Infosecdad Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Side feeds up to 740cc or so is ok, supposedly harder to tune, but doable. Anything bigger should be top feeds, they are much easier to tune from what I’ve read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 (edited) That is probably all I need, 740s, but that is good to know. Either I go with a smaller upgrade now and top feeds when I want to turn things up, or I just go top feeds now... Fuel systems are not something I am very familiar with. Was planning on a pump and injectors, but did not think things would become quite as involved as converting the set up altogether. Oh well, I probably should just do it right the first time and get a good top feed set up going. My buddy would probably give me a good deal on his pump and injectors, and 850 is probably plenty for my initial goals. Might need to bump things up towards 1000 if I go e85 in the future, but I really don't think I want to go e85... Wonder how far 850s could take me with a VF52 on 91 pump gas... Do you need to do all new lines or anything? Or do the rail conversions just hook right up to factory fuel lines? I really wanted to get some side feed TGV deletes and I could just run the top feed rail conversions, but maybe I need to look at top feed TGVs. That was what the guy at IAG suggested. EDIT: DW makes side feeds up to 1000cc. Seems strange to have a product that is nearly unusable from a tuning standpoint. Edited July 31, 2019 by SageAbkatsor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted August 2, 2019 Author Share Posted August 2, 2019 Finally some pictures! Hopefully this is the best way to post pictures... I spent the last 3 days cleaning the engine bay. Feels good. Fortunately the weather has been absolutely gorgeous to be outside all day. It will never really be done to a standard I can sign off on, but it was good enough that I had to call it. Too much else is more pressing, but it made no sense to put any money into a nasty engine bay. Have been in contact with CryoTuning. Dave has been giving me a lot of insight on the final pieces of the puzzle for my overall build and goals. I can't wait to get some tunes from him. First things first, finish planning the build, then the actual build lol. Parts have started rolling in, lots of money rolling out. Such is life. I feel bad because I get the impression that Dave is stepping out of his normal station with some of the insight that he has given me, as it seems he is more a tuner than a builder, but still his customer service is on point and I certainly don't hold him to any of it. But getting insight from a tuner as to what works and what doesn't during the tuning process seems equally valuable as what can actually be put together. So I find the insight incommensurable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted August 3, 2019 Author Share Posted August 3, 2019 Anyone have a good idea on how/where to mount up the upper coolant tank with aftermarket TGV deletes? I haven't gotten them yet but there does not seem to be a provision on the IAG TGVs for the factory bracket that would normally bolt to the side of the passenger side TGV housing. I am sure there is nothing plug and play, and that I'll have to make a bracket of some sort, but I can't think of a good place to mount it to. My current plan is to make a bracket that will sit on top of the TGV housing and use the bolts that hold the TGV/manifold to the heads, but I have no idea if this will work yet or clear the fuel rails, and would prefer it mount to something less important as I don't want to have less bolt threads holding my manifold down/make a change that might impact the torque spec in ways I am not experienced enough to account for. Like all things, I am probably overthinking that though. As long as I can get the manifold to seal properly, a couple extra millimeters should be no issues. I do believe it comes with extra hardware to account for phenolic spacers. I will be running 3mm, but I could maybe use the 8mm bolts with some washers or spacers if I need extra bolt length. My other idea would be to run something from the bracket at the front of the manifold for the wastegate duty solenoid, but I think that would end up being bulky and ugly and probably still not work well... I just don't see any other options besides that, And I do not want to mess with relocating it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino6303 Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 Anyone have a good idea on how/where to mount up the upper coolant tank with aftermarket TGV deletes? I haven't gotten them yet but there does not seem to be a provision on the IAG TGVs for the factory bracket that would normally bolt to the side of the passenger side TGV housing. I am sure there is nothing plug and play, and that I'll have to make a bracket of some sort, but I can't think of a good place to mount it to. My current plan is to make a bracket that will sit on top of the TGV housing and use the bolts that hold the TGV/manifold to the heads, but I have no idea if this will work yet or clear the fuel rails, and would prefer it mount to something less important as I don't want to have less bolt threads holding my manifold down/make a change that might impact the torque spec in ways I am not experienced enough to account for. Like all things, I am probably overthinking that though. As long as I can get the manifold to seal properly, a couple extra millimeters should be no issues. I do believe it comes with extra hardware to account for phenolic spacers. I will be running 3mm, but I could maybe use the 8mm bolts with some washers or spacers if I need extra bolt length. My other idea would be to run something from the bracket at the front of the manifold for the wastegate duty solenoid, but I think that would end up being bulky and ugly and probably still not work well... I just don't see any other options besides that, And I do not want to mess with relocating it.If you are converting to top feed injectors, you'll need this. Subaru part number 14047AA700. https://www.ebay.com/itm/09-13-Subaru-Forester-XT-08-14-WRX-Fuel-Injector-Protector-Cover-Intake-Manifold-/173094692696 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted August 3, 2019 Author Share Posted August 3, 2019 (edited) That is awesome!! I thought I was going to have to make something like that... It definitely would not have looked very pretty. Thank you much! EDIT: Wait... doesn't that bolt to the TGV housing? EDIT 2: Nvm, it hooks onto the manifold. That will do nicely. This was a better solution than I expected. EDIT 3: So it looks like it hooks to the TGV the same place the stock LGT bracket does, but also hooks to the manifold. I'll just be leaving the TGV bolts empty. Either way, even if I needed to modify it, it will be a much better starting point than starting from scratch. Your link took me to an empty page, but with a $5 coupon I got it for $13 after tax, plus the one I found came with an extra little bracket that seems like it might actually be what the tank itself mounts too. All of the other listings did not come with this part as far as I saw. This shiny one on the left. Better too much than too little, but I think that is also a piece that will be useful. I don't see that bracket in any of the parts diagrams... Oh well, I got what I need. Thank you again!!! Edited August 4, 2019 by SageAbkatsor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tehnation Posted August 4, 2019 Share Posted August 4, 2019 what did u use to clean the front of your tranny? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted August 4, 2019 Author Share Posted August 4, 2019 (edited) what did u use to clean the front of your tranny? EDIT: Short answer is that brake clean would work well, though I had it clean before I got my hands on brake clean. So I did not plan things very well... Did not have enough supplies on my first day. No brake clean, no wire brushes, nothing. Started with paper towels, that was not working well but I got some of the thickest grease cleaned up, especially on the lower passenger side. On my way to throw some paper towels away, I found a piece of wood from a pallet that was pointed on one end and flat on the other. This worked pretty well to scrape off the thick layers of grease and clutch material. The pointed end was able to get into the small points of where the ridges are towards the center of the bell housing, and the flat part works well everywhere else that it will actually fit into. But that could only get me so far. Mind you, I am doing all of this about 100 feet from my old work so all I want to do is go get a big thing of brake clean from one of the techs and spray it all down, but I am trying my best not to rely on shop supplies from a place I no longer work. Still the parts manager says I should get a wire brush and scotch pad. Once the service manager left I grabbed one of each. I wanted to save the scotch bright for everything else that was not nasty, so I went to town with the wire brush. This got me down to the aluminum but it was still pretty nasty. Right at the end of the day, I remember I have MAF cleaner in the back of the car. I grab that and that finishes the job in short order. My wire brush was pretty gummed up with grease and clutch material at this point so I also used my MAF cleaner to clean up my wire brush. Used the rest to hit some of the worst parts of the crossmember and where the axles were slinging grease onto the power steering lines. Obviously pretty stupid use of MAF cleaner as it is pretty expensive to use as brake clean. Day two I went and bought a two cans of brake clean (and a can of MAF cleaner to replace the one I used on day one), and brought some nylon brushes I use for cleaning guns. If I had to go back, knowing what I know now, I would have bought 5 or more cans of brake clean the first day, 2 scotch bright pads, and probably 4 wire brushes. I would also have bought better tools for dusting. A vacuum and an air compressor would have helped immensely as well. Compressed air would have been the most valuable addition though, I don't think a vaccuum would have done much, but it would be nice to hit the liner that protects the firewall as I still dont feel I was able to adequately clean that. I tried dusting it sort of but it kind of just frays and falls apart. Over the course of 3 days I used about a half roll of paper towels, 1 toothbrush sized wire brush, 1 scotch pad, 2 cans of brake clean, 1 can of MAF cleaner that was nearly full, about 6 toothbrush sized nylon brushes, and a tiny amount of soapy water in a spray bottle. Having more supplies, and a better game plan, definitely would have cut the time down immensely. Edited August 4, 2019 by SageAbkatsor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tehnation Posted August 4, 2019 Share Posted August 4, 2019 brake cleaner is your best friend... cleans everything even the seats! I buy it by the case. I hit mine with a pressure washer and degreaser first, got it for like 70 bucks at harbor freight, then some brake cleaner but it didn't look as good as yours.... i was really trying to avoid using elbow grease .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted August 4, 2019 Author Share Posted August 4, 2019 brake cleaner is your best friend... cleans everything even the seats! I buy it by the case. I hit mine with a pressure washer and degreaser first, got it for like 70 bucks at harbor freight, then some brake cleaner but it didn't look as good as yours.... i was really trying to avoid using elbow grease .... I picked up a few gallons of elbow grease at Fleet Farm on sale. Worth it, haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted August 7, 2019 Author Share Posted August 7, 2019 (edited) It is getting close to being time to put together a build thread. I need more pictures, but my final build plans are beginning to solidify. Just installed my AOS today and John got back to me on the turbo build. Let me know if you guys see any problems or things I am missing with the plans as they sit currently. The goal is around 300ish to the wheels on pump gas with a lot of room for overhead in the block and fuel system if I ever want to go big turbo, Intercooler upgrade, Flexfuel, etc. I am very open to new ideas and suggestions. Short Block IAG Stage 2 Tuff B25 Heads Resurface, pressure test, valve job, new guides, polish cams, rockers and journals - GSC SuperAlloy +1mm intake and exhaust valves - GSC Beehive valve springs and Titanium Retainers - GSC Spring seats - GSC Manganese Bronze intake and exhaust guides - Brian Crower Valve Keepers New OEM Engine Parts Engine Gasket kit 11mm Oil Pump Oil Cooler AVCS intake cam phasers Oil Control solenoids Misc small parts After market Engine parts Samco Ancillary hose kit ARP head studs IAG AVCS/Turbo oil feed lines Intake and Exhaust Perrin AftaMaf intake to inlet hose Perrin Turbo Inlet Grimmspeed EBCS JMP VF52 Custom turbo build Perrin TMIC IAG side feed TGV deletes IAG Street series Air Oil Seperator IAG 3mm phenolic spacers Perrin Downpipe Fuel system Aeromotive Stealth 325 IAG Top Feed Conversion line kit Need a fuel filter inline, Looking at the ID one but it is a bit spendy... IAG Top Feed Conversion rails ID 1050X Injectors Aeromotive Gen 2 FPR IAG Fuel Pressure Gauge Engine Management and Monitoring Accessport V2 (Looking at an upgrade to V3) E-tuned by Cryotune Performance Cubbypod AEM Wideband Empty spot in cubby pod for a gauge - might go oil temp or oil pressure Want to add more spots for gauges, but I don't know where to put them ------ Currently I am working on a custom bracket to mount my fuel pressure regulator. I am skeptical that the solution suggested above to mounting my upper coolant reservoir is going to work after I looked at my manifold yesterday. I don't see where that is going to mount to. Edited August 7, 2019 by SageAbkatsor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted August 8, 2019 Author Share Posted August 8, 2019 If you are converting to top feed injectors, you'll need this. Subaru part number 14047AA700. https://www.ebay.com/itm/09-13-Subaru-Forester-XT-08-14-WRX-Fuel-Injector-Protector-Cover-Intake-Manifold-/173094692696 Am I missing something? Yeah, this does not work unless I have a different intake manifold I think... The aluminum ones must have the provisions for this bracket. The bracket does look like it mounts to the TGVs, but that puts me in the same dilemma. My new TGVs won't have the provision for any bracket, and if they did, I would just use the existing stock bracket that mounts to the TGV housing. I might still use it as material to make some type of custom bracket, but as it sits it doesn't do me any good. Let me know if anyone has any suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino6303 Posted August 8, 2019 Share Posted August 8, 2019 Am I missing something? Yeah, this does not work unless I have a different intake manifold I think... The aluminum ones must have the provisions for this bracket. The bracket does look like it mounts to the TGVs, but that puts me in the same dilemma. My new TGVs won't have the provision for any bracket, and if they did, I would just use the existing stock bracket that mounts to the TGV housing. I might still use it as material to make some type of custom bracket, but as it sits it doesn't do me any good. Let me know if anyone has any suggestions.I cut the bracket in half and only used the back half. It's covered up in the picture but you can see where the cut is. I also had to cut the wire harness clips off the intake manifold for the oem top feed fuel rails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tehnation Posted August 8, 2019 Share Posted August 8, 2019 whats the part number for that bracket? I need one of those as well, my coolant tank is just hanging on with gravity and the two pegs on top lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino6303 Posted August 8, 2019 Share Posted August 8, 2019 whats the part number for that bracket? I need one of those as well, my coolant tank is just hanging on with gravity and the two pegs on top lolPost #80 in this thread has the part number for top feed tgv/fuel rail cover. Like post #88, it has to be slightly modified to fit an intake manifold that originally used side feed tgvs but was updated with top feed tgvs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tehnation Posted August 8, 2019 Share Posted August 8, 2019 70-100 bucks new .... time to go to the junkyard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino6303 Posted August 8, 2019 Share Posted August 8, 2019 70-100 bucks new .... time to go to the junkyardEbay is your friend here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tehnation Posted August 8, 2019 Share Posted August 8, 2019 or ebay... 20 bucks ! and done! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted August 8, 2019 Share Posted August 8, 2019 OP, have you thought about replacing the 14 y/o motor mounts ? Heater hoses ? 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted August 9, 2019 Author Share Posted August 9, 2019 I have the full ancillary hose kit from Samco, which includes the heater core hoses. That is why I did not bother cleaning them much. Have not looked at motor mounts though... Thought about it. My budget is seriously capped out right now, but I will do some looking... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted August 9, 2019 Author Share Posted August 9, 2019 (edited) My ebay seller shipped me the wrong fuel pump. Aeromotive 11165 vs 11565. It looks identical but does not come with the additional accessories like the fuel sock filter thing, a tube with two hose clamps, additional PnP wiring harness, and a padded sleeve or something for the pump. I paid about $120. He is processing the return but it seems like he is trying to convince me not to go through with it. He said the 11165 is the same pump but made before they started lowering the costs of the pump. "It is the same application but a better pump which is why it is priced at $189 without the additional accessories." A little digging on Aeromotive's website and I found list price on 11165 to be $181.99, not $189, and 11565 to be $182.99. Firstly, $189 is more than list price of $181.99. Secondly, you are selling the 11565 listed at $182.99 for about $120, and yet do not list the 11165 for sale at all. Third you are claiming the $189 price as though the $120 you charge for 11565 is Aeromotive's list price. What you're claiming seems plausible, yet slightly misleading... While I am certain the additional accessories do probably cost more than $1, I doubt there is a significant expense far beyond that. These are pretty cheap components. When purchased or manufactured in bulk by a larger company like aeromotive, I would guess they are maybe looking at $5 or so. Maybe less. A quick search for these items sold individually: Fuel socks of this design are usually $5-10 Bulk fuel hose in the length and materials provided is very cheap. $1 is being generous Hose clamps... maybe $.50-$1 for 2 The pad looks like a cheap piece of foam... can't find anything but... $0.50 Wiring harness might be $8-12 Bought in bulk I would guess they are not paying much more than that additional $1 they are passing on to the customer. So while it might be true that they cut costs and made a lower quality pump, that isn't obvious looking at Aeromotives website or adding up the additional items. In fact, it states 11165 has been superseded by 11565 to support E85 compatibility, so you actually get more features with the new part. The only piece of data I do not have to make a fair judgement is manufacturing costs and seller margins, but I would guess the margins remain close to being the same. In fact, they may consider having a lower margin if they thought they would sell more pumps with the additional accessories, E85 compatibility, and PnP compatibility. That is the type of simple economic decisions that companies make. The only thing of note is that I indeed cannot find an 11165 for less than $160. But that could be for a lot of different reasons. Perhaps there is something to what he says... This post is basically meaningless, but I was about to send a similar response to my eBay seller. I decided it wasn't worth the argument, so I decided I would just post a rant on here. My hunch is that some of these ebay sellers have overstock of the 11165 and they purchased them at a higher price than they are getting the 11565's they purchase today. The 11165 is no longer available on Aeromotive's website so it is likely out of production completely following the supersession. While the difference in pricing could represent a change to inferior quality, it could represent a change in manufacturing volume, projected sales volume, simplified manufacturing processes or product design, larger wholesale margins in the past, etc. that would allow them to sell to wholesale vendors at a lower price than they sold the 11165 despite the additional accessories. Regardless, I am building with E85 as a future option, so the 11165 does me no good. /rant Edited August 9, 2019 by SageAbkatsor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tehnation Posted August 9, 2019 Share Posted August 9, 2019 (edited) ? aem 50-1215 thats what you want! cut the bullshit! lol, this is drop in, plug and play, 340 lph, e85, has filter... and its 120 bucks. Edited August 9, 2019 by Tehnation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAbkatsor Posted August 10, 2019 Author Share Posted August 10, 2019 Yeah I honestly wasn't sure what I was looking for in a pump, but I think I will be happy with my decision. We'll see. If it goes sideways I guess I'll try the AEM. I used IAG as my reference point and they said "extensive modification may be required" on the AEM pump, and it was $116, and they had no such note for the $200 Aeromotive pump. When I found the Aeromotive one for $120 I figured I was getting a pretty good deal on a $200 pump... Usually the old adage goes, you get what you pay for. If it is a more expensive pump, I figured... I also have the Aeromotive FPR and an Aeromotive inline filter and I kind of like sticking with one brand. How plug and play is the AEM pump? It seems like you at least need to crimp some wires. The Aeromotive one looks like the harness is already on there ready to go. Again, I have no idea what I am looking at. I just wanted to get something that would just drop in. Sounds like the AEM does, but all of the pictures I saw show it has two open wires that need to be spliced in... I like that it is the stealth line too, as they are supposed to run quiet. A coworker said he has heard good things about the stealth line. Maybe it is a mistake, but I am going to try the Aeromotive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tehnation Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 the aem is similar to the dw65c but better. the open wires don't mean you have to use them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanyb505 Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 How plug and play is the AEM pump? It seems like you at least need to crimp some wires. The Aeromotive one looks like the harness is already on there ready to go. The AEM pump is very plug and play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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