Underdog Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 whobaru, I've been having the same dilemma as you (minus the discomfort) but I've already purchased my HD/Swifts. On the one hand, I can just put them on and see how it is; but on the other, I could get more money for the parts new and put it towards comfortable C/O's. Thanks for posting this thread and bringing together some good info. The Crimson Dynamo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 14, 2008 Author Share Posted February 14, 2008 Crazy Ken suggested Pinks/JDM Eibachs with HDs would be more comfortable than T1s which are stiffer (but raved about the performance abilities of the T1). This supports why I had decided to go the Pink route. I'm going to do the smart thing and just wait for Andrew's (RCE) review of the difference between the Pinks/HDs and the T1s. I'm hoping someone can give me a difinitive answer on whether the K2s or the T1s ride softer. I know it's hard to put these things in words, so I'm just trying to make the best educated guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 As I've learned more and more about the trade-offs of suspension modification, especially with McPherson Strut designs, I've come to appreciate the stock setup. A slightly stiffer spec.B suspension is what I've targeted and I'm trying it first with springs and second with swaybars. Of course, a quality coilover could do the job of both even better. If you are biding your time keep an eye out for my review in the next month or so. The Crimson Dynamo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 14, 2008 Author Share Posted February 14, 2008 I'm itching to get them now, but will probably wait for more information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 14, 2008 Author Share Posted February 14, 2008 BJ gives some info. on the V2s in post #16 http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1015680 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goneskiian Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 I know you're trying to keep the cost of your upgrade reasonable but I'd really like to have someone (perhaps the RCE guys?) chime in on how the Ohlins offerings stack up here too. I know Ohlins offers both a coilover and a strut setup that will work on our cars. Thanks! -Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 I know you're trying to keep the cost of your upgrade reasonable but I'd really like to have someone (perhaps the RCE guys?) chime in on how the Ohlins offerings stack up here too. I know Ohlins offers both a coilover and a strut setup that will work on our cars. Thanks! -Ian True Ian, but MUCH more expensive. I dont think the OP needs to be confused any more than he already is( with all due respect WHOBARU). Myles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 This just becomes an expectation issue. For example: BOB says " it is awesome"..STEVE says.." its soft.".....PHIL says..." this is firmer than that..". In the end you will get 9 different opinions on what these will feel like. Bottom line is BOTH will be better than what you have now. I hate to say it but it doesnt have to be this difficult. To the guy who has Swifts and HD's..........sell them to a local, once the local puts them on....drive his car and decide. Then buy it again. Simple. Once my brother came in the house and said......." dont walk under the small bush by the garage...there is dog poo there......". I never walked under there.......esp after watching him clean it from his bare foot !! Learn from others. Myles(smile) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 14, 2008 Author Share Posted February 14, 2008 Thanks for the input Myles... At this point I'm just waiting for either the difference in springs rates between the T1s and V2s, or a difinitive answer on which is softer. The only answer I've been given about the difference between the two is that the T1s have "different valving" and "race springs [that are] better quality, [but not necessarily] stiffer". I'm not as confused as I may seem, I've just got a lot of information to digest. RCE has access to the V2s, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 14, 2008 Author Share Posted February 14, 2008 Oh, apparently the T1s "have more adjustability from soft to firm" too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 Thanks for the input Myles... At this point I'm just waiting for either the difference in springs rates between the T1s and V2s, or a difinitive answer on which is softer. The only answer I've been given about the difference between the two is that the T1s have "different valving" and "race springs [that are] better quality, [but not necessarily] stiffer". I'm not as confused as I may seem, I've just got a lot of information to digest. RCE has access to the V2s, right? The difference between the KW "race" springs and standard KW springs are simply that they are lighter and use fewer coils (more travel before they bind). Same spring rates for T1 vs. V2. (We do have the option to go stiffer.) Our T1 valving focused on increased range....we never used full soft on the regular V2's because it was too bouncy and not comfortable. So we moved the spectrum up a few notches so to speak. There is a setting on the T1's that feels just like V2's on their comfiest setting, but you can just go stiffer if you wanted to. And yes, we do have access to V2's. - drew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 15, 2008 Author Share Posted February 15, 2008 It sounds like T1s would be the way to go then. Here's the Tarmacs for $1399 shipped from RCE (this must be without any tophats): http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71459&highlight=tarmac Price with front and rear Spec. B top hats ($1649 shipped from RCE): http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81062&highlight=tarmac For those interested, here's a breakdown on the difference in the KW springs: http://www.kw-suspension.com/en/30_Products/30_KW_Competition/10_Racing_Springs/index.php I'm assuming when Myles and Drew refer to "race springs" they mean the "high-performance race springs" as opposed to "standard race springs". Here's a pic of the V2s: http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x312/kagenmateer/memberV2s.jpg Here's a pic of the T1s: http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x312/kagenmateer/TARMAC1.jpg Here's a pic of some T1s received by another member. Any idea why two of them have blue? Should I care? http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x312/kagenmateer/blueT1s.jpg ^^^Should I care there is more purple on the V2s? Here's the original T1 thread by RCE introducing the new coilovers: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71457&highlight=variant Here's another thread that breaks down the differences between the V2s and T1s. A lot of good discussion in here: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70040&highlight=variant lawl gives a great review and several pics of the V2s in this thread: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70268&highlight=variant In this thread, lawl said he used both sets of stock tophats. RCE- Can the T1s use the stock tophats too? I ask because you offer the package with the T1s and Spec. B tophats for $1649. Would one buy the tophat package so one need not worry about disassembling the stockers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceComp Engineering Posted February 15, 2008 Share Posted February 15, 2008 IF..you are going to get the T1's..yes its best to get them assembled so the install goes easy. Our next batch of these will (should) have the RCE blue springs and black perches. Yes our kits use the upgraded race springs, black perches and we are encouraging customers to order with tops so we cen send them assembled and ride height preset to save on the install and make sure the install goes well. Myles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share Posted February 17, 2008 Here's a great chart for spring rates! http://subiwiki.com/wiki/index.php/BL_%282005-2009%29#Handling_Modifications Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share Posted February 17, 2008 According to that chart, there is only a .5 increase in f/r spring rate going from stock to Pinks, and a significant increase when going form stock to the V2s (3.5 increase for the front and 1.5 increase in the rear. You guys really think the ride of the V2s is more comfortable, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vimy101 Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 So here's the whole story: Back in '00 I rolled my CRX into a tree and f'd up my neck (bad whiplash I never took care of). It still hurts everyday, so I can't take too much stiff suspension anymore. I commute to work 20 min. each way and require the occasional spirited driving in the trees so I won't race around town. I've spent the morning searching and studying and here is what I've decided: I'm going to upgrade to Cobb lower sways F&R to improve my terrible body roll. How important is it that I upgrade my endlinks? I understand they are good in the rear and maybe not the front because the front can "clunk". I can't find a definitve answer on how important this is and if it is only to prevent breakage. Is there any other advantage to upgrading endlinks other than the fact they will not break as easily as the stock ones will? I've been saving up for about six months for my coilovers and am at about $1500. I'm very interested in the Tein Comfort Sports, but worry they will still be too stiff for my neck. Can anyone give me the approximate difference in spring rates between the comfort sports and stock? I know I can't ask for perfomance AND a Cadillac ride, but I'd like to get as close to that as I can. I understand the Comfort Sports may not be compatible with the EDFC motors. Is this true? A while ago I saw a thread on coilovers that ranged in price up to about $5k, but I can't find it now. Anybody seen it? If I keep saving up and spend a ton of dough on coilovers, is that how to achieve what I am looking for? Is it more worthwhile to buy coilovers that come with the EDFC as part of a kit, or to buy something like the Teins and use the add-on EDFCs? Anybody know a ball-park on price differences or a thread where I can research this? Also, I understand there are some sort of knuckle joints that will compensate for positive camber when cornering, but I can't find them. Anybody seen these, or better yet...anybody used them and have pics?! Any info. is greatly appreciated! I hope Xleezard chimes in here . Oh, I'm on stock rims with Toyo Proxy4s. Also, for someone who's never installed these before, I'm guessing I can figure out the sways...any install advice is appreciated too. I will pay a shop if it is wise. You should have bought a Spec.B or head that way in your mods. It's a very smooth cruising and very tossable suspension set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share Posted February 17, 2008 tossable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vimy101 Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 tossable? A responsive and poised suspension. Able to be tossed. Synonym: throwable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share Posted February 17, 2008 Is the difference only in the springs and shocks? Doesn't the Spec. B have other little tidbits of goodness? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 front aluminum control arms rear aluminum trailing arms aluminum rear upper links Total ~$1300 Jury is still out on weight savings. My rough scale measurements put the control arms at ~6.5 lbs and the trailing arms at ~11lbs. The Crimson Dynamo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vimy101 Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 front aluminum control arms rear aluminum trailing arms aluminum rear upper links Total ~$1300 Jury is still out on weight savings. My rough scale measurements put the control arms at ~6.5 lbs and the trailing arms at ~11lbs. They are 30% lighter than their steel counterparts. Unclemat weighed both the steel and the Al parts if I remember correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 In front you only save 3 lbs each. 5 vs 8 lbs. In the rear substantially more, but I don't remember how much. I read it somewhere. I soon shall find myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 yeah, I'm waiting on the HD fronts and rear strut tops before I assemble and weigh everything. I won't have the stock gt components weighed until after the install. Unclemat, I weighed the AL control arms + avo caster bushing at 6lbs ~5oz. I would say 1.3 lbs doesn't matter usually but the whole point is to get an accurate number for future reference, correct? The Crimson Dynamo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vimy101 Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 In front you only save 3 lbs each. 5 vs 8 lbs. In the rear substantially more, but I don't remember how much. I read it somewhere. I soon shall find myself That's ~38% lighter for the front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whobaru Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share Posted February 17, 2008 And I think we mustn't forget we are talking un-sprung weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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