GTTuner Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 Reading comparo's in the latest magazines has me kind of disappointed in the performance of the 10' Camaro SS. Road and track tested it against the 5.7 Challenger 6 speed, and the Stang 4.6. For the HP and weight advantage I was not extremely impressed at the Camaro. Don't get me wrong, it is a great performer, but in a short race it's not all that faster than the 5.7 Challenger. In terms of hitting the retro styling target, the Challenger wins in my eyes, even with the LX based bland interior. IMO, the 306hp V6 Camaro is the most impressive model in terms of a balance of economy, price and performance. The V6's from Mustang and Challenger can't come close to the Chevy V6. Just wanted to throw this out there, let's discuss and get some other point of views on the table. This isn't a bashing thread, just look at the data and post your opinons on styling, perfromance and value. __________________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolksey85 Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 I think the Camaro fails at the retro look. If someone never told me what the new Camaro looked like or I had never seen pics before I saw one in person, I would not think it was a Camaro. The Challenger is dead to rights a Challenger and the Mustang does a great job of looking like a 67 Mustang. Even though the V6 Camaro is the best compromise between price and power, I'm still curious to see how many people flock to it with GM quickly flushing itself down the sh!tter. The Mustang since 2005 seems to be tough to catch in sales. Even though the Challenger has only been on the streets for maybe a year, I saw a whole lot more new Mustangs in their first year or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 Reading comparo's in the latest magazines has me kind of disappointed in the performance of the 10' Camaro SS. Road and track tested it against the 5.7 Challenger 6 speed, and the Stang 4.6. For the HP and weight advantage I was not extremely impressed at the Camaro. Don't get me wrong, it is a great performer, but in a short race it's not all that faster than the 5.7 Challenger. In terms of hitting the retro styling target, the Challenger wins in my eyes, even with the LX based bland interior. IMO, the 306hp V6 Camaro is the most impressive model in terms of a balance of economy, price and performance. The V6's from Mustang and Challenger can't come close to the Chevy V6. Just wanted to throw this out there, let's discuss and get some other point of views on the table. This isn't a bashing thread, just look at the data and post your opinons on styling, perfromance and value. __________________ There are several factors that can explain why the Camaro is not hugely faster than the Challenger in the 0-60. First of all the Challenger is running a 3.91:1 rear end vs the Camaro's 3.45:1. So, the Challenger is able to make up for some of the power to weight disadvantage with steeper gearing, particularly in the lower gears where the acceleration testing is being done. Add to that fact that the Challenger is making peak torque a little sooner in the RPM range as well as peak horsepower giving the Challenger an advantage in putting power to the ground more quickly. Also the suspensions make a difference. As noted in the test the Camaro is more tightly controlled, and for acceleration that is not always ideal. I would venutre a guess that the Challenger is lifting it's nose a bit more under heavy acceleration, and that shifts weight back to the drive axle and improves traction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 The biggest problem the Camaro driver has is that they can't see out of the car, which makes it harder to drive Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 The biggest problem the Camaro driver has is that they can't see out of the car, which makes it harder to drive Neither car exactly have great outward visibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacks GT Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 Hmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacks GT Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 Still thinking about an S5/RS5 for when I get back, but not 100% yet, how would these compare to one of those? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aczwild Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 Whatever you do, dont take the Camaro past 125, the front facia cracks from the stress and starts to pull away. Sorry, I'll pass on all three and stick with my '66 Mustang JDM'd All to hell Thanks Jimmy @ Hkc-Speed.com! RIP Coxx & Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 Still thinking about an S5/RS5 for when I get back, but not 100% yet, how would these compare to one of those? Completely different cars. The Audi is more of a true GT car, not a muscle car. If going fast, making noise, and incinerating tires are your goal then by all means take a look at any of the three cars tested. My preference would be the Camaro just for the mod potential that a small block Chevy gives you. If you do it, just make sure it is all blacked out and sounds nasty.... like big cams, long tube headers, no mufflers, strait piped nasty.... with a blower on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolksey85 Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 . If you do it, just make sure it is all blacked out and sounds nasty.... like big cams, long tube headers, no mufflers, strait piped nasty.... with a blower on it. If you like stupid huge cams that barely idle on the street, check out this C5. [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_vHB3MsU00&feature=related]YouTube - HPF Turbo E46 M3 vs 427ci C5 Z06 - A YouTube Exclusive[/ame] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.T.Subie Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 Those are some fast cars right there ^^ Denial is your best friend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 If you like stupid huge cams that barely idle on the street, check out this C5. YouTube - HPF Turbo E46 M3 vs 427ci C5 Z06 - A YouTube Exclusive Still needs a blower! [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKRQsEgZAng]YouTube - DPE Corvettes.com 920hp supercharged Corvette C6[/ame] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05GT Guru Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 If you like stupid huge cams that barely idle on the street, check out this C5. YouTube - HPF Turbo E46 M3 vs 427ci C5 Z06 - A YouTube Exclusive I like cammed lsx cars, hell i had one. I dont know why they didnt put the challenger srt-8 up against the camaro. 425hp vs 426hp seems like a pretty fair race. I love the srt-8 engines, the only problem i have with all the new mopars is aftermarket is very very limited. They sold a cam for a while for the chargers but then took it off the market and made it only available through mopar. There aftermarket selection is weak The challenger suspension is super weak for twisties and the fact that its a 4200lbs car doesnt help. I have driven a new challenger it has a good amount of body movement. The mustang imo is the worst looking car, the 4.6liter 3valve per cylinder engine is not a good platform imo. Its more expensive to mod with less hp to start with and less hp gained when modded. Not to mention 315hp isnt enough for a muscle car imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTTuner Posted May 26, 2009 Author Share Posted May 26, 2009 Guru makes a good point about modding. I can't understand why no one has been able to crack open the Chrysler ECU's. A Procharger is really the only aftermarket item hat will make huge gains, even at that the Benz sourced rear end is weak for that type of power. Mopar Muscle mag had an SRT-8 Magnum project car that blew the rear half shafts after a half dozen runs down the track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05GT Guru Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 Guru makes a good point about modding. I can't understand why no one has been able to crack open the Chrysler ECU's. A Procharger is really the only aftermarket item hat will make huge gains, even at that the Benz sourced rear end is weak for that type of power. Mopar Muscle mag had an SRT-8 Magnum project car that blew the rear half shafts after a half dozen runs down the track. They have tunes and bolt ons for the cars now. But in the world of these new mopars your path is pretty much set. Everyone just does the same things with the car, same mods, in same order. Part of the reason i like the lsx world is because there are soo many different setups you can go with. And they are cheap to mod when compared to other engines, i spent 1000 on all the parts for my cam swap, push rods, cam, valve springs, oil pump, double roller timing chain. For my friend with his 99 cobra his cam swap was almsot 3k. His car cammed with full bolt ons made 355whp(side note my ls1 with just bolt ons made 355whp), my ls1 with bolt ons and cam swap 402whp. Now i understand that the ls1 is a 5.7liter and the cobra engine was a 4.6, but the 4.6 4 valve is a better engine than the 4.6 3valve. With those engines the best way to go is FI and then its gets realllllyyyy expensive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolksey85 Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 Serious parts are out there for the 5.7/6.1. Just not as common as the LS series. Cams are still available, plenty of header choices, Indy Heads has a (or is working on) a stroker kit to take it the legendary 426 CI mark. It's just that the LS has had a 5 or 6 year head start. I heard a while ago that the 5.7/6.1 didn't respond to big mods as well as the LS motors, though. http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=CC&Category_Code=EFIHemiCams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTTuner Posted May 26, 2009 Author Share Posted May 26, 2009 When I was at Dodge, we did an SRT8 killer kit for a customer in his 5.7 Charger. Heads, a 6.1 cam, intake manifold, shorty headers, high flow cats, new PCM and new TCM and injectors. Dyno'd at 399rwhp. Cost with install, $7900.00:eek:. http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1040445#poststop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05GT Guru Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 When I was at Dodge, we did an SRT8 killer kit for a customer in his 5.7 Charger. Heads, a 6.1 cam, intake manifold, shorty headers, high flow cats, new PCM and new TCM and injectors. Dyno'd at 399rwhp. Cost with install, $7900.00:eek:. http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1040445#poststop Nice price tag, i do all my own labor on things that arent covered under warrentys. I spent about 2,500 in mods and made 427whp. But thats with no labor costs other than the 300 bucks i paid a speed shop for head work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05GT Guru Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 Serious parts are out there for the 5.7/6.1. Just not as common as the LS series. Cams are still available, plenty of header choices, Indy Heads has a (or is working on) a stroker kit to take it the legendary 426 CI mark. It's just that the LS has had a 5 or 6 year head start. I heard a while ago that the 5.7/6.1 didn't respond to big mods as well as the LS motors, though. http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=CC&Category_Code=EFIHemiCams Most engines dont respond like lsx engines, i made 307whp stock. With slp lid, pacestter long tubes, hooker catback the car made 355whp. Pretty big gains for 3 bolt ons, then i had it street tuned by a friend and dynoed it to see what it did, it put down like 365-368whp soemwhere in there dont remember exact. Then the cam swap put me at 402whp but now it made power until almost 7krpms instead of 6krpms. And then ported 241 casting heads(stock heads) and a fast 90/90 intake manifold and throttle body swap got me to 427whp/414wtrq. All runs were made at the same shop with the same drivetrain but obvisouly on different days And like i said i know they have mods but all the mods paths are the same. You have literally hundreds of cam options, head options, internals options from 346 stock to 409 strokers and many sizes in between on the lsx platform. Yes the ls1 cam out in 96 way before the srt-8 did, i just hope they are still wanting to make mods for these cars because its seem like a pretty limited aftermarket world. The ls2 was put in production in 05 and that engine has tons more options than the srt-8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godwhomismike Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 I'm hoping Ford does a Mach 1 or Boss 302 edition with a shaker hood, on this current 2010+ Mustang generation. I'm a Mustang fan. If I had a choice out of the three, it would be the Mustang GT. Definitely not the quickest of the bunch, but it is far lighter and better handling. http://i43.tinypic.com/2wn8p5h.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracer-X Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 No body has mentioned that both the Mustang and Challenger can be bought with Track Packs and the Camaro can not. Jump on it, Let's do it, Ride it, My Pony... EL4NFZT7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godwhomismike Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 No body has mentioned that both the Mustang and Challenger can be bought with Track Packs and the Camaro can not. I need to look it up, but I've heard rumblings about brake issues on the new Camaro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aczwild Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 I need to look it up, but I've heard rumblings about brake issues on the new Camaro.Yup brake issues (they have to weight the Brembos like when you have your rims balanced and to top it all off like I said further up, the front bumper cracks and starts to pull away on high speed runs. Great product GM! JDM'd All to hell Thanks Jimmy @ Hkc-Speed.com! RIP Coxx & Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aczwild Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Cracking: http://jalopnik.com/5238125/camaro-grilles-cracking-at-high-speed#viewcomments Brakes: http://jalopnik.com/5222908/2010-chevy-camaro-gets-mysterious-brake-weights JDM'd All to hell Thanks Jimmy @ Hkc-Speed.com! RIP Coxx & Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolksey85 Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 I want to join this Camaro forum I'm reading just to call these guys foking morons. Afraid to give credit where it's due. It honestly sounds just like a forum full of 15 year olds. Bashing all 4-cyl cars because they don't have a V8 (Evo/S2000 included), a new Camaro will handle better than a R34 Skyline or Supra, how the new Camaro is the apparently the king of the road and so on. And then there's the complaints. They admit the car is a porker, the interior is still hideous, one guy has trans issues already along with a rough idle. Apparently the new Camaro is the best car ever made. Praise them to the high heaven then the complaints start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.