2008 and 2009 owners: beware of bad internals

[tLewis7]

According to the info I have your car would not be part of the "stop-sale" stealth recall......

 

Legacy 2.5GT-LTD 222825 or later 2008/02/04 or later

 

Does this mean the last 6 digits of the VIN or manf. date of February 4, 2008?

Thanks

[Mad1]

Does this mean the last 6 digits of the VIN or manf. date of February 4, 2008?

Thanks

 

I've gone where the Southern crosses The Yellow Dog

Get away from all these demagogues

And these bad luck women stick like glue

It's either one or the other or neither of the two

 

Bob Dylan Nettie Moore from Modern Times

 

A copy of the Subaru paperwork is on the Forester Forum

 

http://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin/f88/subaru-issues-turbo-stop-sale-certain-08-09-models-31757/

[TSiWRX]

 

A copy of the Subaru paperwork is on the Forester Forum

 

http://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin/f88/subaru-issues-turbo-stop-sale-certain-08-09-models-31757/

 

And like that thread reads, it's also cross-posted on NASIOC, as well as here, on LGT.com:

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/all-08-09-lgt-obxt-85483.html?t=85483&highlight=stop-sale

 

 

All the talk starts around 04/04, and were updated with the Subaru issued statement on 04/07.

 

Note that CreoSTi posted on 04/04, here, on LGT.com, at 9:29AM Eastern - the posting on SubaruForester.org, the one he originated, is time-stamped at 10:01PM Eastern.

[Mad1]

And like that thread reads, it's also cross-posted on NASIOC, as well as here, on LGT.com:

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/all-08-09-lgt-obxt-85483.html?t=85483&highlight=stop-sale

 

 

All the talk starts around 04/04, and were updated with the Subaru issued statement on 04/07.

 

Note that CreoSTi posted on 04/04, here, on LGT.com, at 9:29AM Eastern - the posting on SubaruForester.org, the one he originated, is time-stamped at 10:01PM Eastern.

 

I was not trying to take away from the wonderfulness of this forum. I started out looking for an Outback XT, it was on that forum I found a reference to the post I linked on the Forester forum. I did not end up with my new '08 Spec B until late Oct '09 long after it all happened, but I was glad to discover my car was built before the stealth recall because I have

to wonder how many dealers went through the engine checking procedure

half heartedly and magically all their in stock cars passed just fine and were ready to sell!

[TSiWRX]

I was not trying to take away from the wonderfulness of this forum. I started out looking for an Outback XT, it was on that forum I found a reference to the post I linked on the Forester forum.

 

Ah, my post wasn't intended as flame - I apologize if it was read as such!

 

Instead, I was just trying to say that that piece of bad news circulated throughout the Subaru community quite rapidly. Virtually every community came upon that piece of news on the same day, and was diligently followed-upon by members with updates.

 

I did not end up with my new '08 Spec B until late Oct '09 long after it all happened, but I was glad to discover my car was built before the stealth recall because I have

to wonder how many dealers went through the engine checking procedure

half heartedly and magically all their in stock cars passed just fine and were ready to sell!

 

^ That's part of my worry, too.

 

If you've read through some of the threads here on LegacyGT.com - as well as over at SubaruForester.org - about this issue, you'll probably have seen my posts of the wifey's '09 FXT, which makes me intimately familiar with this particular problem.

 

One of my "hypotheticals" was just that question/point which you've made:

 

How many dealerships actually performed the requested/required test, and how many simply rubber-stamped things, electing to, against all morals and ethics, simply keeping the cars on the lot and available for sales, simply because they can't afford to or don't want to sit on the inventory, and out of the rather abhorrent thought of "just let the customer deal with it."

 

It's certainly the more cynical way of thinking about the reasons why so many are seeing this problem, of vehicles within said VIN/manufacture-range, but having supposedly "passed" the test.

 

And in all honesty, I don't know if it's any better or worse than the thought that these vehicles did truly and in reality "pass" the pre-sale testing procedure that Subaru prescribed - and later failed: which would signal that the testing procedure was, itself, inadequate and unreliable.

 

Either way, I think that's a tough pill for us consumers to swallow, and as a Subaru devotee, I am very disappointed.

[Mad1]

I got a lot more cynical about dealer behavior with my second oil change. I am in the

southwest where we deal with very high engine operating temps. I went to the dealer for my second oil change (I think having the dealer change your oil is a good idea with these cars simply for warranty purpose) and ask about heavier weight oil than the 5w-30 I got on my first change (at least they used Castrol partial synthetic) and was told by the service writer that "we have all weights", so I say I want heavier oil than 5w-30. Service writer says he will check for the recommendation of the head of the shop and returns in a few minutes and informs me that he recommends 5w-30 because it has "special additives". Bull@#%$ alarm bells go off in my head and I say this is contradictory to my owners manual that recommends heavier oil for higher operating temps which we will soon have in Texas.

Service writer leaves comes back and says tech is going to call Subaru and see what they say. Returns and says they can use 10w30 but that 10w-40 is only for places over 120 degrees (easily obtainable in the summer on Dallas freeways). Then I note the tech coming into the parts deptartment and he tells the guy making the paperwork to make mine for 10w30 and then walking out into the shop and filling my car from the same bulk feed line they use for everybody else, filling my car with 5w-30. Do you think folks of this caliber paid any attention at all to the stealth recall procedures?

[TSiWRX]

^ Indeed, that's a problem - with that kind of service, I would not trust that dealership's service department at all.

 

The big variable is that not all dealerships and their service departments will fit the mold. Some are mod-friendly. Some are honest to a fault. But yes, unfortunately, those who exist just to make a buck, are ignorant, or simply don't care about the customer - or, even worse, simply would want to treat the customer as a roadblock to their earning a buck - do exist.

[Mad1]

That brings up a problem others have mentioned, if you are unhappy with your nearby dealer, your next choice can be a considerable distance and inconvenience

to deal with just because there are not that many dealers, three in the entire state of NM to the best of my knowledge.

[Mad1]

I forgot the best piece of info the service writer passed on to an old man that has literally worn out dozens of cars and trucks in his life........the reason I should go for the 5w30 (in contradiction to the owners manual) is because modern engines are assembled so tight they are "running on air"! TRUE STORY

[TSiWRX]

That brings up a problem others have mentioned, if you are unhappy with your nearby dealer, your next choice can be a considerable distance and inconvenience

to deal with just because there are not that many dealers, three in the entire state of NM to the best of my knowledge.

 

^ Exactly.

 

It's a good solution, in-theory.

 

But in real-world application, that may be much less feasible.

[Soda Popinski]

50,000 mile update:

 

The engine has been perfect since the replacement. The turbo was upgraded to a vf-52 from an 09 wrx after it was never replaced during the original fiasco. The power increase is definately there. To support the larger turbo, I went with an 08 STi fuel pump and DW injectors (IIRC 770) and had the entire system flushed, changed over to Motul Synthetic 5w30 and completely tuned.

 

The smoke has gone and aside from the white-knuckle torque I get out of it, the car is very well behaved.

 

I am not sure what the moderators of this board want to do with this thread. I never wanted this thread to turn into any flame wars, or poo slinging... I wanted owners of said vehicles (in the title) to just be aware of the problems that I had gone through and be vigilant about the oil, as well as tuning should ANY changes be made.

 

All in all, the thread wasn't supposed to scare anyone away from buying a Subaru. In fact, the cars we have are really good looking, safe and fun cars to drive. It's all part of what made me choose an LGT in the first place.

 

I'm about 95% satisfied with what I have... a car doing low 12's in the 1/4, 0-60 in 4.8 seconds and turns heads to boot. It cost me a lot more than I had originally planned for, but in the end it was spent money and I have fun every single time I get into it.

 

So be diligent about the oil, record it, look at it when it's changed (if you don't do it yourself) and be wary of high engine temperatures, especially if you change the intake. Don't hesitate to ask the dealership or a Subaru dealer if you are concerned: it's better to be safe than sorry.

 

And for goodness sakes, don't try to add 4 quarts of oil to an empty engine, even if you are stuck on the side of a turnpike that AAA doesn't tow from on a Holiday at 5:30 PM, even if there's no pay phone and your cell is dead and you're carrying a dog or a kid... flag someone down and have them call the state police... especially if you're on the Garden State Parkway.

 

Good luck!

[nightspeed98]

50,000 mile update:

 

 

And for goodness sakes, don't try to add 4 quarts of oil to an empty engine, even if you are stuck on the side of a turnpike that AAA doesn't tow from on a Holiday at 5:30 PM, even if there's no pay phone and your cell is dead and you're carrying a dog or a kid... flag someone down and have them call the state police... especially if you're on the Garden State Parkway.

 

Good luck!

 

LMAO sounds like a true story if not one close to (your) home lol

[PhillyWilly]

I'm about 95% satisfied with what I have... a car doing low 12's in the 1/4, 0-60 in 4.8 seconds and turns heads to boot. It cost me a lot more than I had originally planned for, but in the end it was spent money and I have fun every single time I get into it.

Good luck!

 

Nice. Come out to the auto-x at Wachovia on Sunday!

[TSiWRX]

I am not sure what the moderators of this board want to do with this thread. I never wanted this thread to turn into any flame wars, or poo slinging... I wanted owners of said vehicles (in the title) to just be aware of the problems that I had gone through and be vigilant about the oil, as well as tuning should ANY changes be made.

 

Keep it open or lock it, it doesn't matter to me.

 

But definitely don't delete/erase it.

 

There's too much actual, good, information here to be lost.

[Soda Popinski]

LMAO sounds like a true story if not one close to (your) home lol

 

It's exactly what happened to me. But I'll always be seen as doing the wrong thing in an impossible situation. Live and learn.

[TheOneDoubleN]

I wandered into this thread from some other knock thread, and after pouring over all of this I have a few questions for those experienced folk here.

 

I just leased a 2010 (5th gen) LGT. I have no intentions on modifying it past the AccessPort I installed and the 2010 STI Rear Sway. I live in LA, so we only have 91, so I'm typically running the 91ACN map, which is fairly conservative IMO (compared to the 93 at least!). I occasionally will mix 100 octane in with the 91 to get to 93 so I can run that map on the weekends (and it is a night and day difference, with an extra 1.5psi of boost). I don't plan on racing or autox'ing the car, it's my daily driver, but I do take it up into the canyons in malibu on the weekends and push it pretty darn hard around the twisties.

 

It's my understanding the engine was completely redesigned from the ground up for 2010. I'll be honest, I typically try to not let forum stories scare me off, because it's usually one horror story out of 10,000 that were good and didn't say anything, but this thread has me nervous now even about just running my Cobb AP. Do I need to worry about engine reliability? I love this car (my last was an 01 Lexus GS300, which had the bullet proof toyota supra engine in it, ran it hard to 125,000mi, ran perfectly until it was totaled in a rear ending), but now I'm a bit gun shy.

 

I was planning on paying off the car after my 3yr lease (and when the warranty ends...), but now I'm skeptical as to whether or not I should keep it after reading all these horror stories of engines blowing up. I want this car to last hundreds of thousands of miles. I meticulously maintain my vehicles and bought my Subaru mostly because of it's great track record for reliability (I see old subaru's everywhere, way more than other cars). What do you think, should I be worried? Does anyone know anything about the new 265hp engine in the 5th gen? Is it more reliable? Do I sound nervous??

 

Thanks to anyone that gives me awesome expert info .

 

Oh, and apologies in advance for reviving a dead thread

[TSiWRX]

Don't get too nervous - the '09 FXT that we had a problem with was our 3rd Subaru (I still DD my '05 LGT, and my wife DD'ed an '05 WRX prior to the FXT), and aside from this bit of major mechanical malfunction, we've had really smooth sailing.

 

Typically, Cobb maps are "safe" enough, but to be honest, off-the-shelf (OTS) is OTS, and you can never really tell what one car might do that another will not. If you really value "safety," it's worth it, I think, to have a well-regarded tuner at least look at your datalogs, if not pursue either a live or remote (i.e. "e-") tune (be it a road-tune or on the dyno) that's custom to your vehicle, and towards your desires for having a good safety margin.

 

The 5th generation is unique in many ways, and until more miles and years have passed, we simply won't know what its statistics will be.

 

However, if you've negotiated the purchase price aggressively, you could very well come out ahead, at the end of the lease, with the purchase - but you've got some time to let that play out.