motorbreath Posted April 26, 2023 Share Posted April 26, 2023 As the homeowner you are allowed to do electrical, plumbing, etc, but you are still required to pull a permit. I am 100% sure of this in Ontario, other than for replacing lighting fixtures you are required to pull a permit. It is pretty easy to do so with the ESA, see the spreadsheet notification form here, https://esasafe.com/fees-and-forms/forms/ However, what they do not show you is the price which is proportional to the number of items you need inspected. For example, if you need 10 outlets inspected, the cost could be several hundred dollars. They used to include the prices in the spreadsheet, but I do not see them anymore... I doubt the municipalities building inspectors will require proof of ESA inspection to close the building permit, but I suggest you get the electrical inspected for liability and insurance reasons. I have been through this a few times, feel free to PM me and I can share my experiences. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GearJamr Posted April 26, 2023 Share Posted April 26, 2023 You should be able to contact the ESA, let them know the details of the project (in relation to electrical) and you are doing the work. They should give you the steps to follow to have it inspected at proper intervals and once complete they give a final inspection and assuming you pass then it is certified. Might not hurt to pick up a current version of Ontario electrical code, can usually get them at like home depot etc for like $20. Or it should also be available online. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted April 26, 2023 Author Share Posted April 26, 2023 All good advice, I will do just that. I suppose I'd been taking the attitude that like so many other home improvement projects, nobody gets permits for jack. I worked for my nieghbour for years part time doing interior reno, and it was *RARE* that we would have permits for anything. We moved plumbing, windows, electrical, non-load bearing walls etc.... all day every day. All things that are meant to be permitted, but never were... Our work was good, and as far as I know, he's never had a callback over anything like that. But, this is a large, visible project that I do want insured. I'll probably do the minimums, like lights, the circuit forthe lift and a couple of 20A receptacles and get inspection and approval, then add a handful more 15A recs and some flush mount light when I build the 'attic' in. I will definitely reach our and pick your brain if I come across anything I can't make sense of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted April 27, 2023 Share Posted April 27, 2023 One other thing about having the proper permits. When it comes time to sell the property, the buyer's "inspector" will check with the town to see what the property is, if the town has no record of the garage, it could be a big issue. Have you watched some of the "flipping" home shows on TV...if it's not permitted... 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted April 27, 2023 Author Share Posted April 27, 2023 That is absolutely a thing, you're right. I DO have as permit for the building tho, and that can be closed and filed away regardless of the state of the electrical. So there won't be any problems when I die and my family has to sell off the property. Getting rid of all my workshop tools will be harder for them hah! Much as I still want to be libertarian about it, it is probably in my best interest to pay the city more money and get everything inspected, yes.... That doesn't mean I won't add more electrical over time, and I doubt I'll go pay for a permit to add a couple of recs...... I've never had a television since I moved out of my parents tho, so I haven't watched TV in 20 odd years, hah! I've heard of things like reno shows tho, and I get the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holla Posted April 27, 2023 Share Posted April 27, 2023 Looking good man! I'm really digging the setup you have going on. Don't feel too bad about the permits. I finally got mine approved this week, they were submitted in January. And that was with a licensed architect, structural engineer and professional permit expediter on the job. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted April 27, 2023 Share Posted April 27, 2023 I'll assume the garage will have its own sub-panel for electrical. Make sure it has enough power for future additions. Think EV car. My garage has the charging outlet wall box and conduit in place, will just need to have the wires fished through and outlet installed. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted April 27, 2023 Share Posted April 27, 2023 When it comes to lighting, I think we've talked about the new, 8000 lumens LED lights. They are not much money and easy to find at many discount stores. See post dated January 22 2022 for lights on with doors closed. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted April 27, 2023 Author Share Posted April 27, 2023 2 hours ago, Max Capacity said: I'll assume the garage will have its own sub-panel for electrical. Make sure it has enough power for future additions. Think EV car. My garage has the charging outlet wall box and conduit in place, will just need to have the wires fished through and outlet installed. Yessir. The old house panel (100A) wil become the garage sub-panel. It will only be fed 60A from the house, because I don't think I'll need more than that out in the garage, to be honest, and I happen to have enough 6g wire to get 2/3 of the way there from the inside panel. I just need to terminate that in a junction box and run the rest out the conduit I've been burying in the yard. By re-using the old panel and breakers, I'm saving ~$400 vs buying a new one. It's part of how I can justify the cost of installing a new, larger 100A panel in the house. (~$1200) It was too small anyway, and I was out of circuits, so it's convenient that it works out this way. I did look into having the house converted up to 200A power, to future proof against the eventuality of an EV, or when I finally switch over from gas to a cold climate heat pump and need more juice. However, with the price of copper at the moment and all the rest, it would have been something like $3-4K to go that route. Just too much for me right now. I'm one person living in a smallish house, I think 100A of power will be lots for the foreseeable future. I hope! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted May 3, 2023 Author Share Posted May 3, 2023 On 4/27/2023 at 11:02 AM, Holla said: Looking good man! I'm really digging the setup you have going on. Don't feel too bad about the permits. I finally got mine approved this week, they were submitted in January. And that was with a licensed architect, structural engineer and professional permit expediter on the job. Glad to hear it's going for ya man. Been a while hey? It's such a drag waiting for permits. But on the plus side, once that is done, you're waiting for good weather to pour concrete, then waiting for building supplies to arrive, then waiting for the rain to stop... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted May 3, 2023 Author Share Posted May 3, 2023 (edited) Supposed to get a full weekend of sun, so I am pretty hopeful I can get the last of the purlins up, trim the roof edges and at least *start* putting up the roofing. It is currently taking up the middle of the 2nd bay in the garage, which is really getting in my way... *hah* But, it's also the only really safe place to keep it for now. Fingers crossed the long range predictions are even close to right..... nope. rained all day Sunday, got the work started at least tho Edited May 10, 2023 by KZJonny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted May 10, 2023 Author Share Posted May 10, 2023 (edited) Well colour me surprised. Getting an electrical permit was as simple as making a call, and chatting with someone a little bit. I get to run power, put in a sub-panel and wire in some lights, receptacles and switches + an outlet for the hoist (or I suppose I can hard wire it....) all for $125 CAD. I think I may need to call back in before the inspection in case anything changes, but that permit cost supposedly is good for all those things, and up to 30 devices. (which are pretty much anything....) Good enough for me. I really have no problem getting the inspection then adding more lights and receptacles as needed without further permitting. There is only so much money I'm willing to give government bodies to nanny me. I will have my electrician buddy helping out and doing an inspection on the work anyay, so nothing will be letting the smoke out. And no extension cords into extention cords into extension cords, so I'm not concerned about fire especially either. Edited May 10, 2023 by KZJonny 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted May 11, 2023 Share Posted May 11, 2023 That's good to hear. Nice to know your legal and things are done right...the first time. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted May 16, 2023 Author Share Posted May 16, 2023 (edited) Conduit is all run and buried, just needs to run through the outside wall of the house, where there is conveniently a 5” hole already cut for a heat recovery ventilator I removed shortly after buying the house that’s just been stuffed with rags. Gable ends of the roof have been trimmed, and all the purlins are up and secured. Just need a day that isn’t blazing sum and breezy to start mounting the sheet steel. That will be after I drive 500km to My sisters house to repair her garage roof which is rotting apart. The ‘irony’ of driving that far to do roofing for someone else while mine is left unfinished is not lost on me…. EDIT: Her kid is sick, so I am staying put. Maybe I wil have a properly rainproof roof this weekend!! Edited May 17, 2023 by KZJonny 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted May 17, 2023 Share Posted May 17, 2023 Lots of sunny days here in the northeast, we need some rain... looks like it may be Saturday when we get some. But it will be nice and sunny all next week again. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted May 23, 2023 Author Share Posted May 23, 2023 I hate roofing if I didn’t mention that before…. Plans to fix my sisters garage roof fell through, so I worked on mine instead. Would have liked to have done a little more, but it’s Victoria Day long weekend, and 8-9 hours of trimming drip edge and installing metal sheet was enough for me on a holiday. By 1800 I really wanted a beer and at that point, I stop working at height…. Also pretty happy how the clover is filling in. Not long ago the whole yard was still a mud pit I had to walk across plywood paths. I also got a few yards of gravel from a friend that needed to get rid of it, so the last of the trench around the building is all now filled in. You don’t have to watch your step to avoid breaking an ankle. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motorbreath Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 Looks good! I am (rightfully) terrified of working with sheet metal and heights, so it looks quite impressive to me. What is the blue membrane below the metal roofing? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted May 23, 2023 Author Share Posted May 23, 2023 23 minutes ago, motorbreath said: Looks good! I am (rightfully) terrified of working with sheet metal and heights, so it looks quite impressive to me. What is the blue membrane below the metal roofing? Thanks. Now that it is mid-day the following workday, my back and shoulders are screaming at me a little.... Hah! It's the height I do not much care for, and sheet metal roofing is slippery as all get out, so there is some planning involved to try and get most of it done without having to walk/work on any section that already has metal on it. I'm borrowing a harness from a buddy today so I can finish fastening down the crown cap. The blue membrane is a waterproof/breathable layer. In this case it is GAF Deck Armour, but there are other analogues. I want to say it was ~$4-500 for a roll big enough to do this roof which is 7 square. It is also highly recommended to put a weather guard adhesive membrane all around the perimiter of the roof, which is then a second product and more $$$. If I weren't doing a metal roof, I woud have tho. Shingles at the edge of a roof can get pretty beat up over time and leak. I don't see that being a problem with the metal roof. It's probably only going to leak through the screw and nail holes in the wood and membrane, and for that to happen, the roofing itself needs to fail.... It's the very, very much more expensive version of tar paper. I'm happy I used it tho, and it has been remarkably durable, having been put up ah... late last year? Aside from a couple of small leaks I had to put buckets under when the Spring rains came pounding, the building has been fairly dry inside a since then... Not bad for a single membrane layer. It would probably have been even more waterproof on it's own if I had used the correct/recommended type of plastic capped staple to apply it, but I did not (those guns are hundreds of dollars....) so I just put it all up with a hammer tacker. Good enough for me, but be warned, those staples will not keep it attached it gets windy enough! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 Nice to see the roof progress. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted May 25, 2023 Share Posted May 25, 2023 On 5/23/2023 at 12:59 PM, motorbreath said: Looks good! I am (rightfully) terrified of working with sheet metal and heights, so it looks quite impressive to me. What is the blue membrane below the metal roofing? You can see how the Pro's did my roof here, look for post dated Nov 21 2021. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted May 25, 2023 Author Share Posted May 25, 2023 48 minutes ago, Max Capacity said: Nice to see the roof progress. Thanks! I think it is reasonable to have the metal done this weekend, minus all the cutting, folding an trimming that goes along with the corners of the drip edge. That has to wait until I install the fascia trim, which I do not have, and don't have the money for righ now. I borrowed that harness, so I will feel better about where I have to walk across the metal roof to install the cap as well. With the roof watertight, priorities are shifting to getting the electrical in and wired up, then standing up the lift and getting it running. I pick up 20m x 3 lenghts of 6g copper wire tomorrow and an 8g ground wire. Almost $16/m for the four wires all told... Butt connectors for 6g are like $14/each.... Nothing is cheap these days! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted May 25, 2023 Author Share Posted May 25, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Max Capacity said: You can see how the Pro's did my roof here, look for post dated Nov 21 2021. Intereresting that it does not appear they used an adhesive weather strip around the perimeter of the roof, but at the same time you have a much steeper pitch on your roof than I do, so I suspect there would less call for it. I have literally the flattest peaked roof they were able to build cathedral trusses for, in order to get maximum interior height in the buiding, while not compeletely blowing past the building size limits for my residential zoning. Which necessitated the metal roof... not allowed to use normal shingles at a 3.5:12 slope. I'd have to use low-slop shingles, which are more expensive, so I kinda said hell with it. Metal roof it is. That, and the magical sounds of rain on a metal roof.... I'd have paid the extra just for that in any case, hah! Edited May 25, 2023 by KZJonny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted May 26, 2023 Share Posted May 26, 2023 In my thread, on Oct 2 2022 you can see where they did the house roof. I think you made the right choice going with the metal roof. Those are nice for the long term. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KZJonny Posted May 27, 2023 Author Share Posted May 27, 2023 Long day in the sun. Time for a beer, therefore no more roof work. Backside is done except for the last strip, which I kind of want to have someone around while I install. That metal is slick, and accidents do happen… even with a harness on. Stopped during the peak heat of the day to run the feeds to the garage. Just need to cobble up some conduit to go through the wall the wall. Shouldn’t be too long before I can throw a few recs in and maybe some lighting, then power it up. That was a long Saturday. Worth it tho. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 Can you put the last strip on from the side ? Maybe you need a ladder bracket to hold the ladder off the side of the garage, so you can feel safe. I have one of these. https://www.amazon.com/Louisville-Ladder-LP-2200-00-Stabilizer/dp/B0000CBILQ/ref=asc_df_B0000CBILQ/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167152358566&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=14982639747063303665&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9003219&hvtargid=pla-276292392619&psc=1 1 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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