Fuel Additives: Do you? If so, Recommendations?

[JmP6889928]

Just be sure you're not logging or tuning while you have some in your tank. Regardless of brand, it lowers your overall octane rating, and thus your resistance to knock.

 

The B-12 is great as mentioned, and for lubrication I use Klotz Uplon upper cylinder lubricant. Mostly just because I have it laying around as I use it as a lube for my methanol injection system anyway.

 

I don't know where you came up with fuel additives with solvent properties lowering octane ratings. That's not correct information, as is evidenced by the following:

 

Berryman's B12 per MSDS:

Toluene 40-50%

Acetone 20-30%

Methanol 20-30%

Methyl Ethyl Ketone <5%

Isopropyl Alcohol <5%

2-Butoxyethanol <5%

 

Toluene can be used as an octane booster in gasoline fuels used in internal combustion engines. Toluene at 86% by volume fueled all the turbo Formula 1 teams in the 1980s, first pioneered by the Honda team. Some teams had been running this so-called "black art mix" in their engines with as high as 73 p.s.i. of peak boost and the engines were surviving long enough to finish most races. The remaining 14% of the fuel was a "filler" of n-heptane, to reduce the octane to meet Formula 1 fuel restrictions. Toluene at 100% can be used as a fuel for both two-stroke and four-stroke engines; however, due to the density of the fuel and other factors, the fuel does not vaporize easily unless preheated to 70 degrees celsius (Honda accomplished this in their Formula 1 cars by routing the fuel lines through the muffler system to heat the fuel). Toluene also poses similar problems as alcohol fuels, as it eats through standard rubber fuel lines and has no lubricating properties as standard gasoline does, which can break down fuel pumps and cause upper cylinder bore wear.

 

Granted, most additives don't contain the same solvents that the B-12 does, but to make a general statement that fuel additives lower octane ratings is incorrect.

[BigTDogg MA]

Granted, most additives don't contain the same solvents that the B-12 does, but to make a general statement that fuel additives lower octane ratings is incorrect.

 

To generalize was my error. But I can say with certainty that the Redline SI-1 does indeed lower knock resistance.

 

Anything with Toluene certainly would not, as I know of people adding toluene to 93 to raise octane levels. Though its value is low due to the cost of the toluene.

[fishbone]

Maybe coincidental. But basically had to replace an engine in my Ford Escort then in my WRX..like I said, other contributing factors May have been the cause. But can't afford to keep on experimenting to narrow results and come to definite deduction. So I'll play it safe and eliminate that variable and go with the hypothesis.

I am fine with that, but don't spread FUD. The fact is you don't know what caused the failures and MMO just happened to be there.

Specifically, what failed in the WRX engine? Spun bearking? Cracked ringland? Melted piston? Seized muffler bearings? What?

[SBT]

I use SeeeeeYa's cocktail which comprises:

 

• Acetone
  
• Marvel Mystery Oil
  
• Chevron Techron
  

I buy the fluids in 1 gallon containers, then mix-up three (3), 12oz batches at a time.

 

How to mix and use:

• Pour 4oz of each fluid into three spare additive cans/bottles at a time -this makes three (3) 12oz bottles (36oz total). FWIW, I use Brianna Salad Dressing (superb dressing BTW) bottles because they're compact, and the tapered neck makes it easy to pour into the tank
  
• First use - Add one 12oz can to an empty tank, then fill-up,
  
• Second use - Add one 12oz can to a 1/2 empty tank, run it until empty
  
• Third use - Refill then add one 12oz can to the full tank.
  

I now add about 2x year for 12-15K a year driving. More if more driving.

 

Amazing stuff. Definitely runs smoother and it cleans and lubricates your injectors, your valves, cylinders and any cat-converter(s). And it's much cheaper per oz than anything you get at the autoparts stores.

Edited August 25, 2016 by SBT
interval change

[JmP6889928]

I use SeeeeeYa's cocktail which comprises:

 

• Acetone
  
• Marvel Mystery Oil
  
• Chevron Techron
  

I buy the fluids in 1 gallon containers, then mix-up three (3), 12oz batches at a time.

 

How to mix and use:

• Pour 4oz of each fluid into three spare additive cans/bottles at a time -this makes three (3) 12oz bottles (36oz total). FWIW, I use Brianna Salad Dressing (superb dressing BTW) bottles because they're compact, and the tapered neck makes it easy to pour into the tank
  
• First use - Add one 12oz can to an empty tank, then fill-up,
  
• Second use - Add one 12oz can to a 1/2 empty tank, run it until empty
  
• Third use - Refill then add one 12oz can to the full tank.
  

Thereafter, I just add it to every other empty tank, then fill and drive. Amazing stuff. Definitely runs smoother and it cleans and lubricates your injectors, your valves, cylinders and any cat-converter(s). And it's much cheaper per oz than anything you get at the autoparts stores.

 

Give us some cost figures on gallons of Acetone and Chevron. A 12 ounce bottle of Chevron generally runs about $8-$10 so a gallon has to be pretty pricey.

[root_galaxy]

Any response from the OP ?

 

Sorry I haven't responded, as soon as the chemists came out of the woodworks I got scared lol haven't tried anything yet.

[SBT]

Give us some cost figures on gallons of Acetone and Chevron. A 12 ounce bottle of Chevron generally runs about $8-$10 so a gallon has to be pretty pricey.

 

I paid a little over $35.00 for the gallon of Techron Concentrate (Techron Concentrate Plus is more expensive). Acetone I get from a painter friend for $14.00/gal. MMO I can get for $15.00/gal. So, ~$65.00 to make 32, 12oz bottles of SeeeeeYa's formula, or about $2.00/per. Bang-for-the-buck is worth it.

 

If I can find 5 gallons of each, think the price would be less than $1.00/per, but I'll stay with the gallon containers, because storing 15 gallons of that much highly flammable stuff is not easy.

[FJuan]

Berryman B-12 Chem Tool available at AutoZone for about $4. I used to rep 17 different kinds of fuel additives (Pyroil, Pennzoil, STP, 3M, Gumout, ProGard, Gold Eagle, Marvel Mystery Oil, and a few more) including Chevron with Techron and the Berryman is far above any of the fuel system cleaners on the market today. Most of the cleaners on the market today are simply denatured Kerosene or #1 Fuel Oil (smell them if you want to see for yourself) and they do nothing to actually clean. They do lubricate but that's not exactly what you want as a first defense. If you use the Berryman and THEN put one of the others in as a follow up, then you're clean and lubricated.

 

 

After reading your posts on B-12, I decide to give it a try a couple of days ago. I have to say after driving 50 + miles, I did notice the motor is running a lot smoother and my cold start hesitations are gone. Only used half the bottle this time and next fill up I'll put in the remaining amount. Last month I used a bottle of STP and didn't notice any difference, but with B-12 there was a noticable difference.

 

+1 on Berryman B-12

[JJr]

Just bought my Berryman B-12 will dump it in today. Update to follow!

[stuck686]

i throw in iso heet sometimes when its cold out. it starts better

[JmP6889928]

After reading your posts on B-12, I decide to give it a try a couple of days ago. I have to say after driving 50 + miles, I did notice the motor is running a lot smoother and my cold start hesitations are gone. Only used half the bottle this time and next fill up I'll put in the remaining amount. Last month I used a bottle of STP and didn't notice any difference, but with B-12 there was a noticable difference.

 

+1 on Berryman B-12

 

Follow your gas mileage closely and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised on this as well.

[FJuan]

Follow your gas mileage closely and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised on this as well.

That means I"ll have to drive normal in order to tell the difference.

[JJr]

so true!

[SBT]

Anyone else running SeeeeeYa's cocktail? If you want a proof of concept, get a 12 oz can of Techron Concentrate, a quart each of acetone and MMO. Mix as directed and try it out. Will make a believer out of you.

[dcgt05]

Question from a noob having only ever owned two practical Hondas and never having used any treatment of any kind: What's the story with these additives? They help clean and lubricate the engine components? How necessary is this and what's the difference between using an additive and never using one? Just got myself into an '05 Legacy GT but still have my Honda Element. Will I notice any difference using an additive in the Honda (very simple practical car) or is it more of a performance thing like what I've gotten myself into with the turbo Subie?

[JmP6889928]

Question from a noob having only ever owned two practical Hondas and never having used any treatment of any kind: What's the story with these additives? They help clean and lubricate the engine components? How necessary is this and what's the difference between using an additive and never using one? Just got myself into an '05 Legacy GT but still have my Honda Element. Will I notice any difference using an additive in the Honda (very simple practical car) or is it more of a performance thing like what I've gotten myself into with the turbo Subie?

 

You'll notice it in any vehicle that has some miles on it. The fuel injectors become varnished because of the styrene in gasoline, which is a by-product of the gasoline and additives you purchase at the station. The Berryman Chemtool B12 will dissolve those varnishes on contact and you'll realize a smoother running engine because the fuel injectors and fuel pump will operate much smoother and easier.

 

Just don't become addicted to it by using it too much. About every 8-10 tanks will keep everything nice and clean and you'll feel the difference in acceleration and also see it in gas mileage too.

[Max Capacity]

I'll say you have peaked my curiousity, I'm going to pick up a bottle and use it on my wagon.

I'll stop by Auto Zone tomorrow

[JJr]

Added a half bottle to my wife's 01 MDX with 155k I haven't driven it since and it was driving great prior so I don't expect to feel any difference, we'll see if it helps the gas mileage:), 1/2 bottle going into the MDX and the LGT next time we fill up.

[fishbone]

3rd tank with Marvel Mystery Oil plus two back to back treatments with Techron and nothing majorly different. I think I feel a tiny difference in smoothness that could be attributed to placebo. I will continue since I still have MMO and will report back. I think the Techron did make a difference, I notice about 1mpg increase but at the same time the temps have gotten cooler too and the car just runs better at this time.

Regarding cocktails, we need to be careful with applying the "I've done it since the car was new on several of my cars and never had an issue" logic because I could also say I bought tiger repellent, have been placing it around my house and look! No tigers! What I mean to say is we need to be careful with logical fallacies; with proper maintenance vehicles, on average, rarely develop fueling issues. I've owned several cars over 100K, one of them hit 187K and upon compression test it came back within factory specs, never burned oil, I've never paid attention to what gas I put in it, etc etc.

 

Regarding injectors cleaners, I'm going by what the BITOG geeks are saying, and that is that Chevron Techron concentrate is the most effective.

[JJr]

3rd tank with Marvel Mystery Oil plus two back to back treatments with Techron and nothing majorly different. I think I feel a tiny difference in smoothness that could be attributed to placebo. I will continue since I still have MMO and will report back. I think the Techron did make a difference, I notice about 1mpg increase but at the same time the temps have gotten cooler too and the car just runs better at this time.

Regarding cocktails, we need to be careful with applying the "I've done it since the car was new on several of my cars and never had an issue" logic because I could also say I bought tiger repellent, have been placing it around my house and look! No tigers! What I mean to say is we need to be careful with logical fallacies; with proper maintenance vehicles, on average, rarely develop fueling issues. I've owned several cars over 100K, one of them hit 187K and upon compression test it came back within factory specs, never burned oil, I've never paid attention to what gas I put in it, etc etc.

 

Regarding injectors cleaners, I'm going by what the BITOG geeks are saying, and that is that Chevron Techron concentrate is the most effective.

 

Is the Techron you're referring to, the bottles of Chevron fuel additive w/Techron I can buy in bulk at Costco?

[fishbone]

Well I am not sure what Costco has, but the stuff is called Techron fuel system cleaner and is made by Chevron. They have the concentrate plus version that treats up to 20 gallons.

[Chris GTO TT]

This is the only Techron you want, the others are diluted from what I have read. http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/11/12/y9e6y4e2.jpg

[JJr]

That's not what Costco has thx.

[fishbone]

Yep, that's the stuff.

The ingredient you want is PEA.

Techron used to list it on the bottle along with concentration, it was either 45% or 55%, I can't remember. It has since been removed although still made reference to on their site. It is considered a trade secret, that's why, some argue, is no longer listed in their MSDS.

 

Redline SL-1 is another injector cleaner that works, and I believe still specifically lists PEA at a concentration between 30% and 50%.

[JmP6889928]

3rd tank with Marvel Mystery Oil plus two back to back treatments with Techron and nothing majorly different. I think I feel a tiny difference in smoothness that could be attributed to placebo. I will continue since I still have MMO and will report back. I think the Techron did make a difference, I notice about 1mpg increase but at the same time the temps have gotten cooler too and the car just runs better at this time.

Regarding cocktails, we need to be careful with applying the "I've done it since the car was new on several of my cars and never had an issue" logic because I could also say I bought tiger repellent, have been placing it around my house and look! No tigers! What I mean to say is we need to be careful with logical fallacies; with proper maintenance vehicles, on average, rarely develop fueling issues. I've owned several cars over 100K, one of them hit 187K and upon compression test it came back within factory specs, never burned oil, I've never paid attention to what gas I put in it, etc etc.

 

Regarding injectors cleaners, I'm going by what the BITOG geeks are saying, and that is that Chevron Techron concentrate is the most effective.

 

I have a 2000 Dodge Grand Caravan AWD with just over 305K on it and the engine has never been apart and it will get around 23.5-24.0 mpg on the highway and I've been running the Berryman through it since I bought it in 2005 with 87K on it and it never has had a single issue with fuel injectors and it's still (knock on my wooden head) even on the original fuel pump. I've used this stuff in all of my vehicles and the only vehicle I own with less than 100K is my LGT. My wife's 2002 Exploder with just over 150K will get about 1 mpg better for 7-8 tankfuls when I put a bottle in and my other Chrysler T&C AWD has 167K on it and it runs about 23 mpg on the highway. I've been using it in this vehicle since I bought it at 61K.

 

Hell, I run it in my 97 OB Wagon with 2.5 DOHC that has 255K on it and it has never had a single fuel injector issue either. I'm second owner (bought it from my brother at 105K) and he ran Berryman in it from about 50K.

 

You can try all of them. I've tested all of them. Then try the Berryman and you'll actually feel and hear the difference in how it runs.