2011 Sti live

[Guest JessterCPA]

AZP is making a lot of sense on this page. Very well done.

[Gire]

+1

 

It's a well typed fresh approach to the same um, debate IWSS has had with other members on this forum for years now.

 

 

It appears AZP and I own the exact same car too. The white unicorn. spotted so rarely that they should be appreciating in value every day.

[Mindspin311]

IWSS = http://smiliesftw.com/x/metallicblue.gif

[Guest heightsgtltd]

Seriously... I'll propose the more than 100 woord post receives an automatic 2 day ban idea again

[IwannaSportSedan]

Congrats, guys.

 

You are getting the bland Subaru that you are all asking for.

 

Welcome to AWD Toyota.

 

And if you are going to chastize me for asking for more, and wanting Subaru to IMPROVE, because I CARE about what Subaru offers to their customers, and I want to be their future customer...

 

...then you shouldn't chastize Subaru for getting bland when they continue down their current course, and continue NOT to listen to rational, and constructive criticism like mine.

 

I only sound like a broken record, because Mike, although polite (and I am thankful for that, BTW...), is saying the same thing that B4, and others have said before, and they are justifications for Subaru NOT to improve, or just not accurate, and mis-characterizing what I am ACTUALLY asking for, which shouldn't be an unreasonable expectation.

 

But, feel free to continue to languish with Subaru, as their options and appeal dwindle.

 

I so badly want to stick with AWD cars... but I am getting to the point where I can't suffer such insular and static mentality anymore, while other products actually DO improve.

[Guest heightsgtltd]

Subarus have become bland. Be that as it may, it's really simple.

 

They aren't going to do what you want so let it go. No amount of bitching about it will change that fact.

 

There are other AWD options out there and you may have to consider them.

[IwannaSportSedan]

And if I do, and others do also...

 

How is that good for Subaru in the long run? How is that a good business strategy?

 

No one yet has answered that question.

[THE RZA]

White unicorn gire, really? :lol:

[Guest JessterCPA]

I'll throw my thought into this.

 

The current Generation Legacy is bland. So what? It sells, it generates cash for the company. It allows Subaru to make STi's and not charge through the roof for them. Pre 2005 model year, a board like this would have had 40 people on it. Tides change, trends come & go. If you fault Subaru for turning a 'enthusiast-popular' car like the Legacy into a 'mainstream-popular' car while selling many more of them, then I think you have a problem.

 

Do you get angry when your favorite underground artist signs that big record deal and is all over MTV?

[Guest JessterCPA]

And if I do, and others do also...

 

How is that good for Subaru in the long run? How is that a good business strategy?

 

No one yet has answered that question.

 

Bad business strategy would be to stay with ideas that do not gel with the current mindset of the general public.

 

These companies are in the business of selling cars.

[nemo]

^ If that underground artist stops producing the quality music they used to produce -- then yes.

 

If that's the case, we'll go elsewhere to get the music we originally liked in that artist, but from another artist. Not the new mainstream crap they're producing now.

 

I'm not going to fault them for selling out -- I'll just stop buying their music. It's simple. Just like what happened with 50 Cent

[Guest JessterCPA]

^ If that underground artist stops producing the quality music they used to produce -- then yes.

 

If that's the case, we'll go elsewhere to get the music we originally liked in that artist. Not the new mainstream crap they're producing now.

 

OK...that's fair.

[Guest heightsgtltd]

And if I do, and others do also...

 

How is that good for Subaru in the long run? How is that a good business strategy?

 

No one yet has answered that question.

 

Yes they have about 82,000 times for you over the last 5 years or so but you don't ever listen.

 

The mainstream audience doesnt want what you do. What's good for you (or for others on here) is clearly not good for Subaru.

 

Don't worry so much about what's good for them and their business strategy. I may not like their current product, but based on sales a lot of people do and their strategy seems to be working fine.

[Guest JessterCPA]

I may not like their current product, but based on sales a lot of people do and their strategy seems to be working fine.

 

I think this sentence sums up a lot.

[Guest heightsgtltd]

 

I'm not going to fault them for selling out -- I'll just stop buying their music. It's simple. Just like what happened with 50 Cent

 

Exactly. I don't see a new Subaru in my future at this point. SOA may or may not give an F about losing me, but I'll let my dollars do the talking.

[nemo]

OK...that's fair.

 

I know

 

It's just a matter if people want to recognize, accept, and deal with the fact that your favorite artist sold out and is no longer producing the music that what you want.

 

When you can accept that -- you can move on.

[Guest JessterCPA]

I know

 

It's just a matter if people want to recognize, accept, and deal with the fact that your favorite artist sold out and is no longer producing the music that what you want.

 

When you can accept that -- you can move on.

 

Well said.

[Guest JessterCPA]

FWIW...and getting more back on topic....

 

I do not like the 2010 myself, but I do like this Sti sedan. Going to definitely look at this. My buddy got married, wife is pregnant, and he's selling his RX-8. Called me up & said he likes the 2010 Leggy. I recommended it. It's not a vehicle for me, but he likes it.

[IwannaSportSedan]

I know

 

It's just a matter if people want to recognize, accept, and deal with the fact that your favorite artist sold out and is no longer producing the music that what you want.

 

When you can accept that -- you can move on.

 

It is harder to accept, when there is no more artists making that kind of music anymore, and there weren't that many making that sort of music in the first place.

 

Nobody makes Boxer engines but Porsche and Subaru. Porsche is $$$$$$$$$. more to maintain than even to initially buy.

 

Audi and Subaru are the only ones making properly longitudinal AWD that really works the way it should. Audi is $$$$$$. Not as much as Porsche, but still....

 

Subaru was the company that combined practicality, AWD, boxer engines, sporty demeanor, and manual gearboxes at an affordable price.

 

Any deviation from that, and you lose something, and it costs more.

 

So forgive me, if I don't just think it is wonderful for Subaru to take itself off of that great combination of attributes, as they destroy the sporty demeanor and manual gearbox options, and offer less and less for the price.

 

At least with music, most CDs or music downloads all cost the same, and are all affordable, for both bubble-gum pop music, foul-mouthed gangsta rap, and true artistic masters. All the same price on iTunes or Amazon.

 

In the car world. Porsche and Audi cost more, both to buy and to maintain. Subaru was attractive for offering what they did on the price point that they did, and now they are retreating from that position.

 

I don't want them to retreat. I want them to stick to it, and get even better at it.

 

Just because some artists sell out, doesn't make it ok when your carefully chosen favorite artist does, and goes from making art to making bubble-gum pop along with the rest of the no-talent hacks that already do that.

[nemo]

^ I agree with you -- and so do a lot of people on this board.

 

But you're fighting a losing battle. Just like I said earlier -- accept it and move on.

[Guest JessterCPA]

Just a question though...

 

Who cares if it's a boxer or inline? Transverse or longitudinal?

 

I care if a car works. All the time. Every time. Really well. Comfortably. Enthusiastically. Efficiently. Safely. Hopefully inexpensively. The darn car could have 4 hamsters under the hood for all I care.

 

Does the car give me the utility I need and the experience I want? Thats all I care about.

 

It's like being mad they do not use carburetors anymore.

[Guest heightsgtltd]

As for the topic, while I like the spirit of the STi, the low rent materials and styling do nothing for me.

 

We'll see what the next gen brings us but as it stands I don't see myself in a new Subaru. It may be that the 05-09 BL GT was a never to be repeated best of all worlds option...

 

I can appreciate wanting AWD and good performance, but beyond that I don't really care if it is boxer, etc. Not at this price point. Bitching when you are paying $50K+ makes sense as there should be fewer compromises than it this price point

[IwannaSportSedan]

Just a question though...

 

Who cares if it's a boxer or inline? Transverse or longitudinal?

 

I care if a car works. All the time. Every time. Really well. Comfortably. Enthusiastically. Efficiently. Safely. Hopefully inexpensively. The darn car could have 4 hamsters under the hood for all I care.

 

Does the car give me the utility I need and the experience I want? Thats all I care about.

 

It's like being mad they do not use carburetors anymore.

 

You tell me to move on, and then you say that???????

 

 

Why aren't you driving a Ford, or a Toyota, or something else, then? Leave the real hardware to those of us who KNOW what it is.

 

You are the one who is saying "why not still use carburetors, who cares about fuel injection, anyway!"

 

Boxer engines are lower to the ground, and inherently better balanced than an inline or V engine, and cancel out their own vibration.

 

Longitudinal drivetrain is the logical layout for driving the rear wheels of a car, which is better for chassis dynamics... and AWD adds the front-wheels into that mix, not the other way around.

 

Transverse drivetrains are offset to one side, and not symmetrical. It causes torque steer, and crowds the front suspension into short travel and more drastic angle changes, than having longer suspension arms, and longer driveshafts that change angle less through the suspension's travel.

 

ALL FWD transverse systems that are then converted to AWD, save perhaps the Mitsubishi EVO, have 2 differentials, not three, and have a computer controlled or just a simple viscous coupling to engage "rear-wheel-assist" when slip happens, not pro-active before that.

 

There are options all over the market for people who don't know, and don't care.

 

Yet I am lambasted for lamenting that one of the last affordable options of superior technology, that I DO understand the benefits of, is being diluted to cater to people who don't care, and don't understand, and leaving me with very few, or no options to continue to support that superior technology.

 

This is the crux of my problem with Subaru's direction. They used to know, and care about having the best engineering at their price point. Now they are catering to people who wouldn't know it, even if they are already driving it.

 

The fact is... the STI is languising, as well. It is getting more and more expensive, while offering the same stuff. On one hand I am glad that they offer the choice of body-styles, now... but on the other hand, they have both been ugly since they were introduced, and neither of them are a Legacy replacement, as Legacy goes mainstream. Neither are a grown-up non-boy-racer car that looks decent, on top of the technical performance. Neither car's interior is someplace I would want to spend hours on the open road.

[Guest JessterCPA]

Leave the real hardware to those of us who KNOW what it is.

 

This is insulting. How dare you.

 

I am pickier that you would ever be. I do not want an appliance. You did not read my post. I need utility, I want experience. My vehicle must have both for me to consider it. How exactly a car gets to be what it is, be it 4/6/8 cyl, NA/turbo/super is not really a factor. I need AWD due to my climate.

 

I've had the LGT, and it no longer financially made sense to have it anymore, and my MY eyes, I got a superior vehicle for less money.

[IwannaSportSedan]

How dare I?

 

You just said you don't understand the difference, and don't care to.

 

AFTER YOU JUST FINISHED TELLING ME TO GET OVER IT.

 

Look in the mirror for the one slinging insults.

 

I didn't call your vehicle choice into question. An infiniti, a Ford, a Mazda, whatever... all have REACTIVE AWD, not full-time AWD, but YOU SAID you don't care about such things.

 

I called you on your admitted lack of care about understanding the technical points of Subaru's engineering.

 

I DO know the technical points. and I am OBVIOUSLY far more technically versed and particular. I found the product that suits my needs, then Subaru goes and dilutes it to appeal to people like you, who ADMITTEDLY DON'T CARE.

 

YOUR WORDS, not mine.

 

Yet you, and the rest around here, tell ME to get over it and move on as if I SHOULDN'T care.

 

That is BULLCRAP.

 

People who care as little about the details as you do have PLENTY of options to choose.

 

I HAD ONE OPTION, and now NONE, because Subaru chose YOUR mentality, instead of the mentality that attracted me to Subaru in the first place, 5 years ago.