Penguin Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Sure you can note the disclaimer, but how many readers will actually notice it? How many people posting in this thread keep getting hung up on the notion that somehow the RWD cars in the test had better drivers....? Even though the testing methodology listed clearly states that all four drivers drove all the cars at least 2 times in order to determine the results. I suppose the publisher could also add in the costs of new tires, and labor to the as tested price. Problem is that the WRX for example was already the most expensive car in LL1 class at its as tested price of $31,720. Technically it was already out of the LL1 class price by $1720, now you want another $1,200 tacked on for tires that don't suck? Well may as well place the WRX in LL2 then, where it is completely out gunned by cars already wearing real rubber. Now should Subaru be held responsible for the horrible tires> Damn right they should be, that is why their cars should be run as is with OEM tires, which in this case suck. They claim the WRX is a performance car, but the numbers don't back that up very well and if the tires are the true cause of holding the car back then Subaru should pony up the $$$ to fix it if they really care. I don't think they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 And again, I agree with you. The article accomplished to show what it set out to do. Test the cars as they come from the dealer. I guess some here are just arguing it's not the end all be all. Regardless, I can totally tell the V6 Mustang drivers are giggling with joy that they can pwn Subies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Most of the V6 Mustang drivers probably did not get the performance package though. So the joke will probably be on them. Still I would be really curious to see what the Mustang V6 could have done without the retarded speed limiter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Is that thing really that bad on emissions? Why would they choke it at a mere 114mph or whatever? Stock for stock in a drag race, given enough distance it would lose to a Legacy simply based on that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I doubt emissions have anything to do with it. More likely Ford wanted to keep the V6 from encroaching too closely on GT performance territory, plus I am sure the basic V6 comes with some lousy all seasons that are not rated for any speed higher than 114mph. Ford might spend the money to throw on better brakes, a tighter suspension, and real tires.... but they are too cheap to give the V6 performance package its own dedicated ECU tuning with a higher governor. See, I guess that playing field should be leveled....too oh wait that doesn't help the cause of Subaru being superior does it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hadvw Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 I doubt emissions have anything to do with it. More likely Ford wanted to keep the V6 from encroaching too closely on GT performance territory, plus I am sure the basic V6 comes with some lousy all seasons that are not rated for any speed higher than 114mph. Ford might spend the money to throw on better brakes, a tighter suspension, and real tires.... but they are too cheap to give the V6 performance package its own dedicated ECU tuning with a higher governor. My thinking too.. (base v6 comes with cheap tires, hence the speed limitation) Of course, after a year or so, you can probably buy a $100 fix to remove the speed limiter (I'm thinking dongle or piggyback to avoid warranty issues).. I just WISH they would put this awesome engine tech into a more useful package. Anything with 4 doors, and preferably a hatch (or a wagon layout).. Even if it's a bit heavier, and they detune it a bit, say 280hp for V6, 395 hp for V8 in a wagon that's 200 lbs heavier.. That way, it won't outrun the equivalent Mustang, but man, would that be fun. And I don't mean a Buick Roadmaster-sized wagon.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Didn't see if this had been posted yet: 2011 BMW M3 vs. 2011 Mustang GT http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/1010_2011_2011_ford_mustang_gt_vs_2011_bmw_m3_comparison/specs.html Impressive, no doubt. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Probably on here someplace. I'm waiting for test results on this one: http://www.leftlanenews.com/ford-mustang-boss-302.html 444hp and adjustable shocks, and upgraded suspension should be one hell of a track monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracer-X Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 I couldn't agree more with Penguin about C&D's Lightning Lap test procedure. The cars come stock with those tires. If a car company has an optional high performance, C&D equips them. If it isn't offered as a factory option they don't use them. Also, like Penguin said they have multiple drivers making multiple laps. Lastly, I don't buy into the thought that they can drive RWD cars "real good" but aren't good at driving AWD cars. Those guys might not be "professional drivers" but they are passionate about cars, drive a lot of cars (even at real race tracks), and own fast/race cars that they race themselves. I subscribe to 4 car mags and occasionally pick up a 5th one at the store and all I have to say is that I (this should read, " this is my personal opinion and I'm not forcing it on you.") think that they are the most passionate about their driving experiences with the cars that they drive and own when the write their reviews and personal columns. dr_sharp, you sir are defiantly a fanboi as are most of us on the forum, myself included. Our cars are great for what they are. I love surprising Mustangs and Camaros. I love whooping on older muscle cars too. We just need to pull our head out and realize that our car in stock form was pretty quick compared to the previous car that we had just upgraded from. What a high that gave us. Then we started modding it. Power came cheep as did handling. By stage 2+ these things feel like super cars to us especially since my last car was a Ford Escort. In reality it is now (since modded) just a bigger nicer STi. I realize that as do most of the people in this thread. You still seam to be in a dream about it though. I hope you take this criticism well as I am not trying to call you names or anything. Now then, with all that said, I've been wanting a V6 mustang since I first saw this commercial: [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAX550biM7c]YouTube - Ford Mustang 2011 V6.0 - TV Commercial[/ame] It's got plenty of DD horsepower, good fuel economy #'s, good handling, great price, and great looks. On the downside the interior isn't as nice as a BMW. Sure a V8 GT would be better in every way but as much as I want to always have the best I also keep an eye on my budget (I bought my house when I was 20 /proud). If I always bought the best stuff not only would I be broke but also fat and depressed like so many Americans are that fall for that crap. Jump on it, Let's do it, Ride it, My Pony... EL4NFZT7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hadvw Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 ... Now then, with all that said, I've been wanting a V6 mustang since I first saw this commercial: It's got plenty of DD horsepower, good fuel economy #'s, good handling, great price, and great looks. On the downside the interior isn't as nice as a BMW. Sure a V8 GT would be better in every way but as much as I want to always have the best I also keep an eye on my budget (I bought my house when I was 20 /proud). Now they just need to put those engines into a sedan/wagon. I'm guessing the 3.7l will replace the 3.5 in the current Fusion/Taurus at some point. 30 mpg in a Fusion with 300+ hp would be nice! Just checked: carsdirect.com says an AWD 3.5 turbo Taurus (365 hp) is now $34K + options.. That's really not that bad. Supposed to get 25 mpg highway too.. Huge car though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 I'd love to go test drive a new GT but will hold off since it will just make me want one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 This makes it really tough not to buy one, put one of these exhausts on, find a tunnel, and spend all day blasting through it. [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayemxBdI0bc]YouTube - Borla Exhaust for the 2011 Mustang GT[/ame] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolksey85 Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 The new 5.0 is sickness. Guys already go 11.xx in them with bolt-ons and a few have gone, IIRC, 9.80's with bolt-ons and juice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Even better sound clip here: [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVKd0aQlaFA]YouTube - 2011 Mustang GT with Borla ATAK Exhaust[/ame] The new Coyote V8 has extremely well developed cylinder heads, apparently they will outflow just about any other readily available (non exotic car) cylinder head design out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracer-X Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 The new 5.0 is sickness. Guys already go 11.xx in them with bolt-ons and a few have gone, IIRC, 9.80's with bolt-ons and juice. For a second there I thought that 05Gt Guru posted this then I realized that this was a Ford comment not a SBC comment. Jump on it, Let's do it, Ride it, My Pony... EL4NFZT7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 defiantly That word doesn't mean what you think it means Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracer-X Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 That word doesn't mean what you think it means That's what we call a "fat fingers" here at work. The word should have been definitely. Apparently there is a website just for the spelling of that word! http://www.d-e-f-i-n-i-t-e-l-y.com/ Jump on it, Let's do it, Ride it, My Pony... EL4NFZT7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KurtP Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 The explanation is simple; never let the facts stand in the way of a good theory. Any criminal defense lawyer knows this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Apparently there is a website just for the spelling of that word! http://www.d-e-f-i-n-i-t-e-l-y.com/ That's taking it a bit far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doccrowley Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Mf8E4cFj0Q]YouTube - Wintercross Jan 2011final re run 1'04 009[/ame] Here's my winning lap for the day, all classes at Miller Motorsports Park, Wintercross Jan 15, 2011 in my 5EAT. Yep, subies suck at the track. Especially the 5EAT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Were you bone stock down to the tires? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hadvw Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Here's my winning lap for the day, all classes at Miller Motorsports Park, Wintercross Jan 15, 2011 in my 5EAT. Yep, subies suck at the track. Especially the 5EAT. Can't find the Jan 15 results yet, but for the Dec 11 results, you did well (winning your class). Of course, you also got beat by an '08 Evo, several Vettes including a '90 model (not sure if it was stock), and a 1990 Honda CRX.... All that said - I'd love to have something like this within driving distance.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoplightAssassin Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Here's my winning lap for the day, all classes at Miller Motorsports Park, Wintercross Jan 15, 2011 in my 5EAT. Yep, subies suck at the track. Especially the 5EAT. I'm sorry but what does that prove? The test was pretty clear. Same cars, same day, same drivers, factory specs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracer-X Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Here's my winning lap for the day, all classes at Miller Motorsports Park, Wintercross Jan 15, 2011 in my 5EAT. What would happen if YOU drove everyone's car that day? Would one of the other cars have been faster then your LGT? Was your car and all of the other cars 100% stock? If any of the cars were modified would that give them an edge over the other cars? Congrats on the win but it has NOTHING to do with what is going on in this thread. Jump on it, Let's do it, Ride it, My Pony... EL4NFZT7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doccrowley Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 yeah, I forgot. It's a thread about Mustangs. Sorry for the threadjack! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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