Kinugawa Turbo Review

[vako86]

Thanks,

 

after installing new chra I drove easily at firts for about 5 km (idled 30-40 min before driving) and after that tried higher rpm without full boost (boost up to 0.4-0.5 bar) and then I heard noice.

 

Now the engine needs to be disassembled and some special job to be done (dont know enough terminology in English to describe that). After that I have to drive easy for 1000 Km.

This car brought so much trouble and expense to me

[SBT]

Was this a new or used car when you purchased it?

[vako86]

Was this a new or used car when you purchased it?

It was used, I have imported it from Japan in April 2013, just a few months ago. for 4 months it worked and served fine and then the problems began. millage was 130 000 km, I drove 4500km. serve as recommended, Motul 5-40, it had no other problems, it was a 4-B grade car on Japanese car auction. Car had clear title, no accident.

Just I was not lucky this time

[SBT]

Fortunately, there should be a lot of good used (complete) engines available in your area that would enable you to easily swap one for your dead one.

 

Perhaps this conversation should move to the engine section now that it's evolved past the Kinugawa discussion.

[Adam393]

Well, after three months of being run pretty hard, my STS TD06H 20G gave it up.

 

I was getting on the freeway the other night and got on it a bit. 1st gear pulled nice and hard, but as soon as I shifted and got back in the throttle in 2nd there was no response from the engine.

 

As I was heading home to see what happened, I noticed that the turbo would whine instead of whistle and it wouldn't build any positive pressure. I pulled it last night and found quite a bit of play in the bearings and a chunk missing from the turbine.

 

I contacted Kinugawa today and sent them the pic of the turbine and they are sending me a new CHRA. I don't even have to ship the old one back. So, I'm pretty pleased. I ran that thing pretty hard. I had an FP turbo fail in 6 months after running it at 32 psi on my last car. FP was also super good about rebuilding their turbo under warranty.

 

I think I'm going to run less boost just to get some more life out of this new CHRA. Then, when I'm at the track I'll turn it up for a few passes.

 

How much psi were you running? I'm at 1.4bar tapering to 1.3bar, and running an anti-lag of sorts. Hope I don't blow a blade off

 

 

As a side note, I also have Kinugawa EL headers en route to me. I'll post up some pics, but that may be for another thread...

[BrandonspecB]

25 psi.

 

I'm going to sell it when I get the new CHRA. Just bought a GTX3576R.

[BrandonspecB]

Just thought I'd add it only took 3 days for the new CHRA to get to me from Taiwan.

 

Once I got it and installed it in the housings I found the turbine was rubbing on the housing. Apparently when the blade let go it messed up the housing too.

 

I emailed Bruce at Kinugawa and sent him a picture and he's sending me a brand new housing out.

 

I also have to add that he responds within a few hours of me emailing him. He'll even respond when I email late at night. I'm very pleased with their service.

[Little rascal]

Hi all,

 

I am far from having a race car, I am driving a Mitsubishi Delica... But I like to share my story as this could help others as well as they share similar turbo.

I only read positive reviews before getting a Kinugawa KAMAC turbo, then once I got into troubles with it, I started to find some negatives reviews... But too late...

The one I got was specific made for the car, link to the ebay ad here:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Kinugawa-Turbocharger-4M40T-2-8L-Pajero-Delica-TD04L-15T-5-add-50-Torque-/110855605754?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item19cf824dfa

 

Now, its a long post, and a first post, do not take it as negative, but more like a little warning on what can happen with the Taiwanese turbo as if I had read some of your post here about those failure I wouldn't have got one...

Cheers

Now, the long post, get the popcorn or the haggis

 

Kinugawa Turbo made by KAMAK DYNAMICS review, catastrophic failure, turbo seal failed and near runaway

engine and No guaranty...

 

Here is a bad story and this is to warn you about my bad experience with those Chinese Turbos.

I nearly lost an engine, certainly lost money and a lot of time...

First they are not made in Japan, and I doubt that the bearing that is suppose to be made in Japan is really made in Japan either...

Its a Taiwanese made and not Japanese as the Advert says this is were they are based on ebay...

 

Now, all started when I wanted more power, then decided to go for a larger Turbo, the Kinugawa looking good and keen on price. I read some good reviews about them, then decided to take the plunge and bought one.

Got a special price at 300 pounds for the complete turbo shipped to Scotland.

 

The Turbo arrive and was bolted in.

More power indeed, you can feel it right away. I was delighted, but not for long... Not long at all...

 

After a long trip, on my way back, luckily just when I was near home, the Turbo started to wine a little louder? I didn't thought much about it as I barelly did 1500 miles with it on the Delica.

 

The next day I went for a spin and about 5 miles from where I started, at 20Mph, BANG! A loud noise, load of smoke, no power... EEK!

I stopped the deli ( I was very lucky there) and look under the hood, take the air intake out and the turbo at the front was ****ing engine oil, this was also going into the manifold... Not good as I nearly had a runaway engine!

The white smoke was engine oil going into the exhaust...

The turbo wheels was totally destroyed, the axle broken and the seal non existent as oil was pouring everywhere...

 

Home I took the turbo out, and put back the old Mitsubishi one, that has been there for 100,000 miles and was / is still going strong...

 

Now that was bad, really bad... But it get worse with Kinugawa kamak not accepting any liability there...

Kinugawa were a guaranty, well, is no guaranty...

 

 

 

Sachiko, the person I was talking to from Kinugawa kamak, started to tell me that something must have gone into the Turbo... Or that I turn the turbo housing to accommodate the fitting and that cause a total collapse( I get back to that later too) ... Or that my settings must be wrong and so on...

To that I replied that the old Mit turbo is still going strong, still in good shape, and all on the same settings...

Nothing would move Sachiko, it wasn't their reliable Turbos... Yeh, right...

 

I send him the Turbo back to Taiwan and Sachiko said he'll make a rebuild for me, need a new CHRA as the other was totally gone ( Like I wasn't aware of that) , and to fix it, Sachiko told me this would cost me 120 pounds... :deadhorse

I already paid 50 pounds to ship it back to Taiwan... A bit like on the post #164 here...

 

Then here we are, 300 + 50 + 120... Total of 470, a near runaway engine and huge amount of time and effort tinkering with the on and off turbo replacement...

 

I got the rebuild Turbo a while later. Now, the front wheel housing was on the wrong place, facing left when the Turbo was in instead of facing upward... I told Sachiko about this, to that he replied:

You can gently turn the wheel as we usually accommodate when customers want for their car??? He new it was for a Delica, he knew the intake should be facing upward, not sideways...The mind boggle here too as I was told on Turbo number one that if I moved the wheel, it was a reason for a failure, but now was told I can do it... Humm...

 

I put the turbo in, all oiled , let it idle for a bit, then stop the engine, all was good. I was back on track. Not for long... Not at all...

 

I drove to a shop nicely, town driving, no traffic, took me about 10 minutes.

From there I went to Mit dealer which was another 15 minutes away, there I had few burst to test the turbo, it wasn't spooling too fast I thought but hey, it was spooling...

At Mit, the car was idled and started to smoke, unusual, I thought it might be some oil that went into the exhaust?

From there a wee spin on the Highway see how it goes then 20 minutes later I stopped and the car and shock... It was smoking like hell... Again...

A guy stopped there telling me its the turbo seal, to that I replied, I just put the new turbo in now...

Went home blinding every one behind me with the smoke, took the turbo off and it was all wet with engine oil took the clip out, full of engine oil...

 

Now I am , again, back with the old Mit Turbo that is still going strong...

 

Sachiko from Kinugawa Kamak Dynamic sound like a broken record, this is not his turbo fault, this is my oil fed that are blocked, or something wrong with my settings and so on, he refuse to acknowledge the truth and that the old Mitsubishi Turbo is still going strong on the same car, same settings...

It seems that this is not unusual at all for Kinugawa to send back replacement CHRA... this alone is not normal that they fail that often...

 

Kinugawa turbos from KAMAK are a total failure.

Kinugawa, when a guaranty is not a guaranty.

 

Hope you enjoy the reading... That was a long post...

[DOHCstunr]

I have no idea what you just typed.

First post ever, don't even drive a Subaru let alone an LGT. Looks like a bot post to me. -_-

[Little rascal]

It is about the Kinugawa review, this is why I posted there. To warn others.

True, I don't drive a Subaru, but this is stated in my post, they have the same Turbos, or very similar

It seems common for the KAMAK to fail without any warning and after the second CHRA ( if they send you one for free you are lucky ) don't be expecting anything else nor any guaranty from them.

That's why

Happy week

Second post now

[1055]

I have no idea what you just typed.

First post ever, don't even drive a Subaru let alone an LGT. Looks like a bot post to me. -_-

 

Did you read it? Made sense to me.

[starionesir]

I read it, made sense to me to. I had a dsm before my legacy and have heard some horror stories about reliability from kinugawa. But then others that really liked them. Seems like there quality control is not very good.

[SBT]

Did you read it? Made sense to me.

 

I got it. Felt bad for the buyer / poster. BNR's turbos are all Mitsu CHRAs, and he stands behind his product.

[Little rascal]

Thank you guys. Yep, some are OK with the Kinugawa for a awhile and others, like me, get total failure near or right away?

Might be the quality control there, then this is like a gamble, you might be OK, you might not?

Like when I got the reconditionned one, the turbine housing wasn't in the right place... That was not on... And the turbo didn't last a day... This make me think while typing that they might not have looked at the exhaust housing that could have been damaged when the rod/ bearing failed, and just insert a new CHRA, this could be why it failed so quick?

BNR Turbos sound good...

[Adam393]

Just out of curiosity, how long ago was it that you bought the turbo?

[Little rascal]

Hi Adam,

I think it was in August for the first one. Then by the time it failed, had to send it back then agreed to pay the "extra" to fix, I think I got the second failure less then 2 month ago.

Then the long process of emailing back and forth to Kinugawa and no more replies from them beside this on the 6 of Novembre saying its not their fault even if I send them picture of the turbo wet at the exhaust side, on the clamp and the car smoking a lot ( seal failure):

Quote:"Our engineers based on the pics, we can make sure there are 2 problems caused the oil leak and white smoke

1.Obstructed turbocharger oil drain line

2.Obstructed engine crankcase vent(main problem)

 

 

I think you need to check car engine.

Any problem please let me know

 

 

Thank you

Sachiko

Yours faithfully"End quote

 

 

Of course no reason as why the old Mit is still going strong on the same engine, same crankcase pressure, same settings and so on...

Not too good... Actually I thought the engine was toast as the next day I put the old turbo in, the car was smoking even more... That was bad... It was the left over of the engine oil in the exhaust. It took a while to clear too... Now all good. Pfff...

[lordchilly]

I'm getting nervous now. I just had this turbo installed in August. broke it in then had it tuned. I'm praying it doesn't fail.

 

sent from my phone.

[Adam393]

I wouldn't worry about it. While it's an unfortunate scenario, it's not like any other turbo companies have zero failures.

[Sicotic]

I have had my 20G TD06H Kinugawa for over a year about 7.2k miles on it now. Havent had one issue witht he turbo. I hit full boost around 3300 rpms. Pulls hard and takes a workload. I dont drive it like a grandma either. Any brand will have its up and downs.

[1055]

FWIW, I've seen a lot of success stories from KAMAK/kinugawa. At the end of the day your buying a 'budget' turbo. Its not quite as much of a shithole as a chinacharger being that they use supposed mitsu CHRAs, but the quality still isn't that of borgwarner, garrett, FP, PT etc.. and the price reflects that.

[Little rascal]

Indeed, I bought it as it was cheaper, new and guaranted...

Unfortunately I am out of near 500 pounds and still no Turbo

There is no saving there... Not at all... Next time I'll get a second hand one but branded. That will save time and money.

 

To LordChilly, they not all fail, this is what I bought one as I was reading good reviews from them... Until failure number 2 and I started researching better and found that actually a lot fail as well.

Hopefully yours is a Good'un that will last

Fingers cross.

 

I talk to a Turbo guy here, he was saying the same as KAMAC tried, that "perhaps" if the turbo failed I should look at my setting, until he understood that the old Mitsubishi one was still going strong and did outstanding 2 Kinugawa and this without any bother, then he said its the turbos, not your engine... Thanks. But I knew that...

[DOHCstunr]

I got it. Felt bad for the buyer / poster. BNR's turbos are all Mitsu CHRAs, and he stands behind his product.

 

That is a convenient misconception. However you sir are misinformed, and contributing to the problem.

 

Also it is quite obvious that this can't be true because the configuration of the cartridge housing is completely different than any of the mitsu turbos. For instance on subies the water inlet/outlet are on the same side of the housing. On Mitsu turbos they are on opposite sides.

 

The parts BNR use are replica's/knockoffs/interpretations/what-have-you of the MHI compressor wheel and turbine shaft. They have to machine these components and re-balance them, and machine the housings for proper clearance. It's not a MHI wheel, turbine, bearings, etc etc etc.

 

If that doesn't convince you that you are spreading misinformation(which it certainly should) Here is an email response from Bryan last year when I ordered my BNR 16g.

 

 

 

Hey John.

 

We have our own parts custom made. The bearing housing has the correct bolt patterns for all of the OE oil and water lines. MHI doesn't make them for direct fitment especially in the VF40 compressor housing. Our thrust bearings are upgraded along with the thrust collars.

 

MHI parts have went out the roof ever since the quake a while back. If we used MHI parts, the turbo would be 3 times more expensive if you can even get your hands on the parts.

 

I am on backorder on compressor wheels but they should be here Tuesday of this week. Thats the only hold up. ETA is this week if you call and order tomorrow.

 

Bryan@BNR

205 640 1193

Sorry to burst your bubble. He does make a good product though. I've put 30k miles on my turbo since I bought it last year and it works fine. No complaints here.

 

It does make me curious where he orders his parts from if he doesn't order them from MHI. Maybe from Kamak?

 

 

When this one fails, I'll be purchasing a Kinigowa.

Edited November 20, 2013 by DOHCstunr

[SBT]

DOHCS - thanks for clarifying that. Definitely DON'T like it when I put out bad dope, especially on something that I failed to pick-up on it, after my initial research. Will not repeat the incorrect info, and again, thanks for clarifying.

 

Does make me wonder what my 2011 68HTA has in it. Likely not a MITSU CHRA as Bryan initially discussed when the first BNR VF40 conversions were getting underway.

[slonez]

My Kamak TD05-20G is still going strong after more than 20000km and many many WOT runs.

A friend of mine blew his brand new FP Green on his Evo in less than 5000km. No overboosting or unusual abuse.

Luck plays a part too.

[SBT]

It seems that clean, regulated (not too much, not too little, but just right) oil pressure, is key. Dirty/contaminated oil, and the journal bearings get prematurely worn, leading to issues with balance and then seals. Too much oil pressure, and the seals get compromised and then you have shaft and bearing issues.