Guest Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 To me, 1" taller means worse handling, given both are apparently equally underdamped. It's not 1" taller than 2.5i. Read these posts carefully. Ground clearance difference is .2" and as I said It's due to the exhaust plumbing on turbo vs. non-turbo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhBe1 Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 Ah - according to #44, I think you're agreeing with my assessment that the height is basically the same - i.e., wheel arch to wheel center. Ground clearance differences are minimal, due to exhaust routing. 06LOB2.5i MT, JDMRSB, GYTTs, HPS, LGT Mufflers & Leather Wheel, SubiMomo Knob, Inalfa Moonroof, Clutch Switch Bypass, DeDRLd, DeChimed, & Straight Headrest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diggs753 Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 glad i keep checking this thread for technical sword fights Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted May 29, 2009 Author Share Posted May 29, 2009 glad i keep checking this thread for technical sword fights Hey Diggs, I'm witch yous... bench racing I think it’s called. I can tell you the OBXT is an amalgam of Subaru parts. As is often the case, the XT model Outback has a part component in conflict with other Outbacks. Call it what you will ~ Varooooooooom, gota zoom. Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cannonball Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 I have mixed feelings about the ride height. I owned a 2000 OBW MT with 7.3" of clearance IIRC. I took that thing offroad in places I probably shouldn't have. Many a time I rubbed the bottom on rocks, but traction was a non issue. At the same time it was still very fun on twisty roads even though it lacked oomph which is why I bought the XT. If our only choice for decent suspension setup means dropping down an inch I don't know if it would nessecarily be a bad thing. 7.5" of clearance is still decent and driving dynamics should improve. What I would really really really like to see is an adjustable suspension option. Now that would make the OBXT the ultimate all around vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted May 29, 2009 Author Share Posted May 29, 2009 Having started the JDM Bilstein BTS suspension upgrade with a whole lota pictures in effort to document. . I'l be sure to post the before and after sequence.. Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
easton Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 What I would really really really like to see is an adjustable suspension option. Now that would make the OBXT the ultimate all around vehicle. What you describe exists, the Megan Racing Coilovers. However, there doesn't seem to be a reliable adjustable suspension available. Judging from the polls and threads on here, there appears to be about a 50% failure rate with the Megans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted May 29, 2009 Author Share Posted May 29, 2009 Cargraphic out of Germany http://www.cargraphic.de recently introduced their "Airlift" system - which presently works on the Porsche 997 series 911 coupe. (navigate and you'l find it) The company indicates this Airlift will soon be available as an add-on to additional Bilstein products. Think of small air bladders situated towards the top of a coilover. When I get $5k large that's not doing anything, either its a Hooker and an eight ball or this "Airlift" thingy... Best left for the automotive jewelry style 911 owner ~ IMHO. Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted May 30, 2009 Author Share Posted May 30, 2009 Here's a couple of MY05 Outback XT rear shock pic's; the left is OEM, the right JDM Bilstein. Both have the coil spring removed. The Bilstein set up waits for the JDM Outback specific metallic top mount. Edit: the rear OEM shock is strangely very light weight and as expected minimal damping action. These show no signs of leakage; a 10/2004 production car with approx. 50K miles. Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhBe1 Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 Hey Diggs, I'm witch yous... bench racing I think it’s called. I... Probably more like "bench wrenching" in this case. 06LOB2.5i MT, JDMRSB, GYTTs, HPS, LGT Mufflers & Leather Wheel, SubiMomo Knob, Inalfa Moonroof, Clutch Switch Bypass, DeDRLd, DeChimed, & Straight Headrest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted June 1, 2009 Author Share Posted June 1, 2009 The JDM Bilstein install is paused waiting for the JDM only rear shock mounts - easy enough. I'm reading through the archived 2004 Outback introduction and I came across this. "The new Outback goes further. The floor pan is roughly the same as the current Outback, but Fuji engineers in Japan raised it, along with the rest of the car, 1.1 inches, for a ground clearance of 8.4 inches and 8.7 inches on a turbo version." The ground clearance height variance of .3 inches (OB2.5i vs. OBXT Turbo) has me think’ in, WHAT fitment issues are in store with a suspension kit intended for the shorter, by .3", OB2.5i? This JDM Bilstein enhancement got started with a "flying by the seat of my pants" approach so we'll see what clearance issue emerges. "Hey,, hand me that bigger Hammer please!" Any thoughts? Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabin Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 the .3 inches difference is because of the exhaust piping. nothing to worry about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
easton Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Mike, you got an ETA on your parts?????? The suspense(ion) is killing me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted June 1, 2009 Author Share Posted June 1, 2009 Hey Easton, The ETA for the parts delivery is about 10 days out from today. Although the two needed rear mounts were ordered over a week ago, just today AMEX phoned indicating they had declined a charge out of Japan last week. A simple discussion with AMEX dispelled their security concern starting the delivery again, say ten days; Japan to Atlanta. Like you, Ingrid and I can't wait to take the Subi for a spin with a real suspension. Add quality brakes and Va Vroom! An understated little wagon that can Scoot, Stop and Turn. What's not to like . . . . (Well a PATCH for the POS HVAC - can't have everything) Come to think of it at the time I coulda bought/ordered an MY05 Audi Allroad turbo w/6sp manual and the extended warranty to kick in after the new car 4/50K. I woulda been waaaay ahead of the game. Yeah,,,yeah, instead I could be at the Audi dealership having some horrendously priced service issues.. yeah but the HVAC would work - maybe. Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted June 2, 2009 Author Share Posted June 2, 2009 the .3 inches difference is because of the exhaust piping. nothing to worry about I suppose I'd agree to an exhaust speculation as to the need; however does anyone know how/where SOA achieved the OBXTs .3" additional ride height? Is the .3" achieved in the mounting of the F & R sub frames, is the add .3" in the hubs, thus the .3” dimension is merely accommodated by the/any OB struts travel? I'm mean in terms of the EPA, from where is the OBs ride height calculated? Does anyone have a clue as to where the .3" of additional ride height comes from? My impression is the OBXT is unique in terms of height, struts/shocks vs. an OB 2.5i and the OB 3.0 – or does no one really understand the detail behind what maybe various part numbers for these series similar Outback models? I dunno, but one thing I'm certain,,, the suspension in this OB XT was Bean Counter atrocious from day one. Shame on you SOA… Of course my opinion and loose change get's me a ride on a city bus.... Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhBe1 Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 If I'm reading correctly, the 0.3" difference is ground clearance between the tarmac and the lowest point of the exhaust. The XT and 2.5i have different exhausts. I conclude any difference in suspension geometry or hardware is insignificant. 06LOB2.5i MT, JDMRSB, GYTTs, HPS, LGT Mufflers & Leather Wheel, SubiMomo Knob, Inalfa Moonroof, Clutch Switch Bypass, DeDRLd, DeChimed, & Straight Headrest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted June 3, 2009 Author Share Posted June 3, 2009 So what I hear you say is, the MY05 thru MY08-09 Outback range e.g., 2.5i, XT, 3.0 share suspension strut/shock components. SO WHAT THE FK IS BISTEIN USA WAITING FOR! How many thousand units of this series Outback have been sold? Sheee-it,, spiff the dealership service/sales/parts people and Bilstein USA is off to the races.... I know several of us here have spoken with Bilstein USA only to be told the (XT only) model Outback represents to few units sold. I took this as a time honored responce from Bilstein USA when an application has not been attended. Sorry, but Bilstein USA could easily manufacture a higher quaility, better than OE spec., strut/shock only fittment for 5 years of the popular Outback. You can leed a horse water, but you can't make him drink....... Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScoobySTi07 Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Outbacks are targeted at an entirely different market than any other Subarus in the US except for maybe the Forester. While there have been a ton of Outbacks sold, the primary Outback buyer isn't a tuning mod junky or a wrench monkey. This is why Blistein USA doesn't see any reason to create a suspension for the Outback because we are a minority in the Outback community. There is no profit in designing and manufacturing an entire suspension setup for such a tiny number of buyers. This is why you have to go with some kind of hodgepodge setup or one of the smaller suspension manufacturers as they are the only ones to be able to make a profit off of such a small number of sets. The Ridiculousness is no more But you can have your very own piece of it. **The Ridiculous Part Out.** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natoli4 Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 I'm so excited!!! The puzzle is almost complete! Soon a straight path to serious handling will be ours! I look forward to your review! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted June 3, 2009 Author Share Posted June 3, 2009 This is why you have to go with ,,,,edit end edit... one of the smaller suspension manufacturers as they are the only ones to be able to make a profit off of such a small number of sets. OR ........... wait-for-it ..........BIlSTEIN JAPAN. What?? My expectations are the Japan authored Bilstein BTS5056 kit is a high quality street/off road arrangement tailored to the sport enthusiast. A guy who knows a guy who knows a guy (think 31 Flavors from Ferris Buehler) in the Tokyo office owns an Outback with the JDM Bilstein set-up. His advise, “GET IT! WONDERFUL CONTROL, NOT HARSH, . The BTS kits character is nothing close to that of a coilover arrangement which can be overly harsh; Bilstein worldwide makes coilovers also, however mostly for sport cars applications. IMHO, ......to inject a dose of the market's reality, the lion share of Outback owners think nothing is even wrong with their beloved Outback shocks even after years of service and thousands of miles… I’ll give ya that. Why rock the boat, eh. Subaru quality can't be beat so says the storyline . . . . PSST.... Bilstein USA,,,, here's a news flash,,,, phone Bilstein Japan. Something about a late model Subaru Outback opportunity? Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rB5 Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Oh, those look hot. I've always liked the Bilstein product, beginning with the WR Sport setup on my 2000 2.5RS. They usually manage to get an excellent compromise between ride and handling. If anyone has contacts in Japan to source these for a group buy, count me in for sure... -Branden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted June 7, 2009 Author Share Posted June 7, 2009 Here's a picture of the KYB OEM vs. JDM Bilstein front strut/spring comparison. The fronts are installed in the MY05 OB XT so we're waiting on the rear shock/spring JDM perch mounts ... Stay tuned! Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Schneider Posted June 9, 2009 Author Share Posted June 9, 2009 Does anyone know if Bilstein Japan simply offer's a strut only, shock only - say Heavy Duty (HD) product offering for the JDM Outback? This would be a replacement strut/shock intended to be used with the OE springs etc. Something other than the uber BTS 5056 kit. Edit: Sure they do. Here's a link to Bilstein worldwide /Germany. Edit, Edit, Ooops the link does not stay... Go to Bilstein world wide ping Germany choosing english...drill Baby drill.... It's Bilstein's Germany's B6 Sport strut for the (BP) Outback, mode VE3-B830, and VE3-B831. Rear BE5-B832 The looming question is how/will these fit a the OE coil springs/mounts of a USDM Outback. I'm going to Germany in 8 weeks,,,, anyone want to take a chance? Cheers, Mike |`94 E-Class Coupe |`98 Carrera 993 C2S |`14 Cayman S |`20 Outback Touring XT | All Debadged | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhBe1 Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 I'd expect fitment issues similar to what you're experiencing now. 06LOB2.5i MT, JDMRSB, GYTTs, HPS, LGT Mufflers & Leather Wheel, SubiMomo Knob, Inalfa Moonroof, Clutch Switch Bypass, DeDRLd, DeChimed, & Straight Headrest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natoli4 Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 doing some searching now and will let you all what I come up with...so far I've found that you get NO warrenty, NO support in the US what so ever as far a rebuild etc. Oh and it takes around 8 weeks. Price is on it's way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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