BoxerGT2.5 Posted December 20, 2005 Share Posted December 20, 2005 exactly. (unless you dont mind spending a sh!tload of cash) It's not a matter of $$$, it's a matter of limited production and Mazda ECU's are a PITA to crack and figure out. It took a very long time for anyone to come out with power mods for the Rx-8 and it wasn't because the engine is complicated (it is quiet simple), it was the ECU. Even now people arn't sure and tuning is hit or miss with a few blown engines. OBAMA......One Big Ass Mistake America! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rallispec Posted December 20, 2005 Share Posted December 20, 2005 It's not a matter of $$$, it's a matter of limited production and Mazda ECU's are a PITA to crack and figure out. It took a very long time for anyone to come out with power mods for the Rx-8 and it wasn't because the engine is complicated (it is quiet simple), it was the ECU. Even now people arn't sure and tuning is hit or miss with a few blown engines. Yeah, it will be interesting to see how it's played out. CP-E has managed to do some good things as far as intakes go and bypassing the ECU to fool it into putting out more power in the 6i and 6s models. They're attempting something similar for the MS6 which should put out decent gains. A number of other companies are working on Intercooler and exhaust setups, but i'm not sure how they're going to tackle the tuning issue. i'm confident they'll figure out something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imperator Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 I bought the LGT cause it's AWD and quick. That's it. For $23,500 (not an uncommon price from what I've seen) it's a kickass deal. I find it strange how much people expect from such a cheap car. The MS6 as tested by R&T does 0-60 in 6 sec. That's not quick, sorry ricers. By contrast, the Legacy tested by Autoweek did 0-60 at 5.2 sec. Not really much of a contest, is it? Subarus are rough around the edges, but deliver the goods. Mazda just doesn't have the same performance pedigree; STI has been setting the pace with Mitsubishi for over a decade now. I'm amazed at all the impassioned negative comments about piddly nonsense non-problems with the LGT. What did you expect for the money? You can't get everything perfect at his price point. "Boohoo, help, my clutch stinks when I slip it for 45 minutes in traffic. Boohoo the mats are thin. Sniffle, the stock tires suck. Sob, the car shudders when I lug the engine. Whimper, can't they do something about the plastic interior?" Whenever my clutch stinks I ask myself: "who cares?", take a big whiff and smoke the guy in the next lane. Unbelievable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDC Tuning Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 :stupid::stupid::stupid::stupid: couldnt have said it better myself i could have had an EVO, STI, Porsche whetever but after tuning and driving a TON of cars over the last yer the LGT won :icon_bigg I bought the LGT cause it's AWD and quick. That's it. For $23,500 (not an uncommon price from what I've seen) it's a kickass deal. I find it strange how much people expect from such a cheap car. The MS6 as tested by R&T does 0-60 in 6 sec. That's not quick, sorry ricers. By contrast, the Legacy tested by Autoweek did 0-60 at 5.2 sec. Not really much of a contest, is it? Subarus are rough around the edges, but deliver the goods. Mazda just doesn't have the same performance pedigree; STI has been setting the pace with Mitsubishi for over a decade now. I'm amazed at all the impassioned negative comments about piddly nonsense non-problems with the LGT. What did you expect for the money? You can't get everything perfect at his price point. "Boohoo, help, my clutch stinks when I slip it for 45 minutes in traffic. Boohoo the mats are thin. Sniffle, the stock tires suck. Sob, the car shudders when I lug the engine. Whimper, can't they do something about the plastic interior?" Whenever my clutch stinks I ask myself: "who cares?", take a big whiff and smoke the guy in the next lane. Unbelievable. TDC Tunings LGT Forum Cobb, Perrin, APS, Invidia, Megan racing and MORE!! Your #1 source For Subaru / Legacy GT performance parts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melayout Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 I bought the LGT cause it's AWD and quick. That's it. For $23,500 (not an uncommon price from what I've seen) it's a kickass deal. I find it strange how much people expect from such a cheap car. The MS6 as tested by R&T does 0-60 in 6 sec. That's not quick, sorry ricers. By contrast, the Legacy tested by Autoweek did 0-60 at 5.2 sec. Not really much of a contest, is it? Subarus are rough around the edges, but deliver the goods. Mazda just doesn't have the same performance pedigree; STI has been setting the pace with Mitsubishi for over a decade now. I'm amazed at all the impassioned negative comments about piddly nonsense non-problems with the LGT. What did you expect for the money? You can't get everything perfect at his price point. "Boohoo, help, my clutch stinks when I slip it for 45 minutes in traffic. Boohoo the mats are thin. Sniffle, the stock tires suck. Sob, the car shudders when I lug the engine. Whimper, can't they do something about the plastic interior?" Whenever my clutch stinks I ask myself: "who cares?", take a big whiff and smoke the guy in the next lane. Unbelievable. *ZING* My turbo was replaced and it looks like I'll be getting a new shortblock, even then I would still buy an LGT in a heartbeat. I keed I keeed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emorphien Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 *ZING* My turbo was replaced and it looks like I'll be getting a new shortblock, even then I would still buy an LGT in a heartbeat. What the hell happened? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melayout Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 What the hell happened? I had excessive oil consumption from 10K miles on and after doing an oil consumption they triaged it to a busted turbo cartridge @ ~40k miles. Replaced turbo and got the car back but it still consumed oil and I got a Misfire CEL on Cyl #2(happened before, spark plugs burnt up, all replaced), so went back to dealer to find that the oil filter was leaking(faulty, there is a TSB out) and they couldn't resolve the misfire on Cyl #2 because it turns out the compression is busted on Cyl #2. I asked if this happened before and what was the resolution, the dealer said they saw it on an STi and it needed a new shortblock. It could also be just the heads/valves. Plus, I still have a harsh shift shock on the 2nd->3rd shift on my 5EAT. Now, I'm just waiting for the final word on what's gonna happen. I keed I keeed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emorphien Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 Doh, your car didn't come of the assembly line 100% did it? I hope they make it right, it's a great car and bummers can come from any car manufacturer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobY Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 Doh, your car didn't come of the assembly line 100% did it? I hope they make it right, it's a great car and bummers can come from any car manufacturer. Id be willing to bet they forgot to add the cylindrical aluminum spacer device under the headlamps. Maybe you can ask the factory for one for x-mas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eles1 Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 Id be willing to bet they forgot to add the cylindrical aluminum spacer device under the headlamps. Maybe you can ask the factory for one for x-mas. mmmmm......beeeeeerrr..... :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eles1 Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 I had excessive oil consumption from 10K miles on and after doing an oil consumption they triaged it to a busted turbo cartridge @ ~40k miles. Replaced turbo and got the car back but it still consumed oil and I got a Misfire CEL on Cyl #2(happened before, spark plugs burnt up, all replaced), so went back to dealer to find that the oil filter was leaking(faulty, there is a TSB out) and they couldn't resolve the misfire on Cyl #2 because it turns out the compression is busted on Cyl #2. I asked if this happened before and what was the resolution, the dealer said they saw it on an STi and it needed a new shortblock. It could also be just the heads/valves. Plus, I still have a harsh shift shock on the 2nd->3rd shift on my 5EAT. Now, I'm just waiting for the final word on what's gonna happen. But how?? I though subaru's were InviNsibull !!1!!1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eles1 Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 I'm amazed at all the impassioned negative comments about piddly nonsense non-problems with the LGT. What did you expect for the money? You can't get everything perfect at his price point. "Boohoo, help, my clutch stinks when I slip it for 45 minutes in traffic. Boohoo the mats are thin. Sniffle, the stock tires suck. Sob, the car shudders when I lug the engine. Whimper, can't they do something about the plastic interior?" Let's wait and see if you're still singing that same tune after you've had to replace the ECU on your own dime because the warranty's out and SOA still hasn't figured out the issues with it. Or maybe after you have to pop for a new paint job because the original paint has completely stone-chipped away... I'm not saying the MS6 doesn't have problems of its own, just that it may be worth checking out. The LGT is nice but far from perfect when it comes to quality... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psucaptainkickass Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 I just came from a local mazda dealer, and they had the MS6 right next to a new M6, and you know what, it bummed me out even more. The interiors on both vehicles are virtually identical. In addition, the tail light are exactly the same, and the headlamps are virtually identical. The M6 and MS6 both have the tip within a tip exhaust assembly. Yeah, the MS6 has more options, like NAV for instance, but there was enough that was the same between the two models, that you really are paying more for the engine and rims. If I was shopping for Mazdas, getting the MS6 would feel far less exclusive than I had previously thought it would be. You might say the same argument holds true between the 2.5i and the 2.5 GT. The difference is that the GT isn't marketed as some exclusive "zoom-zoom" vehicle. Actually, none of subaru's products are, even the STi. Subaru has always been about here is our stuff, if you want to go faster...we got you covered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanboy Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 Umm, how about the Legacy GT Spec B? And it is more than engine and rims. AWD, suspension changes, brakes, chassis braces... -B -B http://www.standardshift.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psucaptainkickass Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 What I guess I am getting at is that if people come in on how the MS6 is marketed, then people will be disappointed when they see it in person. The Spec B isn't marketed as some exclusive vehicle. Sure, it has a limited run of 500, but no one knows about it, because it hasn't been advertised. I haven't seen a single magazine or tv spot illustrating the Spec. B, and its limited run of 500. If I hadn't heard of this forum, I would have never known that a Spec. B existed. When I went to the Subie dealer, I saw the Spec B, and a salesman walked by saying that its limited to 500. Therefore, if you get one...you should feel like you got something rare..and you do, with the rims, suspension, red leather, and 5sp. NAV, because no one getting a 2006 LGT can those options...esp NAV and 5mt. But Mazda doesn't want to sell only 500 Speed 6's, however, its advertised as something that is limited. All I am saying is it disappointing to the consumer if someone can get pretty much the same interior features, most of the styling in a lower model when the higher model is advertised as something "so much better" Sorry if this post is long...I usually don't make much sense in the morning..hehe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 Long post - MS6 may be a nice car but I'm not convinced of the longevity of the drivetrain and I'm definitely not about to re-think my opinion on the drivetrain layout and the cobbled together AWD system. SBT - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunderkind Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 wouldn't that be the same with a 5-series and an M5? Or a wrx with an STi? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imperator Posted December 28, 2005 Share Posted December 28, 2005 The LGT is nice but far from perfect when it comes to quality... dude... isn't that what I said? You're a perfect example. wahwah it has cheap paint. With the LGT you get cheap paint, smelly clutch, crappy stock tires, juddery diffs, etc. Who cares about the freaking paint? It's faster than anything in it's price range, AWD, with the potential for substantially more performance. Again, what do you expect for 25 grand or so; it's a cheap car. Buy cheap - get cheap. If you want 26 coats of hand buffed paint get a Ferrari. If you're saying that reliability is an issue with Subarus in general, then you've got a warped sense of perspective and I couldn't imagine the fit you would throw after dropping 50K on a Audi or Mercedes and having it spend more time in the shop than on the road. Holy crap, how could you miss my point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eles1 Posted December 28, 2005 Share Posted December 28, 2005 Who cares about the freaking paint? It's faster than anything in it's price range, AWD, with the potential for substantially more performance. You've been hiding under a rock, my friend... Here's a short list of cars in the LGT's price range that are capable of similar if not greater performance: Altima V6, SRT-4, Cobalt SS, Impala SS, Pontiac GXP, and now - the Mazda MS6 as well. If you're saying that reliability is an issue with Subarus in general, then you've got a warped sense of perspective My new 2000 Grand Prix had fewer problems than my LGT. That's a GM product, mind you. Believe it or not, you don't have to move the whole way up to a Ferrari to find a paint job that doesn't practically peel off as you're driving it down the road. If it were just the paint, or just the interior problems, or just the ecu (which I'll be getting replaced in a couple of weeks due to the infamous cooling fan problems - hope that's the end of that), I could handle it - but it's all of that and probably more. Not to mention the fact that SOA doesn't even know how to fix some of the ECU issues. But hey, no big deal... It's just a cheap car, right?? I think you simply don't have much experience when it comes to car ownership - perhaps you've never owned a truely trouble-free automobile. Holy crap, how could you miss my point? Assuming you actually made a point somewhere, I think I missed it again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imperator Posted December 28, 2005 Share Posted December 28, 2005 Altima V6, SRT-4, Cobalt SS, Impala SS, Pontiac GXP... ok I guess the ability to do long, precisely controlled four-wheel powerdrifts on demand in the rain doesn't count for much, my bad. Sorry but there's just another whole level of ability with an awd road car... really, Altima>=LGT?? cobalt? ok Don't be so snotty, I've only had about a dozen cars, mostly Volkswagens and Saabs, maybe that's not enough. What does that have to do with anything? btw, honestly, I think you got a lemon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emorphien Posted December 28, 2005 Share Posted December 28, 2005 btw, honestly, I think you got a lemon No kidding. Having had a fair share of different cars in my family and knowing the experiences of others, you got lucky with the Pontiac and pwned with a lemon subaru. But hey, you don't have to agree with the statistics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eles1 Posted December 30, 2005 Share Posted December 30, 2005 But hey, you don't have to agree with the statistics. Statistics?!? The new 05 LGT hasn't been out anywhere near long enough for there to be any reliable statistics yet. If you have some please post them up I'd be interested to see them... How 'bout some statistics on the first year Subaru Baja? I think I have some of those here somewhere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eles1 Posted December 30, 2005 Share Posted December 30, 2005 really, Altima>=LGT?? cobalt? ok In the "performance per dollar" category, which seems to be all you're interested in, yes. Don't be so snotty, You reap what you sow.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imperator Posted December 30, 2005 Share Posted December 30, 2005 Statistics?!? The new 05 LGT hasn't been out anywhere near long enough for there to be any reliable statistics yet. If you have some please post them up I'd be interested to see them... How 'bout some statistics on the first year Subaru Baja? I think I have some of those here somewhere Does the fact that Consumer Reports rates Subaru as the number one auto brand in reliability mean anything? This statistic was generated using 2005 data, including the Legacy... Subaru may not be perfect, but they're better than everyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imperator Posted December 30, 2005 Share Posted December 30, 2005 Here's a short list of cars in the LGT's price range that are capable of similar if not greater performance: Altima V6, SRT-4, Cobalt SS, Impala SS, Pontiac GXP I wonder why I thought you said a Cobalt equals or outperforms a LGT? Must've been because you said it... I think you're too upset over your lemon to discuss this objectively. Those cars are all substantially slower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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