Rhitter Posted November 4, 2015 Share Posted November 4, 2015 My wife came down with a sleeping bag and dropped it in the front seat. Asked how much more money the wagon was going to cost. We still working out the compromise as I'm to old to sleep in my car anymore Pull the car into your bedroom and stick your feet into it. Technically you are sleeping in the car. My OBXT build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 A friend on the 818 forum has been having an awful time with his engine. He and I are both doing the Element Tuning dry sump and have "shared" that experinece. Today he posted the below video which immediately made me think of your shop experience. He paid AJW to build him a new forged internals complete engine to install in his 818..... Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhitter Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 That's terrifying. If that's what they did on the external (easy) parts, wtf do the internals look like? My OBXT build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino6303 Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 A friend on the 818 forum has been having an awful time with his engine. He and I are both doing the Element Tuning dry sump and have "shared" that experinece. Today he posted the below video which immediately made me think of your shop experience. He paid AJW to build him a new forged internals complete engine to install... It looks as if the belt guides weren't adjusted properly and rubbed. I also don't think it's too uncommon for shops to reuse the idler pulleys and tensioner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 It looks as if the belt guides weren't adjusted properly and rubbed. I also don't think it's too uncommon for shops to reuse the idler pulleys and tensioner. Yeah Except: He paid for a new timing belt and components. They are listed on his invoice. No excuse for doing that. And what reputable engine builder would would put together a new all forged internals engine for a race car and use old timing components? Even if you were a total newb and tried to talk them into saving you $ by using old components the builder would tell you that you are nuts to risk a high end motor with old pulleys. If the pulley destructs, the belt jumps or comes apart, the valves hit the piston and boom, ruined motor. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shralp Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 Holy crap, I would be LIVID with the builder if this happened to me. Particularly because a race motor is gonna get pushed to the max. I see that AJW is on the east coast. I've said it before and I'll say it again, go to Rallispec people! They are so vetted in the suby performance community. Shipping even to the west coast wasn't that bad for my shortblock, like $175. Well worth the peace of mind.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 31, 2015 Author Share Posted December 31, 2015 I'm sitting at the desk at year's end looking at parts deals on LGT.com. Infamous as a 15% off sale plus free shipping. I need a new HG set since I buggered up the last one on the "bad" heads. Just checked, all the parts are packaged up to prevent damage while I'm off doing other things. Saw this come thru my favorited posts - http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/fs-2007-legacy-gt-caged-race-car-shell-roller-198034.html . price is down to $5k. Still needs a ton of work. Really would like to get it, however, Sgt.Gator's thread tells me I still can't afford to build & actively race a LGT. The wagon only needs a few parts to start putting it back together. Still need to find an open source tuner who can make a few mods to JohnJohn's tune. Everyone I've called wants to start over from scratch. Not that I have anything against it, however, it didn't fail because tune. Shralp's comment about using Rallispec is something I'll follow up on Monday. If I can get the engine put back together for a few bucks, I'm ok with that. There's been alot of expensive learning going on and I'd rather just drive at this point. I'll post up next week as to whether I'm hiring the rebuild out or scheduling some "let's drink beer and work on a car" days. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted January 1, 2016 Share Posted January 1, 2016 OK Boxkita, let's see a New Year's Resolution to get this done before the race season starts! Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FJuan Posted January 2, 2016 Share Posted January 2, 2016 Bookie here........taking bets now. My wife's balls are delicious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted January 3, 2016 Author Share Posted January 3, 2016 Race season starts here in late April Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merc6 Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 I would say lets race on who builds the fastest, but I haven't endured the head challenge yet. I'm afraid to take the cams off and find gouges from material trapped in between. 2005 Satin White Pearl Subaru Legacy 2.5 GT Unlimited 5EAT (Project Car) 2019 Agate Black Ford Explorer XLT 4WD (DD) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted January 11, 2016 Author Share Posted January 11, 2016 So. been looking for HG. Cometic is what I ran before and seemed like it worked until red rag incident. The last shop that worked on the heads talked about copper gaskets. At first I thought they were yanking my chain, then I saw this: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/sce-titan-copper-self-sealing-head-gasket-no-o-ring-61020.html?p=1149818 The company is still in business, however, the Titan ICS has a part number just not a price. So that means special order? They do have the regular copper - http://scegaskets.com/store/uncategorized/sce-gaskets-part-number-p92784/ Need to call into outfront motorsports to find out what gaskets they use on their closed deck blocks. The gaskets don't match all of the openings in the block which is likely how the rag got lodged in the hg. In other news, found this on Summit - http://www.summitracing.com/parts/lng-72582?seid=srese1&gclid=CI3HpdDDosoCFZFlfgodMXkAUg - I'm sure it would be useful with the Spec Miata, too. At the last race, we found the set screws on the c/o had fallen out. The outside rear had rotated 4 turns. I had weight jacking and didn't know it. http://scegaskets.com/store/uncategorized/sce-gaskets-part-number-p92784/ Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 I always find that copper and aluminum do not play nice together, especially at direct contact points. - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted January 11, 2016 Author Share Posted January 11, 2016 I always find that copper and aluminum do not play nice together, especially at direct contact points. Im thinking of a peltier device between copper and aluminum plus extreme heat should produce enough electricity to need a clutch on the alternator. I love "beer" for lunch. I have the best ideas. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Beer = brain food. Or, at least, it unleashes it. And, checked-out SCE Titan's site and it does look like you'd have to special order it, since they don't have a "stock" 99.5mm size that fits your engine. - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Cobb uses the OEM Subaru gaskets. That's what I used but I did spray them with Permatex Copper Spray-A-Gasket Hi-Temp Sealant. On the scales, I have that set. If I were doing it again I'd get the wireless for sure. Sometimes you can find them cheaper on the Longacre Refurbished List: http://www.longacreracing.com/refurbished-products.aspx For example those same scales are $839 direct from Longacre on the refurbished list. You'll also want a set of rollers that go under the scales on one side of the car to eliminate camber bind: http://www.longacreracing.com/products.aspx?itemid=1706&prodid=7177&pagetitle=Economy+SideSlider%E2%84%A2+Set+with+2+Spacers Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted January 12, 2016 Author Share Posted January 12, 2016 Called Outfront. they recommend je proseal mls 39/1000ths. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted January 12, 2016 Author Share Posted January 12, 2016 Cobb uses the OEM Subaru gaskets. That's what I used but I did spray them with Permatex Copper Spray-A-Gasket Hi-Temp Sealant. On the scales, I have that set. If I were doing it again I'd get the wireless for sure. Sometimes you can find them cheaper on the Longacre Refurbished List: http://www.longacreracing.com/refurbished-products.aspx For example those same scales are $839 direct from Longacre on the refurbished list. You'll also want a set of rollers that go under the scales on one side of the car to eliminate camber bind: http://www.longacreracing.com/products.aspx?itemid=1706&prodid=7177&pagetitle=Economy+SideSlider%E2%84%A2+Set+with+2+Spacers What does copper spray on gasket add? Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 What does copper spray on gasket add? It's old fashioned hot rod stuff. Left over from the days of 1960 head gaskets. It fills in the micro spaces and promotes a smooth seal. Is it needed today? Probably not, but then again it doesn't hurt. I did see the tech at my sponsor use it on his personal build. http://www.permatex.com/products-2/product-categories/gasketing/gasket-sealants/permatex-copper-spray-a-gasket-hi-temp-sealant-detail Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnusonsubie Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 What does copper spray on gasket add? It's old fashioned hot rod stuff. Left over from the days of 1960 head gaskets. It fills in the micro spaces and promotes a smooth seal. Is it needed today? Probably not, but then again it doesn't hurt. I did see the tech at my sponsor use it on his personal build. http://www.permatex.com/products-2/product-categories/gasketing/gasket-sealants/permatex-copper-spray-a-gasket-hi-temp-sealant-detail We don't use the spray on stuff on ships but we use copper gasket seal on pumps, engines, pipe flanges, etc. It works wonders at helping seal everything up and prevent leaks. Also helps when you have to take the pipe flange back apart and peal the paper gasket out. 2005 Vader Wagon Material Tests on Ringland Failure Piston I should have held off and purchased a wagon instead of the spec.B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted January 12, 2016 Author Share Posted January 12, 2016 Called SCE about the Titan ICS gaskets. If they call back, I'll post up what I find out. The Outfront guy said they don't O-ring the subie blocks until over 40 psi boost. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 Called SCE about the Titan ICS gaskets. If they call back, I'll post up what I find out. The Outfront guy said they don't O-ring the subie blocks until over 40 psi boost. Very interesting, copper head gaskets. http://scegaskets.com/wp_super_faq/ics-titan-vs-mls-head-gaskets/ They have the Subaru head gaskets and exhaust gaskets in their catalog. This would be enough for me NOT to use the ICS Titan: "These gaskets must be re-torqued. Start the engine and allow it to reach operating temperature without placing any load on the motor. Shut down and allow the motor to cool to ambient temperature. With the engine cold and following the recommended torque sequence, one at a time back each fastener off just enough to relieve the friction set, then re-torque to specified torque value." If you go OEM Subaru + Copper Spray I forgot to mention you have to clean any oil residue off the gaskets first or the copper spray won't apply evenly. Brake cleaner works well. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmoore5 Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 Top Fuel cars use copper head gaskets, I can't think of a more extreme internal combustion application. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted January 12, 2016 Author Share Posted January 12, 2016 Top Fuel cars use copper head gaskets, I can't think of a more extreme internal combustion application. Works well on engines that get rebuilt often, not street motors. More interested in the o ring thinv as they o ring every opening. If they have to custom make one, maybe they can match head to block better than oem. Which fit neither. Adding more drama to the mix I'm sure. However failure was from something moving from water passages via the hg. Having more sealing would forestall that again Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators BarManBean Posted January 12, 2016 Moderators Share Posted January 12, 2016 I vote for stock head gaskets, good quality head studs, and proper torque / procedure during install. Done. "Bullet-proof" your OEM TMIC! <<Buy your kit here>> Not currently in stock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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