedans, and they list the spec.B 0-60 times at 5.1 seconds and 1/4 mile at 13.7. I've always read that a stock GT runs 0-60 in 5.8 and 1/4 mile times slightly over 14. This is a huge discrepancy!

 

The spec b. is just "special."

 

For some strnage reason the Spec b. just pulls harder and gets quicker times.

 

It has nothing to do with being number 002.

 

Have you ever watched herbie?

 

NUF SAID

[GT2.5]

GT2.5, there are a number of flaws in your logic. First of all, there is a $1,500 factory rebate on regular LGT's which does not apply to the Spec B. So, with that alone, your price difference becomes $4,131.

 

The Bilstein suspension -- the actual Subaru parts -- can be purchased for around $1,500-$1,800. You're right that a set of 18" tires and wheels will cost at least $1,200 to $1,500, but then an LGT owner would have those tires/wheels and his stock 17's. The Spec B does not come with the 17's in addition, so add the cost of the 17's back in, and you add another $800, conservatively. Adding the cost of the 17's back in makes sense to do, because many, possibly most, Spec B owners will have to purchase separate winter tires (and probably wheels) since the RE050's are not suitable for driving on snow and ice.

 

You mention that for the $2,631 (actually, $4,131) difference, you get built in Nav, but yet you are figuring in the $2,000 cost of the Nav when you arrive at that figure. you can't have it both ways.

 

If you had read the thread more closely, you would have realized that the major complaints about the pricing of the Spec B are related to (1) the fact that the LGT is available for $1,500 under invoice, whereas the Spec B was initially going for close to MSRP, and (2) the Spec B crams a bunch of options down your throat that a lot of LGT owners don't want. I don't care if I'm getting a great deal on an option I don't want.

 

I did the read the whole thread.

My point is that selling price is dependent on how good one is at negotiating and the market in which they buy. Thus, actual selling price is variable, and not a good factor to use for comparing the value of the Spec B package.

 

 

The $2631 price difference take the LGT limited and adds $2000 NAV to compare pricing.

If you don't like that, then you hav to take $2000 off of the Spec B, to get at comparable pricing.

So, $35,009 minus $2000 = $33, 009

An LGT limited (no NAV) is $30,378

Difference = $2631.

You can't have it both ways.

You make the price difference double as you want the differences added between cars that don't have same options.

You want to compare a LGT limited with less features to a Spec B with all the features.

Of course there is a $4631 difference, and that's exactly what I was addressing, and trying to help explain the cost difference. It's not as if the Spec B simply costs more and you get nothing for it.

 

When the LGT first came out there weren't large discounts as there are now. With the Spec B, same thing.

Thus, we have MSRP on which to base what Subaru values the Spec B.

THAT is the number which I am comparing.

Look over my post again, and you'll see that.

 

Also, if the car has options you don't want, then it's not the car for you.

Great. It's your choice. However, there is no reason to put down those who want those options and feel the price is pretty darn good.

 

I'm shopping for a Spec B right now. I've already had invoice offers, and just this morning I got a new email claiming another $500 off. I haven't verified it yet though.

 

As far as modding goes, lots of people talk about it and most don't do it.

The Spec B has performance parts that make it better than the LGT limited right out of the box. There is a reason why the Spec B won the AWD sport sedan comparo in Road&Track, when price dependent.

 

You do have a point about the wheel/tires. More so with the tires though.

I have a 325i with sport package which means summer only sport tires. So, I had to get a set of all-season tires to drive my car year round. There is not reason to have to get a new set of wheels and tires though. I didn't.

I got high performance Pirelli P-zero tires and they've worked great for nearly 3 years now.

But, you are right. The Spec B does take on an additional cost for those who live in areas that get some snow.

Of course, there are those who will not incur that cost as they live in better weather climates.

That too is another variable.

If we wanted to add costs due to tire needs, the LGT is also in need of tires as the OEM tires suck, and I would probably replace them asap if I were to get an LGT. So, it's really a wash, or a choice level.

 

I too would like to have seen the Spec B offered without the $2000 NAV option, as I had mentioned. But, there it is. In the grand scheme of pricing, however, the NAV doesn't cost $2000 when packaged in the Spec B. The overall cost isn't too bad when taken into a fuller perspective, which is what I'm getting at.

I don't work for Subaru. I work in the audio/video production field and I currenty drive a BMW 3 series.

And, I think the Legacy is a fine automobile, with the Spec B being a very cool optional car for those who want the things it offers. And, when compared to other cars out there, the price is pretty nice.

The recent R&T feature picked the A4 over the Spec B, when cost wasn't considered.

You can get MUCH better deals on a Spec B than you can on an Audi A4 or BMW 3. In that broader picture the

Spec B is an excellent deal.

 

Also, I think it sucks that you guys cut on your own brand in terms of cost. The discount pricing or the mark up for Spec B's is not Subaru's fault. It's the dealers. Don't hate the car, hate the dealer pricing game, I do.

 

TT