05LGTLtd Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 Depends on the M1 flavor. 0w-40 should pull 5k oci without a problem, maybe more. 5w-30, maybe not... All I need now is a hill holder and a center passing light... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeB820 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 Fail - Mobile 1 w/a 5,000 mile OCI is bad advise. I run Rotella T6 w/ 3,000 mile OCI's and my Blackstone lab reports have always looked great. Subaru turbo vehicles are tough on oil. It is extremely important that the oil is changed often, along with proper oil levels, at all times. I usually run penzoil or castrol but I have used Mobile 1. Also I should have added that i'm on a non turbo platform Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCwagon Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 Shear is a major concern with the turbo engines. The Mobil 1 (5-30) oil analysis' I've seen, indicate issues in that department. A well respected Subaru turbo builder (BNR) even went as far as to NOT recommend using Mobil 1. I have used Mobil 1 in non-Subaru applications with great success. I think the reason oil is critical in our turbo cars is that the oil that runs through the turbo gets exceptionally hot. An N/A car could go 5,000 miles, even on conventional oil, and probably be just fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apexi Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 I don't know whats up with Subie motors, but even non-turbo motors like mine even shear down oil rapidly. I've seen this a number of times in my own personal uoa's, as well as other 2.5L non-turbo uoa's. From what I've read, lubromoly 5w-40 has a hydrocracked group III base. So even though it's acea a3/a4 rated, its mineral oil base certainly isn't as shear stable as a true synthetic PAO or POE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05LGTLtd Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 I don't know whats up with Subie motors, but even non-turbo motors like mine even shear down oil rapidly. I've seen this a number of times in my own personal uoa's, as well as other 2.5L non-turbo uoa's. From what I've read, lubromoly 5w-40 has a hydrocracked group III base. So even though it's acea a3/a4 rated, its mineral oil base certainly isn't as shear stable as a true synthetic PAO or POE. Please cite your source stating LubroMoly 5w-40 as being HC GrpIII. I was under the impression that the "synthoil fully synthetic lubromoly" products such as the 5w-40 were primarily grpIV/V. Probably some grpIII in the mix, but that's not uncommon. Calling it a "weak" oil when it comes to shear stability is pushing things quite a bit. It has a HTHS of at least 3.5. (It passes some tough specs for porsche and VW. If you think our engines are tough on oil you should look a some uoa's for vw turbo engines.) Also just because an oil is predominately group III doesn't mean it is inferior for an application. Pennzoil Platinum is group III and does just fine in 5w-30 in lots of subarus, FI and NA. Pennzoil Ultimate is group III+, GTL, and is very shear stable in my experience. T6 is mostly group III, iirc. It does have a higher HTHS than LM 5w-40, but it is a thicker oil too. All I need now is a hill holder and a center passing light... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 You local NAPA sells a test kit, or can order it. The part number is 4077. It's half the cost of blackstone and they give you TBN. Is that right ? I'll have to stop by and check it out. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05LGTLtd Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=FIL4077_0331367142 All I need now is a hill holder and a center passing light... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05LGTLtd Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 Also if your near a Caterpiller Dealer, check with them, they have a pretty good deal as well. All I need now is a hill holder and a center passing light... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesubie Posted May 24, 2013 Share Posted May 24, 2013 Depends on the M1 flavor. 0w-40 should pull 5k oci without a problem, maybe more. 5w-30, maybe not... I really don't get why people seem to think that all Mobil1 oil is bad based on a few bad experiences with Energy Conserving M1 5W-30. And it also amazes me that there are knuckleheads out there that modify their cars to over 400 hp and continue to run 5W-30 because it's on the cap then they say that Mobil1 sucks because they burn through it. Or they will switch to Rotella T6 and say they don't consume it like they did Mobil1 5W-30. Well, duh! RT6 should be compared to M1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40 which is thicker than RT6 in all temps! Also, the newer SN/GF5 Mobil1 version is actually showing to be more stable in WRX uoa's over at bitog. In the oil industry, any information that is more than 6 months old is outdated since oil is always being reformulated regardless of whether or not it is to meet a new spec. I still wouldn't run it in my application since Mobil1 recommended that I run the 0W-40. -Dennis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Ned Posted May 24, 2013 Share Posted May 24, 2013 If everyone just stuck to GC we wouldn't be having this debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apexi Posted May 25, 2013 Share Posted May 25, 2013 Please cite your source stating LubroMoly 5w-40 as being HC GrpIII. I was under the impression that the "synthoil fully synthetic lubromoly" products such as the 5w-40 were primarily grpIV/V. Probably some grpIII in the mix, but that's not uncommon. Calling it a "weak" oil when it comes to shear stability is pushing things quite a bit. It has a HTHS of at least 3.5. (It passes some tough specs for porsche and VW. If you think our engines are tough on oil you should look a some uoa's for vw turbo engines.) Also just because an oil is predominately group III doesn't mean it is inferior for an application. Pennzoil Platinum is group III and does just fine in 5w-30 in lots of subarus, FI and NA. Pennzoil Ultimate is group III+, GTL, and is very shear stable in my experience. T6 is mostly group III, iirc. It does have a higher HTHS than LM 5w-40, but it is a thicker oil too. A MSDS from 2011 says "paraffin oils" as the primary component. A BITOG member said he emailed liqui-moly back in 2010 and they told him it was a hydrocracked group III, so these two things togeather make me confident it has a group III base. http://www.chemical-check.de/clientversion/pdf1/956/2041LMAU_0004_27-11-2007_US.pdf http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1839315 I agree with everything you've said. It's about how the base oil(s) and additive package work togeather, the base oil(s) or additive package alone can't create a solid product. To meet the specs that it does, lubro moly 5w-40 has to be a solid oil. I didn't mean to suggest that having a group III base oil meant that the product would be inferior, I just wanted to point out that with a mineral oil base, it will never be as shear stable as a true synthetic motor oil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAMMER DOWN Posted May 25, 2013 Share Posted May 25, 2013 If everyone just stuck to AMSOIL SSO & EA Oil Fliters we wouldn't be having this debate. Fixed Mileage:331487 Retired/Sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickeytl Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 Amsoil 5w-30 and oem filter...every 3500 miles for 5 years now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooslick Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 Once you start to significantly modify the engine, the factory oil viscosity recommendations no longer apply. It's always good to err on the side of conservatism and run something a bit thicker. At worse, this will cost you a very small amount of high rpm performance. The alternative - going significantly too thin - can and will result in catastrophic failure under the right conditions. I'm sure the majority of people using top tier synthetics could run service intervals >> 3750 miles. The problem is that oil analysis can't quantify if the turbo feed line screen is gradually getting clogged with debris. If you did regular visual inspections of these screens you could safely "step out" the oil/filter change intervals. TS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=FIL4077_0331367142 I stopped by a NAPA store and asked them about this. The guy's had no idea what I was talking about. One said may be it's from a NAPA Auto Care Center. As for changing Amsoil, at 3750 miles, IMO that's way overkill. When I sent in my Amsoil at 7000 miles the Lab tells me it's good for 2000 miles more and send in another sample. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05LGTLtd Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 I stopped by a NAPA store and asked them about this. The guy's had no idea what I was talking about. One said may be it's from a NAPA Auto Care Center. They can order it; did they even bother to look up the part number? You can always order it on line and pick it up at the store. It's just two plastic containers and the form to submit the sample. Once you buy the kit you have also paid for the analysis as well. You will have to pay to mail the sample as well. All I need now is a hill holder and a center passing light... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasejase Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 Really hard to beat M1 0w-40 @ 22.95 for 5qt jug at walmart. Far as "good" oils in 40 wt look for Porsche A40 and MB 229.5 specs. It takes a good oil to meet those two. Valvoline Synpower 5w-40, M1 0w-40, Castrol 5w-40 and 0w-40 all meet them and more. Castrol 0w-30 also meets lots of tough specs including the A3 spec which is a good one to remember. Turbo Subarus shear oil, and if an oil meets A3 it should be pretty shear resistant. Rotella has quite a following, but since M1 has rolled back pricewise it is less attractive than it has been. The NAPA "kit" is a mailing and sample container, you still need to send it to a lab for analysis. When yo buy the ~$14 kit you pay for the lab work up. They don't give you the exact same parameters, but it gives you important ones like Fe, Al, Si, viscosity, TBN, and more. Personally I would run a 5500 mile OCI and ample to go from there. For some reason 5500 miles seems to be a safe run level with quality oils. That's if you want to push things. I just dump really good oil every 4k... How much is the lab? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05LGTLtd Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 " When you buy the ~$14 kit you pay for the lab work up." All I need now is a hill holder and a center passing light... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasejase Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 " When you buy the ~$14 kit you pay for the lab work up." Gotcha. I read that differently. So when you buy the kit, the lab is included? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05LGTLtd Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 Yes, once you buy the #4077 kit from NAPA and pay to mail it to your regional lab, there are no more fees. They email you results in about two weeks and sent me a paper copy about a week later. Here's what the report looks like: All I need now is a hill holder and a center passing light... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 Is this the first sample you have run with them ? Do they keep a running tally like Blackstone does ? 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05LGTLtd Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 Is this the first sample you have run with them ? Do they keep a running tally like Blackstone does ? My first sample. You give them your customer number on subsequent samples, so maybe? All I need now is a hill holder and a center passing light... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbangoy Posted August 9, 2013 Share Posted August 9, 2013 So I finally got around to removing the Banjo filter, and installing a 10 micron oil feed filter. I had been using either valvoline 5w-30 on a 3000 mile OCI and recently switched to T6 5w-40. Never burned any oil, and banjo filter was clean any recommendations for raising my OCI? or should I stick to 3k? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbangoy Posted August 9, 2013 Share Posted August 9, 2013 I also drive 3000 miles in about 2-2.5 months so it gets kind of tedious changing so often, but I don't want to get lazy and blow something up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05LGTLtd Posted August 9, 2013 Share Posted August 9, 2013 4500 mile oci with T6 is pretty conservative. That should save you some wrench time. At the very least go up to the Subaru recommended 3750 interval. All I need now is a hill holder and a center passing light... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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