Finally the bump/rebound rates on the Spec B shocks

[PGT]

emailed you -Dan

[PeterJMC]

any updates?

[OB Lee]

I have some updates but nothing official yet. Thanks to Dan (Patagonian GT), we have measured and tested the stock Legacy GT wagon dampers. I have confirmed that the Legacy GT sedan dampers are exactly the same. We compared them to the stock dampers on my wife's Outback and found as expected that the Outback dampers are longer and considerably softer, especially in compression damping. Although someone had said that the GT and the Outback had different spring perches, that is not correct as they are the same stamping but they are at a higher location on the longer Outback strut to allow clearance for the larger diameter Outback tire package. For future Koni parts for the cars, it looks very good for the Legacy GTs to have an externally adjustable Sport strut insert for the front pretty much immediately. The rear offers a bit more of a challenge but we have found an existing externally adjustable rear Sport unit that is very close dimensionally and the valving looks like it is close enough to merit testing but will need some minor changes to the mounting attachments and spring perch location. It does not look so good for the Outback unless that person is willing to make more changes than the GT will require. The good news is that if what i have planned comes to fruition, we are looking at a market price potentially at half or less than what the non-adjustable and scarce Bilsteins sell for. Also I have spoken to an SCCA racer in the Midwest who is prepping a Legacy GT sedan for SCCA T3 class racing and we are working to get him going with some double adjustable racing front strut inserts and the single adjustable rear shock that I mentioned above. The fronts will require some fabrication to make those DA inserts fit the stock strut housings though. If someone has a stock Outback damper off a car that I can get some more info from, it would be very helpful. So things are rolling along and I hope to update the Australian and Japanese Koni distributors soon to hopefully get that modified version of the rear shock made for the GTs. Stay tuned but I don't have a timeline yet. I would like to get a chance to test fit a GT wagon here in the next month or so if I can get a window of time to open up for testing one.

[REM87O]

Lee - Let me know and you can use my wagon. How long will you need it? P.S. I missed you at the track...will PM.

[RockyMtnGT]

[quote name='OB Lee']I have some updates but nothing official yet. For future Koni parts for the cars, it looks very good for the Legacy GTs to have an externally adjustable Sport strut insert for the front pretty much immediately. The rear offers a bit more of a challenge but we have found an existing externally adjustable rear Sport unit that is very close dimensionally and the valving looks like it is close enough to merit testing but will need some minor changes to the mounting attachments and spring perch location. [/quote] VERY cool!!! ...someone just let me know when they are ready, how much they are, and where to send my $$$ :icon_bigg

[PeterJMC]

I hope they work well with the STi pinks already on my car!

[Wangspeed]

Nice. Good shocks on the way, hopefully. Any chance you'll post the graphs of the stockers? Warren

[praedet]

[quote name='REM870']Lee - Let me know and you can use my wagon. How long will you need it?[/QUOTE]Suck :(, if you need ANOTHER wagon (before June 1st), let me know :D Ted

[trabbic]

:munch: subscribed...

[PGT]

good news indeed!!!

[rodan]

OUTSTANDING! I have a feeling the first production run will be a quick sellout... :D

[OB Lee]

[quote name='Wangspeed']. Any chance you'll post the graphs of the stockers?[/quote] Unless used in a comparison situation which we are not yet ready for because reide development isn't done, a graph of the stock LGT shocks is of very limited use as it is very much nothing to look at. My comparison, the OB valving is only interesting becasue it is so soft that there is an "oh no wonder!" factor. Does anyone know if Subaru published their sales volumes on '05 and '06 LGTs and OBs? A breakdown on sedan and wagon would be helpful too. Just gathering market info to make my case to push the project through Europe. I spoke yesterday briefly to the European product manager and he is somewhat interested in the project but numbers make the business case for it.

[jim1969]

pm Jon [in CT]. he's always posting subaru sales numbers over on nasioc.

[PGT]

good call....I just remember seeing something about total Legacy/OB numbers and the breakdown by body style and powertrain. Something like 30/70 split, which, while not really surprising, surprised me. I've seen more new Legacy's around here than new Outbacks.

[suds2250]

[quote name='OB Lee']I have some updates but nothing official yet. For future Koni parts for the cars, it looks very good for the Legacy GTs to have an externally adjustable Sport strut insert for the front pretty much immediately. [/quote] Gotta part number for us? :icon_chee

[vel0mac]

Hi Lee, Regarding a business case for replacement struts for Subaru Outbacks: I have a 2005 Subaru Outback XT and I completely agree with your assessment of its ride. I love the car except for its ride, it is pathetic. I would LOVE to have Koni shocks available for my car. I have considered the coilover routine that other folks have talked about but the lowering effect does not thrill me, and I have heard that it really takes its toll on the linkage. One fellow I know of ended up replacing bushings, etc... due to the screwed up geometry from lowering his OBXT. I am not interested in this. So, in short, if Koni makes replacement shocks/struts for the Outbacks that maintain the same ride height, I would buy them in a heartbeat, I promise! Your post and your interest in this is the most promising thing I have heard for this car. THANK YOU!

[Joel Gat]

Hello, Lee, long time since we last chatted. Joel from Sheehan Motor Racing. [quote name='OB Lee']Does anyone know if Subaru published their sales volumes on '05 and '06 LGTs and OBs? A breakdown on sedan and wagon would be helpful too.[/quote] I suxxors at making those cool formatted tables that I've seen people make, so I'll just make a simple list here. Here is Year to Date (end of March) materials for 2006 versus all of 2005 versus all of 2004 (for Legacies and Outbacks, that means the previous version) [FONT=Courier New]Legacy Sedan:..4,352 v 21,682 v 18,938 Legacy Wagon:.13,909 v 66,106 v 70,515 Outback:......12,740 v 59,570 v 62,594 Total:........18,261 v 87,788 v 89,453[/FONT] These numbers compare quite favorably to the Impreza (which includes WRX, STI, etc, again ytd 2006, all of 2005, all of 2004): [FONT=Courier New]Sedan: 4,870 v 19,809 v 19,028 Wagon: 3,410 v 13,828 v 13,181 Total: 8,280 v 33,637 v 32,209[/FONT] If you care, the Forester did 12,569 so far this year, 53,541 in '05 and 58,424 in '04. And Yuckbecca did 4,947 so far this year, and 14,797 in '05. As for breaking down whether those were '05 or '06 models, that's tough. Subaru starts selling a new model mid-year usually, so you're kind of against an insurmountable task using publicly available information... Half of those sales data from 2004 are for 2005 models and half of the 2005 data is for 2006 models, though the YTD this year is probably all 2006 models. :) All information is available at media.subaru.com, where you can also subscribe to get all press releases from them, which means every month you can get monthly and Year to Date information on sales. Sometimes the text breaks down the sales better - they'll tell you how many turbos were sold or whatever. Hope that's helpful! Joel

[vel0mac]

[quote name='Patagonian GT']good call....I just remember seeing something about total Legacy/OB numbers and the breakdown by body style and powertrain. Something like 30/70 split, which, while not really surprising, surprised me. I've seen more new Legacy's around here than new Outbacks.[/quote] It's definitely a regional thing. In Colorado it is hard to find Legacy wagons, yet Outbacks are a dime a dozen.

[vel0mac]

[quote name='OB Lee']... It does not look so good for the Outback unless that person is willing to make more changes than the GT will require....[/quote] Lee, Can you explain this comment a bit more, please? Thanks.

[sduford]

I will add my name to the list of OBXT owners dying for better dampers. If you build them, I will buy!

[OB Lee]

[quote name='suds2250']Gotta part number for us? :icon_chee[/quote] Nothing is confirmed yet so I don't want to put out any info because nothing is official or even actually tested on an OB or LGT. Soon hopefully but not yet. Joel- Thanks for the data, that is quite helpful [quote name='velOmac']Lee, Can you explain this comment a bit more, please?[/quote] Because the OB parts are longer (the front for sure), then the insert that we are expecting to use on the LGT will be a shorter body which will require more strut modification and most likely a lower ride height. I was wondering about using these pieces on my own OB in conjuction with some Ground Control-esque threaded coil-over sleeve kits to lower the vehicle and then the system could for sure be made to work. If you have less dramatic changes in mind as a goal, I don't know how things will unfold yet. To this point, we have not really begun much true R&D work but just done some checking to see if it merits being made a real R&D project. At this point, it looks like that answer is Yes at elast for LGT so I'll move on the paperwork to make it an official Koni North America R&D project. I think things look pretty good but don't get too fired up too soon as it will be probably Fall before we might get the special rear shocks made in production numbers.

[Joel Gat]

Hello, Lee, I just noticed something funny about my table and want to make sure it makes sense. [FONT=Courier New]Legacy Sedan:..4,352 v 21,682 v 18,938 Legacy Wagon:.13,909 v 66,106 v 70,515 Outback:......12,740 v 59,570 v 62,594 Total:........18,261 v 87,788 v 89,453[/FONT] The totals are total Legacy. The Outback numbers are the subset of Legacy numbers. IE, there were 87,788 Legacys sold in 2005, of which 59,570 were Outbacks. At least, that's what I recall from the media stuff. As for lowering the Outback, it's not easy to do. The lifter blocks between the chassis and the cross-members mean that any lowering will quickly get the control arms below parallel to the ground, meaning you'll be in camber-gain territory. That's not good for performance... Joel

[REM87O]

Lee, So what are we talking in terms of timeframe? Roughly 6 mos? I know there are a lot of variables but if you had to guess? Any chance by the first week of August? :icon_bigg Thanks!

[OB Lee]

[quote name='REM87O']Lee, So what are we talking in terms of timeframe? Roughly 6 mos? I know there are a lot of variables but if you had to guess? Any chance by the first week of August? :icon_bigg Thanks![/quote] Depending on what we find out, I expect we should have the fronts ready by then but the rears will be pushing it for that soon. Call me when you get a chance, I need to speak to you about the testing with your stock and Ion springs.

[PGT]

Lee - I've got a few things I might be able to send your way....STi pink springs, Swift springs and KYB dampers. Would that help with the data set you need?