TimGinCentralNJ Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Like a lot of the Northeast, New Jersey seems to be getting less and less snow each winter. I was about to pull the trigger on a set of Goodyear Eagle F1 All-Seasons as a "4 season" solution for my 'o5 OBXT since I needing to replace both my summer and winter tires (both are worn out), but the more recent reviews I've been reading on this tire on tirerack, I'm seeing much more consistent feedback about their road noise being unbearable. FWIW, I'm also considering the Yoko S.Drives here, but suspect they won't fair so well in snow. So, if I were gonna' keep with the dedicated winter/dedicated summer tire deal, how crazy am I for considering running the GY Assurance Triple Treads (H rated on 16" steelies) as my dedcated winter tire--then getting a more performance oriented summer tire for my summer rims? I'm a big stickler for tires with a more responsive, stiffer sidewall--but realize these are qualities (among others) which also make for not-so-good snow performance. Just not sure I'd like the TT's as year-round tires because of their squishy sidewalls. Anyone here a more aggressive driver who's running GY TT's on their XT? Would love to hear your feedback. TIA, Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sooberoo Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 If you are going to go with the dedicated snow/summer rims, then why would you consider an all season radial for winter use? There are plenty of winter and snow tires out there that will meet or exceed the TT in both snow and dry conditions. Search this forum or consult online snow tire tests (ie TireRack) and you'll find heaps of valuable information regarding this topic. Remember that there are always trade offs when going to an all seaon tire! Just saw another post on this forum that said that 16" wheels will not clear our brakes (dunno if this applies to the Outback?). You may want to look into that! Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimGinCentralNJ Posted October 9, 2008 Author Share Posted October 9, 2008 If you are going to go with the dedicated snow/summer rims, then why would you consider an all season radial for winter use? There are plenty of winter and snow tires out there that will meet or exceed the TT in both snow and dry conditions. Search this forum or consult online snow tire tests (ie TireRack) and you'll find heaps of valuable information regarding this topic. Remember that there are always trade offs when going to an all seaon tire! Just saw another post on this forum that said that 16" wheels will not clear our brakes (dunno if this applies to the Outback?). You may want to look into that! Good luck! Thanks, Sooberoo- Yep, I've actuallyt been here a while and have read the majority of reviews and advice of the folks here re: snow vs. winter vs. all season and their respective trade offs, comparisons, etc The obvious trade off by going with an all-season (like the TT which is less performance oriented, but getting rave reviews on tirerack for dry, wet and even snow performance) is that it won't perform "as well" in snow/ice as say a Dunlop WinterSport M3 or 3D (which was going to be my winter choice). But, like I said in my orig post....we're just not getting enough snow IMO to warrant a true winter tire like the Dunlops which is where the TT would likely shine without the compromises of a "winter" tire like the Dunlop, including treadwear. Thanks, Tim ps: I've been running 16" steelies on my '05 OB XT during winter since it was new, so they do fit ;o) Fyi, It's the Legacy GT which can't run 16's due to the bigger brake rotors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFromPA Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Hi Tim, I'd recommend going with a crossover winter tire as opposed to TT's. You can probably find a set of Nokian WR's in the same price range as a set of Goodyear TT's. The thing about using TT's as a winter tire is that you won't really be happy with anything they do, except maybe ride comfort and tread life. They won't be good in the performance arena, they'll mush up your steering response, they won't be good in braking or cornering in snow/ice (which, lets face it, is all that matters on an AWD car looking for winter traction). Even if you chose continental contiextremes, you'd at least be happy with the performance aspect and they'd probably provide equivalent winter traction. Albeit, the tread life would be much shorter. Good luck to ya! Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimGinCentralNJ Posted October 9, 2008 Author Share Posted October 9, 2008 Even if you chose continental contiextremes, you'd at least be happy with the performance aspect and they'd probably provide equivalent winter traction. Albeit, the tread life would be much shorter. Good luck to ya! Joe Hey Joe- Good to hear from ya'....hope all is well. I agree with you 100%. I guess I've allowed my logic to be clouded by reading all the great reviews for the TT's from Subie owners which made them sound like they'd be a good compromise between the flimsy sidewalls of my current snowtires--and being more snow-worthy than any high-performance all-seasons I was looking at (especially since our snow is slight nowadays). Fyi, I have checked into the ContiExtremes...they don't make them in a size anywhere close to what I can run on the OBXT--either in 17" or 16". Boo! Thanks, Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFromPA Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Hey Tim, I don't want to dissuade you from TT's. And I think they'd make a great "6 month" tire. But I would not expect them to perform anywhere near a SNOW tire in braking and lateral traction in wintery conditions. I think that's where most people have problems. People who drive on all-seasons will exclaim when they don't spin during acceleration, allow them to dig out of 6" of snow, and accelerate up a hill. But just about any decent all-seasons on an AWD car will do all those things (except on ice). Only a good winter tire will allow you to brake down a snowy/icy hill effectively, make an emergency manuever in snowy/icy conditions, etc. FYI, I drove my 97 Jeep Wrangler from West Chester PA to Baltimore during a blizzard in the winter of 2004 (i.e. I think January-March sometime) with brand new Bridgestone REVO A/Ts. I was doing 40-45 mph down I-95 when there was 6-8" of unplowed snow (I was ahead of the plows). I was able to do great because I was constantly accelerating, fighting against the friction I was encountering and pulling myself straight when the jeep started to twitch sideways. But make no mistake. I couldn't stop if I needed to, and turning was a scary thing. I thought the tires did fantastic, considering I never once felt them spin....but they did twitch/slide sideways. Frequently. That's the difference in all-seasons vs. winter. And that's where people lose perspective when they say all-seasons did great in wintery conditions....to those people, "great" is staying unstuck. Not braking suddenly. Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSRBIKER Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Loved the TT on my 97 Outback, the car never had a problem with the snow. If you have the steels and want winter only tires get winter specific tires IMO. I can't decide on tires either but i am looking for some all season's as my only tires as like you said the winters here haven't been that bad. I am looking at the P Zero Nero's, TT's, Kuhmo ASX's or the Hankook Ventus V4's. I like the Nero's the best from all the Suby reviews on Tire Rack and the various forums but are they worth $150-200 more, they do get good ratings from SUBARU owners in the snow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garandman Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Hi Tim, I'd recommend going with a crossover winter tire as opposed to TT's. You can probably find a set of Nokian WR's in the same price range as a set of Goodyear TT's. The thing about using TT's as a winter tire is that you won't really be happy with anything they do, except maybe ride comfort and tread life. They won't be good in the performance arena, they'll mush up your steering response, they won't be good in braking or cornering in snow/ice (which, lets face it, is all that matters on an AWD car looking for winter traction). Even if you chose continental contiextremes, you'd at least be happy with the performance aspect and they'd probably provide equivalent winter traction. Albeit, the tread life would be much shorter. Good luck to ya! JoeWhat he said. There is one passenger All-Season that passes the severe duty snow test: the Nokian WR. If anyone else could pass it, they would. Many folks who drive a lot are using them as dedicated snows, since pure snows wear too quickly. Only downside is they're not cheap. I got a kick out of the Consumer Reports review of the TripleTred, which recommended it "if icy roads are not a factor." BTW Nokians are generally not available mail order so you'll have to find a dealer. Who Dares Wins スバル Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby Fan Posted October 10, 2008 Share Posted October 10, 2008 Nokian WR-G2's.....that is all you need to know:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krzyss Posted October 10, 2008 Share Posted October 10, 2008 Well, WR-G2 got 1 star in Quebec winter tire test. Krzys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garandman Posted October 10, 2008 Share Posted October 10, 2008 Well, WR-G2 got 1 star in Quebec winter tire test. KrzysCitation needed. Canadian Driver reviewed the WR. Who Dares Wins スバル Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilh Posted October 10, 2008 Share Posted October 10, 2008 How many other all-season tires were even included in the test? Hint: aren't the WR and WR-G2 the only snowflake-rated all-season tires? Quebec requires that rating in the winter starting this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krzyss Posted October 10, 2008 Share Posted October 10, 2008 http://forums.nasioc.com/forums//showthread.php?p=23936055 Test http://www.3duy.com/misc/Pneusdhiver.pdf OP wants winter tires, not AS. It seems that there are better choices than Nokian WR G2. WR G2 might be the only AS tire with snow-flake but it is still All Season. I was thinking about WR G2 myself but I will more likely buy Dunlop WinterSport 3D or Goodyear Eagle Ultra Grip GW3 (especially considering Nokian prices). Krzys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outahere Posted October 10, 2008 Share Posted October 10, 2008 ...........I'm a big stickler for tires with a more responsive, stiffer sidewall--but realize these are qualities (among others) which also make for not-so-good snow performance. ....... Michelin, Dunlop, Continental, and Bridgestone make tires for you: performance winters. Look for ones with a V speed rating, like the Michelin Pilot Alpin PA3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garandman Posted October 11, 2008 Share Posted October 11, 2008 Michelin, Dunlop, Continental, and Bridgestone make tires for you: performance winters. Look for ones with a V speed rating, like the Michelin Pilot Alpin PA3 He lives in New Jersey! They get 16-20" of snow per season! Who Dares Wins スバル Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krzyss Posted October 11, 2008 Share Posted October 11, 2008 If it gets below 45F for weeks then winter tires are good. Snow, ice or just cold. Krzys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSRBIKER Posted October 11, 2008 Share Posted October 11, 2008 He lives in New Jersey! They get 16-20" of snow per season! That all depends on where you live in NJ, in the northwest part of the state we get alot more snow...it's typically 10 degrees or more colder than what they say it is in NYC. But I also don't think you need snow tires in NJ with an AWD car if you buy a decent all season car and drive with regard for the conditions. I never got stuck and hardly slipped with my TT's on my 97 Outback, I also pushed the car more than i should have at times. If you can swing the cost of snows then go for it especially if you are heading north for any winter trips, better safe than sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby Fan Posted October 11, 2008 Share Posted October 11, 2008 http://forums.nasioc.com/forums//showthread.php?p=23936055 Test http://www.3duy.com/misc/Pneusdhiver.pdf OP wants winter tires, not AS. It seems that there are better choices than Nokian WR G2. WR G2 might be the only AS tire with snow-flake but it is still All Season. I was thinking about WR G2 myself but I will more likely buy Dunlop WinterSport 3D or Goodyear Eagle Ultra Grip GW3 (especially considering Nokian prices). Krzys Nokian does not make AS tires...Summer or Winter...check their website:rolleyes: http://www.nokiantyres.com/products The WR G2 is a winter tire that just happens to be good in wet and dry as well...they are so much better than all the "Snow tires" that I have used in the past few years there is no comparison. Buy them if you want the best...if you are prepared to "Settle" then buy something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krzyss Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 Website is marketing tool. They can claim that they are not making tires but dough nuts but it does not mean that these are not tires. If tire can be used year round it is all season for me. If they make only winter or summer ones then their "winter" WR G2 sucks in winter per this test. Krzys PS What winter tires have you used before? Continental ContiWinterContact TS810, Dunlop WinterSport 3D or Goodyear Eagle Ultra Grip GW3 score higher than Nokians in tests in both Europe, US or Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby Fan Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 Website is marketing tool. They can claim that they are not making tires but dough nuts but it does not mean that these are not tires. If tire can be used year round it is all season for me. If they make only winter or summer ones then their "winter" WR G2 sucks in winter per this test. Krzys PS What winter tires have you used before? Continental ContiWinterContact TS810, Dunlop WinterSport 3D or Goodyear Eagle Ultra Grip GW3 score higher than Nokians in tests in both Europe, US or Canada. Whow!!! What great logic......so if I drive all year on "Slicks" that makes them "A/S"??? and my dedicated snow tires become "A/S" if I choose to drive on them all year??? I never thought of that:spin: The tires that I am comparing them to are... 1- Nokian RSi 2- Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3- Michelin Alpin II 4- Kuhmo ASX 5- Pirelli P Zero Nero M+S 6- Pirelli Snow Sport 180 and 210 7- Sumitomo HTR+ The WR G2 is equal to or better than all of them in snow and ice .... and is an excellent dry and wet road performance tire. All of these tires have been on my Imprezas or my LGT....if "You" haven't driven on them....then you have no valid opinion. Keep reading all those reports:lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krzyss Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 I wish I used that many different winter tires. If one drives on "Slicks" on snow one is an idiot and it does not make the tires AS. If one drives snow tires in summer (or above 45F) one is not that clever either. Maybe I should have used "should" instead of "can"? You can do anything, free will is sometimes awful. From the list of your tires I see only these winter tires: 1- Nokian RSi 3- Michelin Alpin II 6- Pirelli Snow Sport 180 and 210 Nokians are not high performance winter and are supposed to suck on dry. Michelin Alpin. Were they Pilot or Primacy? Pirellis are supposed to be sporty but supposedly they are not faring that great in tests. I hope that we agree at least that Nokians WR G2 are the most expensive tires from this bunch. Krzys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 To answer your initial question and where you live the TT would be great if you dont mind the H rating. I didnt notice a whole lot of difference when i went to these from the re92's Besides who needs dedicated snow tires for 16-20" of snow? I have the triple tread on my outback in KC MO. and we also get that amount of snow. These tires work perfect on wet roads and pretty great in the snow as well. (at least for that amount) Best all around tire I have ever owned. I want a more performance A/S so I am going with the pilot sport A/S soon. The TT are H rated not V like the Outback XT RE92s and not Z like the pilots. Really though I thought the TT were actually better than the stock RE92s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krzyss Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 Why do you say snow and not winter? Krzys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 Don't know why you are asking this but here you go. Winter is a season of the year, tires are not designed for winter they are designed for the terrain/weather you drive in. Tires with big lugs are for mud not Summer. Snow tires are siped to grab the snow and create traction so they are snow tires. Look at it this way, CA has winter but you wouldn't buy snow tires out there, unless you go skiing in the mountains where it snows. Why do you say snow and not winter? Krzys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krzyss Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 Why do you think that tires cannot be designed for a season? Doesn't season mean weather? I would not dare to call december in Florida or sea level California a winter. Where I live winter means cold. There are tires designed for cold weather, tires for ice, tires for snow. The tire types are taken from tire rack. Winter in mountains calls for Studless Ice and Snow or Studdable Winter tires. Winter when most driving is done on plowed highway is perfect for Performance Winter. Your mix of driving and preferences will dictate what you buy. I think it is perfectly reasonable to buy winter tires (Blizzak LM-25, Dunlops 3D or Goodyear GW3) for 16-20" of snow. These tires were designed for cold dry, wet (on road) weather and snow and ice secondary (order might be different for each one). I would agree that decent AS tires would handle reasonable well in such situation but if OP has 2 set of wheels then why not have summer setup with summer tires and winter setup with winter tires? Krzys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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