h2o hybrid

[LittleBlueGT]

I know AKLGT will keep us posted, she is good at that. The thing is a lot of people say this works, even though it cannot be proven.

 

I think there are a couple of factors at work:

 

1) when people spend this much time trying to get better mpg out of their cars they tend to drive for the bets mileage

 

2) they spend so much time............that they (just like people think they get more power from 2 washers in their exhaust) really start to believe that they did something beneficial

 

I for one don't think it works. I don't believe that internet stories of the oil lords stopping this secret technology from getting out. I also think the car companies would also be all over this if it worked.

 

Science is science. There are always unknowns and things for us to learn, but if it doesn't add up it doesn't work. Period.

[s car go]

I'm not advocating anything. I'm simply asking why this seems to work in real world applications than sitting at a computer and having a virtual argument. Am I pushing this and trying to sell these products? NO. I am, however, seriously considering having one of these systems installed on my 08 STI to see if it really does work. Then, BS aside, I can say with or without a doubt if it's BS or not.

 

interesting. a good friend of mine has a business they are starting that sells these types of products. what they have found thus far after installing in 2 vehicles has been an incredible increase in fuel economy. From 14 mpg in their truck to 25 mpg. I say that's pretty significant. I have another friend of mine who installed one in his 98 Legacy GT that got about 22 mpg and now getting well over 40 mpg. So after seeing these installed and used on 2 personal friend's vehicles, I'm left to believe it does work and so far, working pretty damn well.

 

You may be asking why it doesn't work (even though the answers have been posted on the first page of this thread), but your initial post contained anecdotal evidence that led you to the belief that this stuff works. Your opinion carries a lot of weight here, so a lot of people are going to read more into your posts than you might intend.

 

2 completely different people I've known for 16 yrs are telling me it works on THEIR OWN VEHICLES, they don't even talk to each other. I can't help but listen and be curious. Come on, we all know just because we don't "think" something will work doesn't mean it won't. My concerns if I do have a system installed on the car is how it will affect my tuning and mapping as well as power. I track my car and I track it quite a bit. I'm not just your average commuter going from point A to point B.

 

I've seen similar threads like this popping up all over the place lately. I've had friends and co-workers mention to this to me recently as well. As I said, this isn't some new thing, it comes up a lot when gas prices rise. There's no reason to be surprised that two of your friends gave separate accounts of this working, it's making its rounds everywhere.

 

And it's not that we don't think it won't work, it's that the laws of thermodynamics prove that it won't work. I can understand if you don't have a lot of scientific knowledge, but please don't dismiss this as some trivial point because of ignorance (don't take this as an insult) of the subject at hand.

[DrCloud]

Here in Southeast Florida, we had a report on a TV station a couple of months back about how they did a test of one of these devices, and boy, did it work. They used a Dodge Charger wagon and a dynamometer and found a 120% mileage increase, or some such thing.

 

Then one of our engineering professors pointed out that their control test registered only 9.6 mpg, or some silly thing like that -- a little thing that the stupid TV people didn't seem to realize was ridiculous. That they were getting 21 mpg with the device was the Big News they were all excited about.

 

Well, they've finally agreed to do the test again, with two cars, and to let the professor do it in a very controlled way. So we'll see.

 

This same station, last year, ran a story about the water-as-fuel gadget that someone is touting; in the process they neglected to point out that the hydrolysis machine was plugged into a 220V outlet.

 

I guess my point it that there is lots of hype out there and very little in the way of controlled testing. Why? Because anyone who knows physics and chemistry knows that these things are bogus and even fraudulent -- and they don't want to get involved. And the last thing that the people selling them want is controlled testing.

 

There are no easy answers, people. Get used to it. HPH

[AKLGT]

You may be asking why it doesn't work (even though the answers have been posted on the first page of this thread), but your initial post contained anecdotal evidence that led you to the belief that this stuff works. Your opinion carries a lot of weight here, so a lot of people are going to read more into your posts than you might intend.

 

 

 

I've seen similar threads like this popping up all over the place lately. I've had friends and co-workers mention to this to me recently as well. As I said, this isn't some new thing, it comes up a lot when gas prices rise. There's no reason to be surprised that two of your friends gave separate accounts of this working, it's making its rounds everywhere.

 

And it's not that we don't think it won't work, it's that the laws of thermodynamics prove that it won't work. I can understand if you don't have a lot of scientific knowledge, but please don't dismiss this as some trivial point because of ignorance (don't take this as an insult) of the subject at hand.

oddly enough, discussed this with my tech last night. Funny, he's in the process of building his own too. ??? but of course, it's wasted money because this doesn't work.

 

Guess we'll see...

[coxx]

oddly enough, discussed this with my tech last night. Funny, he's in the process of building his own too. ??? but of course, it's wasted money because this doesn't work.

 

Guess we'll see...

[BoxerGT2.5]

I'd look towards Tequilla, it fueled a few pleasant and unpleasant events in my life.

[SBT]

I'd look towards Tequilla, it fueled a few pleasant and unpleasant events in my life.

 

:lol: Ah, the memories... or lack thereof.

SBT

[LegGTLT]

AKLGT: I think what would really help us all here is to get your friend, who has the logs that prove this, to send them to you electronically. Then you post them. It would help everyone, including myself, to see it. I know logs can be altered and what not, but at least show a log from the same car with 22MPG and then the one with 40MPG. Just something that gives us a peek into this technology. Pics of the set-up would be great too. If it's true, and they really want to show-off this technology, they'll do it in a heartbeat.

 

Can't wait to see the info posted.

[G.T.Subie]

Non Sence

 

[AKLGT]

AKLGT: I think what would really help us all here is to get your friend, who has the logs that prove this, to send them to you electronically. Then you post them. It would help everyone, including myself, to see it. I know logs can be altered and what not, but at least show a log from the same car with 22MPG and then the one with 40MPG. Just something that gives us a peek into this technology. Pics of the set-up would be great too. If it's true, and they really want to show-off this technology, they'll do it in a heartbeat.

 

Can't wait to see the info posted.

I don't know what kinda logs he has. I can ask.

 

However, this is the plan. I called the bank today regarding the LGT. I found out that I'm paid up thru Feb 09. So, in an effort to help out my friend's new business, I'm going to install one of these kits on the 05 LGT 5eat and drive that around for my DD and use the STI for the weekend car. This way I can keep the miles off the new car and test this out on the LGT. We all know what kind of mileage we get on avg with our LGT's so I figure this will make a lot more sense to see if it's really BS or if it does work. Plus, just because it works on their Diesel truck or my buddy's 98 LGT, doesn't mean it's going to work or work WELL on a turbo charged 2.5L Subaru! And we all know, that's what we REALLY want to know.

 

I will be the guineau pig since I'm very interested to see if it will work and how. If it does, great! if not, than I'll be the one to chalk it up for science and the good of the LGT community. You won't have to. I'll run the car for a good 2-3 weeks, keeping mileage logs, etc. I'll fill the car until it clicks and make sure to write down the miles each time I do this. It can be an LGT experiment we can log. I still need to talk to someone on who/where to install it, but hopefully 2-3 wks gives me time to do that. I think this will be a very very interesting experiment! Granted, the sooner I sell the LGT, the sooner I can buy more parts for the STI, but I really don't need much of anything for it right now.

 

Hopefully the LGT will be back in commission no later than tomorrow morn (we'll be trying to finish it up tonight). It's completely stock once again.

 

I'll keep you all updated once I can work out the details with my friend on the kit, install, how to make sure it's all going to work on the car, etc.

[leggtnut]

aklgt, thanks for being the guinepig

[LegGTLT]

Sweet. Have them send whatever data they have to you showing how it improved their MPG. They must be tracking something becuase they're making statements based on some sort of data, pre and post install. Let's see what it is and go from there.

[JSaladino]

sweet! can't wait to see how it turns out AK! *subscribe*

[AKLGT]

Sweet. Have them send whatever data they have to you showing how it improved their MPG. They must be tracking something becuase they're making statements based on some sort of data, pre and post install. Let's see what it is and go from there.

Well, I don't know what kinda tracking he's doing. He's not too organized. That's why I figure it makes more sense to do this with my LGT, WITH a turbo than without. Frankly, who cares if it works on a diesel truck or an NA engine. We have 2.5L turbocharged ones, so I want to know if it works on OUR cars, not theirs!

 

My folks will be here tomorrow night. They will be driving the LGT for the next 2 weeks while they visit, so I will have to give them strict instructions on this. I'm sure they will also be interested in seeing how/if this kind of system works because they have their Caddy STS that gets maybe 16 mpg is they're lucky!

 

It's supposed to work better (better results) on larger engines vs smaller ones. But again, the real question for us is if it works and how it will work with our turbo'd subies. Plus, if it blows up the LGT, I can deal with that vs having it blow up my STI.

[AKLGT]

OK, so guys, help me out on this. I need to find out what kind of info we will need to log and verify information to keep it as organized as possible. I'm not a good graph person, but I do love Excel.

 

I'm thinking once the car is running (praying by tonight), I will fill it up with gas tank, start the trip odometer on Trip B for every tank of gas, write down mileage and anything else? This will be the starting point. I will need to run the car as is for a good 3 weeks or more since the folks will be doing a lot of driving around the state and frankly I want to know about city driving, not hwy. Then, hopefully, by mid July, we'll have established a good basis of how the car is running pre-install of whatever kit my friend will be selling. I know I usually avg about 18-20 mpg city in the LGT, but that's with stg 2 and/or STI swap. and on a good tank of gas running the equivalent of 93 octane. We only get 90 oct here, so I had to use Torco Race Fuel.

[LegGTLT]

Well, I don't know what kinda tracking he's doing. He's not too organized. That's why I figure it makes more sense to do this with my LGT, WITH a turbo than without. Frankly, who cares if it works on a diesel truck or an NA engine. We have 2.5L turbocharged ones, so I want to know if it works on OUR cars, not theirs!

I think that we need to see ANY info ANYONE has on this. I just want to see what they're bragging about. We know it's impossible according to thermodynamics, so let's see some info that shows otherwise. He can't be too disorganized, he built his own and he stated he was at 22MPG and now he gets 40MPG. He must keeping track of this somehow.

[leggtnut]

I think a good log of miles per fillup, gallons per fillup would be a good start. I don't think anything other than that would be required. But if you get nitty and gritty, ambient temps's. Put them in an excel spread sheet and your good

[AKLGT]

I think that we need to see ANY info ANYONE has on this. I just want to see what they're bragging about. We know it's impossible according to thermodynamics, so let's see some info that shows otherwise. He can't be too disorganized, he built his own and he stated he was at 22MPG and now he gets 40MPG. He must keeping track of this somehow.

he guages it by how many times he fills up his tank. I'll ask him, but will be surprised if he actually keeps any receipts. Which is kinda what I want to see.

 

People can make claims all they want. It would be easy to manipulate info. Just don't show all the receipts for each fill up... But again, he TOLD me that's what he was getting, so I don't know if he's exagerating and maybe he's only getting 10 mpg better and not 20 mpg better. See what I'm saying?

 

I'll see what I can find out from my friend who's going to be doing this as a dealer though, she has a local guy already that does have info and logs, I haven't talked to that guy though. His name is Tom is all I know and he had a different partner who started this about a year ago in Anchorage (never even heard of it) but the guy is kinda flaky (ex partner in the business) and maybe not so honest, making a lot of claims that are untrue. That is why Tom split the business and started his new one. I've been speaking with my friend, Jessi who is partnering with Tom to do this. I haven't spoken to Tom in person though, so he supposedly is the one with real info and numbers. I'm sure he has to have some info and proof.

[LegGTLT]

We would hope so! Like you said, they have no reason to lie, but we have no reason to believe them on something so new. I guess it's a burden of proof on them at this point.

[bosco]

need to read this when i get time. wow

[AKLGT]

We would hope so! Like you said, they have no reason to lie, but we have no reason to believe them on something so new. I guess it's a burden of proof on them at this point.

i agree completely. I am quite skeptical myself, which is why I want to see it for my own eyes, and not just someone else's data, I WANT TO HAVE MY OWN!

[leggtnut]

awaiting pics and details from kompleks

[Kompleks]

im at work, and im busy all this week but i will make a video and post pics.... ill let my fuel cell(which i made for 30 bux by the way)speak for itself when i let it run for 20 seconds pull the tubes out and dangle a lighter infront of it to show you that it will definitly push a piston... it almost blew my friends hand off the other night

[leggtnut]

Kompleks, would love a write up on materials and install of your fuel cell.

[03LegacyWgn]

Finaly someone who isnt ignorant to new and inovative things, thanks for speaking up and i aswell cant wait to see pics of your set up.