pillboy Posted March 13, 2010 Share Posted March 13, 2010 And a higher quality crush washer? It is still ugly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClimberDHexMods Posted March 13, 2010 Author Share Posted March 13, 2010 The real question is, do I have to use a better oil filter with Ultra than I do with Platinum? Yes! They're releasing that soon, so stand by. And a higher quality crush washer? No! [CENTER][B][I] Front Limited Slip Racing Differentials for the 5EAT now available for $1895 shipped, please inquire for details! [/I][/B][/CENTER] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldradio1 Posted March 13, 2010 Share Posted March 13, 2010 Just did some more research. Still a group III oil. Weak sauce. For being their flagship, I'm disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFromPA Posted March 13, 2010 Share Posted March 13, 2010 Why? Do you even understand the differences? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolksey85 Posted March 13, 2010 Share Posted March 13, 2010 I'm just glad to see no one has stolen my idea of using orphan tears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iyalla Posted March 13, 2010 Share Posted March 13, 2010 Can't believe I read that whole thread... LOL:lol: me too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehsnils Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 Ever considered that it may be the same oil but different label so that they can take a higher price and phase out the old label or change to run cheaper oil in the old? Marketing tricks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldradio1 Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 Why? Do you even understand the differences? Yes, I do understand the differences. Group III is derived from petroleum bases and therefore are not 100% synthetic. I sure that many Group III oils perform very well in many cases, but I have a problem with how they are advertised. Lets not forget that Mobil 1 used to be group IV before they switched to group III to save a buck because they knew they could get away with calling it "synthetic". I will continue to use only Group IV oils personally instead of using syn-blend oils at fully synthetic prices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClimberDHexMods Posted March 14, 2010 Author Share Posted March 14, 2010 Is the overall marketing strategy perhaps to capture some of the M1 Clean crowd? Because they seem to be positioning the product that way though more subtle. [CENTER][B][I] Front Limited Slip Racing Differentials for the 5EAT now available for $1895 shipped, please inquire for details! [/I][/B][/CENTER] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 Yes, I do understand the differences. Group III is derived from petroleum bases and therefore are not 100% synthetic. I sure that many Group III oils perform very well in many cases, but I have a problem with how they are advertised. I hear what you are saying, but by getting hung up on a technicality you are really turning away from a lot of great performing cheaper oils, the Pennzoil line being one of them. I don't care what it says on the bottom, I care what UOAs look like and mine showed that at ~$20 I can get the same thing, or better, that I would spending $30 or more. I can't think of one single reason why I would put the extra money into some company's pocket other than (stupid) brand loyalty or, like you pointed out, marketing talk. I stopped by Walmart yesterday and sure enough they raised the price on Pennzoil Platinum to $23 a jug:spin: Pennzoil Ultra was next to it for $28. I think they raised the price to entice people into getting the more expensive option since it's "only 5 bucks more". PP used to be right around $19-21 all the time. For the record, because I can see rao facepalming himself right about now , I'm not obsessive over this kind of stuff. The only reason I did UOAs was to see how my engine was doing on Stage 1 and Stage 2. I had several done and I found an oil I could use in a variety of conditions, for cheap, that is up to the task and doesn't shear to shit in the interval that I change it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 If I had a dollar for every person who thought that a group III oil was truly synthetic..... Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 ... you'd have a BMW that didn't need an LS swap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 I'd have a fleet of Lamborghinis, each of which would not be as good as a Legacy GT. Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 You left the Spec.B part out but we all know what you meant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 The "regular" GT is better than a Lamborghini and faster than any Porsche, no need to invoke the mighty Spec B. Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFromPA Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 Yes, I do understand the differences. Group III is derived from petroleum bases and therefore are not 100% synthetic. I sure that many Group III oils perform very well in many cases, but I have a problem with how they are advertised. Lets not forget that Mobil 1 used to be group IV before they switched to group III to save a buck because they knew they could get away with calling it "synthetic". I will continue to use only Group IV oils personally instead of using syn-blend oils at fully synthetic prices. While a great marketing answer, you didn't answer my question. What are the physical property differences between Group III and Group IV in your engine that you don't want? You answer so far was the equivalent of saying: I don't want a treatment of stem cells from amniotic fluid, because it's not the same as stem cells that came from a destroyed embryo. Are the group III molecules less homogenous in size? Do they flow worse? Are they less resistant to burnoff than group IV? When they do burn (as all oil does) what do they leave behind? I mean no offense to you: as Rao beleaguered, many people assume Group III is somehow worse than Group IV simply because Group IV starts in a "purer" state, or because of AMSOIL marketing, or so many other things.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 Well III is smaller than IV, so IV must be better. It's not that complicated. Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFromPA Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 Rao - True, but 3rd times the charm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 4th time is overachieving and anyone that truly loves their car should aim for that. Hopefully this thread will get back to the merits/specs/performance of the oil in question Any UOAs spotted yet? I bet that if any, given how new this thing is on the market, would probably be highway miles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boymk123 Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 Rao, I'm really sorry, but we must get to the bottom of this. It's unfortunate no one has begun an inquiry on this forum already. Does anyone know in what ways Pennzoil Ultra (says Hyper on the bottle as well) Pennzoil is superior to the old Platinum? Will it get all that sludge out of our engines? It's about time Pennzoil released such a high technology product. I used RP, then switched to GC, then now waiting for ENEOS shipping Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldradio1 Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 I hear what you are saying, but by getting hung up on a technicality you are really turning away from a lot of great performing cheaper oils, the Pennzoil line being one of them. I don't care what it says on the bottom, I care what UOAs look like and mine showed that at ~$20 I can get the same thing, or better, that I would spending $30 or more. I can't think of one single reason why I would put the extra money into some company's pocket other than (stupid) brand loyalty or, like you pointed out, marketing talk. I guess I would say that the big thing you gain with Group IV is consistancy. True synthetic oils are built from the ground up. The compounds are more stable than group iii compounds and in theory should have more consistant performance. Anyways, back to the issue at hand. Here are the spec sheets between PP and Ultra Ultra: http://www.epc.shell.com/Docs/GPCDOC_X_cbe_24855_key_140003371945_200911241744.pdf PP: http://www.pennzoil.com/documents/Platinum%20Full%20Synthetic%20Motor%20Oil.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 is this bad for a turbocharged engine? For to couple of extra bucks, just buy the Gunk Flush. I just turned 122,000 mile using what ever oil is cheap at WalMart and Fram filters, I pay $11.00 to $13.00 for the 5qt bottle and buy expensive $4.27 Fram filters. Still have the OEM banjo fitting and the engine run's fine. I still don't see why people spend the extra $$'s for expensive oils. They all must meet the standards recommended. Hey, it's your money spend it where you want. I must have dumb luck, by now my engine or turbo should have blown up. If you believe everything you read. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 There is no need to flush a perfectly good running motor. It can potentially cause more harm than good. Just keep up with oil changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boymk123 Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 There is no need to flush a perfectly good running motor. It can potentially cause more harm than good. Just keep up with oil changes. +1 Flush may potentially leaks your engine. 3K OCI FTW:cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 What about synthetic engine flush products - those should work really well, depending on which Group they are based on. Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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