xt2005bonbon Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 You still did not check valve clearance right? Pretty easy compared to this tgv work you just did. take off valve cover, measure clearance. done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzAvi8r Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 no, not yet. I suppose I could do that as well. ToDo List: - check valve clearance on LH head - run a warm idle log on LGT - count teeth for timing - bleed power steering pump (later down the road) - hook up boost gauge to OBXT and read idle vacuum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xt2005bonbon Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Personally, I am not sure if it is worth going through the hassle of installing that boost gauge. I kinna doubt that btssm is reporting a wrong boost/vacuum value. And if you had an issue there, I would suspect it'd affect all cylinders, not just one bank. On your list, I would first count the teeth btw. You do have to take the crank pulley off but you know that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzAvi8r Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 not the crank pulley, but the harmonic balancer, right? Kinda need the crank pulley to be on there to count teeth... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators BarManBean Posted December 21, 2017 Moderators Share Posted December 21, 2017 crank pulley / harmonic balancer are the same thing with these cars, although technically I don't believe the pulley acts as a harmonic balancer for these cars according to subaru. You would need the crank sprocket to count the teeth, for sure, but the outer "pulley" needs to come off. "Bullet-proof" your OEM TMIC! <<Buy your kit here>> Not currently in stock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xt2005bonbon Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 I usually refer to the 'harmonic balancer' as the crankshaft pulley and the other to the crankshaft sproket. And yeah, you need the latter on to count teeth obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzAvi8r Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 sorry, I was calling the crank gear the crank pulley. but yeah, have to remove the harmonic balancer/crank pulley just to get the covers off anyway. that's more than common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 I have not reset valve lash. I'm kind of intimidated to do that. I don't really want to replace any buckets either. For the record, I still think it's timing; I just don't know how. I thought you had checked everything "valves", bucket measurements, reset lash, etc., during reassembly and brought everything to spec. Certainly much easy to do out of the car, but now that you indicate that you haven't done that, that's immediately where I'd start, especially if the tooth count and everything on the front end lines-up where it's supposed to be. If I missed that you hadn't done the valve adjustments, I apologize. That's the first thing I would have pointed you to. A dime to a donut, that's likely where your LC and misfires is originating. Especially with leakdown done on a cold engine. - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzAvi8r Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 that's fair. I guess it's time to pull the engine again, huh? let me count the teeth first and if that checks out, i'll pull the motor again this weekend and go over that head with a fine toothed comb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Just take your time and follow the FSM on the valve adjustment. Replace the HG if/when you pull that head. Don't make that a point of failure going forward. - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzAvi8r Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 Can I reuse the brand new head gasket that I just put on there, or do I need a new one since this one has technically been "crushed" already? If so, i'll probably go with a 6star gasket instead of the OEM one. as for valve adjustment, I may be misunderstanding something here. I thought I would have to replace the buckets themselves if the valve lash is out of spec? I didn't think you could actually adjust the valves themselves and reuse the same width bucket. I guess I'll just have to read the FSM while I'm sitting on the shitter later... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators BarManBean Posted December 21, 2017 Moderators Share Posted December 21, 2017 Replace the gasket. You are correct on replacing the offending buckets, as needed. If you are servicing a head you can move your existing buckets around to get as many valves at appropriate clearances, then you need to buy new buckets for whatever is left based on your measurements / math. "Bullet-proof" your OEM TMIC! <<Buy your kit here>> Not currently in stock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzAvi8r Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 cool. I can math well. i'm not going to remove the head at all then. there's no need to remove the head to replace buckets or check valve clearance. the valves and seats looked good when I had them off anyway. pictures are posted in the beginning of the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzAvi8r Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 ****.... it's not timing -- counted the teeth and they all check out fine. on to the valve lash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 ^ This. We all should have caught this sooner. Be sure to check 1 and 3 too. If 2 and 4 were/are off, there's likely some changes on bank 1 as well. - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators BarManBean Posted December 21, 2017 Moderators Share Posted December 21, 2017 Check your lash BEFORE you remove the timing belt. Just because. Write down those measurements and you can compare with timing belt off if you feel like it. "Bullet-proof" your OEM TMIC! <<Buy your kit here>> Not currently in stock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Good point - was just about to make that. Don't bench-set your lash and then reinstall your head and expect that to be okay. The belt torque will load/unload your cams - hard to believe, but true - and affect your measurements. - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators BarManBean Posted December 21, 2017 Moderators Share Posted December 21, 2017 I'm actually only saying it because some people here will inevitably say it. Personally, I believe that bench-setting your lash within spec is just fine. Machine shops have to do it all the time. "Bullet-proof" your OEM TMIC! <<Buy your kit here>> Not currently in stock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 I'm too anal, and have found that machine shops often fudge it to get it "good-enough". True Subaru shops not as much, but you're typical non-Subaru shop will. ISTR BoxKita posting about his less than stellar experience. - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators BarManBean Posted December 21, 2017 Moderators Share Posted December 21, 2017 I'm too anal, and have found that machine shops often fudge it to get it "good-enough". True Subaru shops not as much, but you're typical non-Subaru shop will. ISTR BoxKita posting about his less than stellar experience. I'm not saying to fudge it. Seriously though, it's not realistic to expect that the starting point for setting lash is ALWAYS going to be a long block with timing belt installed. Plenty of starts will be bare heads or anything in between a LB with timing belt and just a pile of parts. If you set it in the middle of spec and then install (this is NOT fudging things or saying "eh, it's close enough) and actually know how to use feeler gauges, you should be just fine. Given the option and opportunity to measure with the timing belt on? By all means, don't throw that opportunity away and just do it. "Bullet-proof" your OEM TMIC! <<Buy your kit here>> Not currently in stock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzAvi8r Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 agreed. not taking the timing belt off at all. I mean, the timing is set correctly and there's no reason to remove it until I've determined that new buckets are in order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Can I reuse the brand new head gasket that I just put on there, or do I need a new one since this one has technically been "crushed" already? If so, i'll probably go with a 6star gasket instead of the OEM one. as for valve adjustment, I may be misunderstanding something here. I thought I would have to replace the buckets themselves if the valve lash is out of spec? I didn't think you could actually adjust the valves themselves and reuse the same width bucket. I guess I'll just have to read the FSM while I'm sitting on the shitter later... Replace the gasket. Check to make sure that the 6S gasket is dimensionally the same thickness as your OEM one on the other side. Thickness changes side-to-side result in compression differences and you don't want the engine unbalanced with more or less CR on one side vs the other. Spreadsheet all of your bucket measurements, and then use the program to figure out which ones can replace another and be within spec. Good possibility you can make one work and the spreadsheet will show you that immediately. Might save you having to buy more than you think you do. Perhaps xt2005bonbon would send you a copy of his valve lash computation spreadsheet - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzAvi8r Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 yup, time to bust out the micrometer and feeler gauges! I'll report back later tonight with the numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehsnils Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 If the clearance checks out then you need to take off the head. Make sure you inspect the gasket thoroughly as well to see if you have had blow-by between the cylinders in some obscure way that wouldn't be noted on the leak-down test. Miscoloring of the headgasket could tell a lot. And if you don't see anything at all when it comes to the headgaskets then it's time to look at the sprockets that they are indeed correctly mounted on the camshafts. If they are according to the pics I posted above it's still a possibility. I know that I'm paranoid, but it don't hurt to be thorough. And for locating cracks in alu block/head: [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=109-Uzu2ihw]Aluminum block crack detection techniques (magnaflux dye penetrant) - YouTube[/ame] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xt2005bonbon Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 I'm actually only saying it because some people here will inevitably say it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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