JF1GG29 Posted December 2, 2016 Share Posted December 2, 2016 They were benchmarking the car against a Ford Explorer and a CX-9. It'll probably get a 2.x H4 turbo and probably an H6 option. I don't see Subaru developing a completely new engine. They're probably still working on FA and FB variants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDII Posted December 2, 2016 Share Posted December 2, 2016 Ya'll are funny thinking subaru will put anything but an H6 and a CVT in this thing Need forum help? Private Message legGTLT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hkshooter Posted December 4, 2016 Share Posted December 4, 2016 It doesn't need HP, it needs torque and plenty of it. I agree with ^. A four banger of any flavor in this thing would be a joke. Gotta be some flavor of the H6 I'm betting, or some as of yet unrevealed other engine, possibly borrowed from another company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehsnils Posted December 4, 2016 Share Posted December 4, 2016 The 2.0l diesel I had before had about as much torque as the H6, from low rpms. Unfortunately the gasoline engine I have in the current vehicle lacks that nice torque curve the diesel had. But a turbo designed to give good torque at low rpms is a possibility at the expense of max power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The B4 Posted December 4, 2016 Share Posted December 4, 2016 We've seen V12 super cars downsized into V8 Turbos, V8 Trucks downsized into V6 Turbos (towing and all), and V6 SUVs and sports cars downsized into 4 cyl Turbos. CX-9, XC90, and Explorer all use 4's with only the Explorer offering something bigger than a 4. Heck, the new Acadia weighs 4,000 lbs and is running around with a normally aspirated 4 cyl. Subaru could definitely outgun the current H6 in fuel economy and power with a 4. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hkshooter Posted December 4, 2016 Share Posted December 4, 2016 The 2.0l diesel I had before had about as much torque as the H6, from low rpms. Unfortunately the gasoline engine I have in the current vehicle lacks that nice torque curve the diesel had. But a turbo designed to give good torque at low rpms is a possibility at the expense of max power. Diesel didn't even enter my mind, thanks for that. I highly doubt Subaru with it's "green" reputation would do diesel with current technology. VW is way more advanced and they had to cheat to meet regs. We've seen V12 super cars downsized into V8 Turbos, V8 Trucks downsized into V6 Turbos (towing and all), and V6 SUVs and sports cars downsized into 4 cyl Turbos. CX-9, XC90, and Explorer all use 4's with only the Explorer offering something bigger than a 4. Heck, the new Acadia weighs 4,000 lbs and is running around with a normally aspirated 4 cyl. Subaru could definitely outgun the current H6 in fuel economy and power with a 4. I can't argue that fact but only offer up that if the Subie is as large as a Tahoe it would take one hot rod and over worked 4 to haul it around. People bitch about under-powered cars and trucks already, I can only imagine the wailing and gnashing of teeth if Subie intros a 5000lb beast with a four, buyer piles the kids and 300# of gear into it then goes on a mountain trip. Forget towing a small trailer with it at the same time. It's not a vehicle I'd buy, period. There's a case for and support locally for the H6 in the new SUV and there's already a host of people who say even the H6 is under-powered for the Legacy. I have no clue what will wind up in the new truck but I hope it has some balls and longevity. Otherwise SIA will have made a marketing mistake. A big one. This whole conversation reminds me of a test drive I took in a new Nissan Xterra, somewhere around 2002 or 2003. Super charged four cyl in what I'd call a mid-sized SUV. The 1987 Nissan Pathfinder I was currently driving had more balls than that POS. We barely made it around the block before the wife and I looked at each other and knew there was no way. Couldn't get that thing back to the dealer fast enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehsnils Posted December 4, 2016 Share Posted December 4, 2016 Diesel didn't even enter my mind, thanks for that. I highly doubt Subaru with it's "green" reputation would do diesel with current technology. VW is way more advanced and they had to cheat to meet regs. It seems like the Subaru Diesel is going out too, it seems like it's going to be short-lived partially due to the VW cheating. However now when we see the DIT engines they are practically diesel engines so I suspect that Subaru did learn quite a bit from the diesel engine and applied some of that knowledge in the DIT engines. A DIT is not far from being a diesel engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JF1GG29 Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 I can't argue that fact but only offer up that if the Subie is as large as a Tahoe it would take one hot rod and over worked 4 to haul it around. People bitch about under-powered cars and trucks already, I can only imagine the wailing and gnashing of teeth if Subie intros a 5000lb beast with a four, buyer piles the kids and 300# of gear into it then goes on a mountain trip. Forget towing a small trailer with it at the same time. It's not a vehicle I'd buy, period. Subaru never learned the minivan lesson in the US market. The engine is fine (250hp to 290hp is class-competitive), but the real problem is in the transmission. Load up a 4000# car with 7 passengers, weekend gear, pull a small camper into the mountains and you may need a more robust driveline than anything Subaru has now aside from the STi. Subaru and Nissan make probably what are the most robust CVT transmissions on the market today. Nissan has shown it can work with the Pathfinder, which is basically the same type of car that the new Subaru will be. I don't know if the CVT in Subaru's WRX or H6 Outback is going to cut the mustard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hkshooter Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 Subaru never learned the minivan lesson in the US market. The engine is fine (250hp to 290hp is class-competitive), but the real problem is in the transmission. Load up a 4000# car with 7 passengers, weekend gear, pull a small camper into the mountains and you may need a more robust driveline than anything Subaru has now aside from the STi. Subaru and Nissan make probably what are the most robust CVT transmissions on the market today. Nissan has shown it can work with the Pathfinder, which is basically the same type of car that the new Subaru will be. I don't know if the CVT in Subaru's WRX or H6 Outback is going to cut the mustard. I know little about the STI but doesn't it use the same HT-CVT that's on the H6? Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golferdude1087 Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 I know little about the STI but doesn't it use the same HT-CVT that's on the H6? Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk Sti uses a 6mt, not the CVT The old 3.6R sourced JATCO 5EAT can do far more then Subaru ever did. Its found littered in the nissan/Infiniti lineup on V6/V8. It was even used in the Infiniti QX56/Nissan Armada. That's rated for 320hp/390tq and can tow 9000 in a 5300lb car Even though it's a dinosaur, it's plenty capable of handling that type of car Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JF1GG29 Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 Not sure about other markets, but the STi only gets a DCCD-6MT in the US. There is a HT-CVT in the 2015 WRX, and I'm sure tunes can put that motor into the 300hp range. However, people don't usually use WRXs the way that people would use a 7-seater family car. FWIW, the Pathfinder is rated to tow 6,000lbs., makes 260ft-lbs., all on a CVT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hkshooter Posted December 6, 2016 Share Posted December 6, 2016 Thanks for the info, guys. I've learned something today. Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JF1GG29 Posted December 6, 2016 Share Posted December 6, 2016 The real question is if the CVT will hold up to it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehsnils Posted December 7, 2016 Share Posted December 7, 2016 The HT-CVT is most likely the alternative for a minivan. Probably paired with a 2 liter or 2.2 liter DIT tuned for stronger mid-range. I have driven the 1.6 DIT and it's similar to the 2.5i when it comes to how it behaves - not much at the low end, something in the middle and then anemic at the high end. For a larger car a larger engine is needed. Still makes me wonder about the potential for the 1.6DIT with 170hp considering that the 2.0DIT has some 300hp. I suspect that it would be possible with not too much effort to get 250hp from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brandon.mol Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 I'm guessing that Subaru is going o start augmenting power output using hybrid technology since they invested so heavily is supporting that in their new platform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLlegacy Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 We just bought an Odyssey and it is rated around 265 Hp and that is plenty in a family hauler. I don't see how Subaru couldn't match that out of an H4 just like Mazda is doing with its turbo 4 in the CX9. Granted running power to all 4 wheels will cost a couple horsepower here and there, but I could definitely see a 2.0DIT or something thereabouts powering this suv without issues and probably firmly in the middle of the pack in its class as far as performance goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brandon.mol Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 My guess is something larger displacement than 2.0 and with a small, quick spooling turbo focussing on low end power. Probably able to run on regular fuel at a reduced power output like what Mazda did in the CX-9. You can't sell a bread and butter model requiring premium fuel. A vehicle in this class is expected to be able to tow 5000lbs. At least 3500. I wouldn't be surprised if the base engine is a low pressure turbo H4 with an optional upgrade hybrid model that adds low end torque, fuel economy (and tow capacity) via the electric motors. Also viable is the electrically coupled turbocharger which could make a whole lot of sense along with a hybrid system. Turbine runs a generator and compressor running off capacitors/hybrid-battery. That's more likely in next gen wrx/sti though. </speculation> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golferdude1087 Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 My guess is something larger displacement than 2.0 and with a small, quick spooling turbo focussing on low end power. Probably able to run on regular fuel at a reduced power output like what Mazda did in the CX-9. You can't sell a bread and butter model requiring premium fuel. A vehicle in this class is expected to be able to tow 5000lbs. At least 3500. I wouldn't be surprised if the base engine is a low pressure turbo H4 with an optional upgrade hybrid model that adds low end torque, fuel economy (and tow capacity) via the electric motors. Also viable is the electrically coupled turbocharger which could make a whole lot of sense along with a hybrid system. Turbine runs a generator and compressor running off capacitors/hybrid-battery. That's more likely in next gen wrx/sti though. </speculation> The Indiana plant is building a 2.4L turbo now. That's probably it's power plant Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xt2005bonbon Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 The Indiana plant is building a 2.4L turbo now. That's probably it's power plant Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk Where did you get that info if you don't mind me asking ? Also, what is the expected ground clearance for this vehicle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laz Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 That name doe... http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg548/deexboy/viziv-7_zpsegww8ilc.jpg --- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLlegacy Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Where did you get that info if you don't mind me asking ? Also, what is the expected ground clearance for this vehicle? I would expect the ground clearance to be right around 8" like every other subaru utility vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golferdude1087 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Where did you get that info if you don't mind me asking ? Also, what is the expected ground clearance for this vehicle? One of the people on a 5th gen legacy facebook group works at the plant in Indiana and that's currently the new engine they are working on. Sadly I doubt this information is available anywhere online, Subaru is excellent at being tight lipped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLlegacy Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 I would assume this new engine is going to be based on the newer H4 design and hopefully utilize a timing chain. Curious though about the sizing...but I suppose efficiency is going to be a key to the success of the Viviz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hkshooter Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Interesting stuff. I had an SIA employee tell me a turbo four was tapped for the new ute, too. I hope the engine winds up a Legacy. Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xt2005bonbon Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 One of the people on a 5th gen legacy facebook group works at the plant in Indiana and that's currently the new engine they are working on. Sadly I doubt this information is available anywhere online, Subaru is excellent at being tight lipped. very nice. so 2.4 turbo dit huh. 350hp then for the future sti? I would assume this new engine is going to be based on the newer H4 design and hopefully utilize a timing chain. Curious though about the sizing...but I suppose efficiency is going to be a key to the success of the Viviz. Although you'd still need to change the guides. Interesting stuff. I had an SIA employee tell me a turbo four was tapped for the new ute, too. I hope the engine winds up a Legacy. Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk The new 'ute'? what do you mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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