StoplightAssassin Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 One of my friends is a salesman for acura...after hearing the stories at his office, I would rather build my own car out of rocks and wood than deal with a car dealership/salesman. They literally try to f*** you every chance they get. He told me all about the shady stuff they pull when writing up numbers and figuring out financing. The only person I've ever tipped involving a car repair was the windshield repair man that did the work in my driveway in 40 degree temperatures. I would tip a detailer too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnAWD Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 Are you serious? ... we deal with so much stupidity and ignorance in our customer base that we deserve a tip ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrrm Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 lol Jordan does have a point because you'll see some kid come in that has good "baby credit" and since their equifax says they have a 680 with 1 good account and they want a brand new $30,000 car at 0% interest rate and a 84 month term at $250/month or someone comes in with terrible credit with 2 repos and in a ch13 lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kid8 Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 haha man some of your guys stories brings me back to the good days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longislander1 Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 If you're outraged at the thought of a tip (and I fully agree with you), then you guys might like this story. I took my Boxster to the nearest dealer for its first service. Now, mind you, back in '06, a Boxster oil change was $250 and is now up as high as $350 at some dealers. As I'm waiting for the service manager to write me up, I'm talking to this woman who's brought in her 911. She says to me that it's always good to tip the service techs. I'm horrified by this. Jeez, I'm overpaying as it is. Needless to say, she rides off in a Cayenne loaner and I get a smelly Enterprise Malibu. They only needed 3.5 hours to service my car and took four days to do it. As I'm sitting in the service manager's office waiting to claim my car, it's chaos in the shop just behind me. "Hey, did you change the battery in that 911?" says one tech. "What battery?" says the other. "The guy's here to pick up his car," says the first. "Uh-oh," says the second. And then it goes downhill from there. Tip, my ass. Needless to say, I beat it outta there and never went back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesuby Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 If you're outraged at the thought of a tip (and I fully agree with you), then you guys might like this story. I took my Boxster to the nearest dealer for its first service. Now, mind you, back in '06, a Boxster oil change was $250 and is now up as high as $350 at some dealers. As I'm waiting for the service manager to write me up, I'm talking to this woman who's brought in her 911. She says to me that it's always good to tip the service techs. I'm horrified by this. Jeez, I'm overpaying as it is. Needless to say, she rides off in a Cayenne loaner and I get a smelly Enterprise Malibu. They only needed 3.5 hours to service my car and took four days to do it. As I'm sitting in the service manager's office waiting to claim my car, it's chaos in the shop just behind me. "Hey, did you change the battery in that 911?" says one tech. "What battery?" says the other. "The guy's here to pick up his car," says the first. "Uh-oh," says the second. And then it goes downhill from there. Tip, my ass. Needless to say, I beat it outta there and never went back. I tipped the service tech who replaced the timing belt and water pump on my wife's Acura. The job was done well and I didn't see any evidence of sloppy work or missing parts. I don't see anything wrong with a tip for a complex job to get the mechanic's full attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verwilderd Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 I've read through some of these posts and while we as salespeople do make commission, in most cases we don't make hardly anything on new car sales. Plus we only make commission off of gross profit and since there's so much info out there on invoice pricing, we usually don't get paid but a base amount on a car sale. All these people that say not to tip us don't realize that we have to earn a living too and if we sell a car at invoice and don't make money it's hard to afford to work at a dealership. If you like your sales person and thought he was helpful you can tip him. I guarantee he will appreciate it and you will have earned a loyal sales person for life. This person will more than likely go out of their way to help you with anything from a new car purchase to hook you up with parts and service. Often times, people think we as sales people are evil and are ripping you off if we make any kind of profit. But if that's truly the case, then every business out there is evil. Plus the sales person isn't the one getting all that money. It's the dealership. For example, I'm paid 25% of gross profit on the price of the car. So with Subaru having roughly $1500 mark up in most of their cars (some have a little more and some have less), at max I'll make $350 on a car deal. But that's very rare since most people strive for invoice and can get it if they're smart and research. So usually I only make $100 for a car sale. If you were to tip me $100 for doing a good job, I would make sure you left with the best deal and you've just doubled my pay of the car sale. If you tip or offer your sales guy money, it's cheaper on you to do it directly than it is for him to make that money in the car deal. For me to make $200 on a car deal you'd have to pay $800 over invoice. Also if you're sales person is a "company man" he'd probably not even accept, but the offer would go a long way. People forget that buying a car is not the end of a relationship but rather the beginning. If you treat the people well, it'll usually be returned. But to all those thinking it's stupid to tip a sales person or at least offer, remember, we ate people too. I bet you wouldn't appreciate someone coming to your place of business treating you poorly and trying to make sure you aren't paid for the hours you've worked trying to help a customer out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verwilderd Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 I work at a dealership and depending on the gross commission of the sale the salesman can make usually anywhere from $150 (called a mini on a new car) up to amount. They usually make 10-15% front half (gross commission) and 10-15% back half (extra warranty) New cars barely make any commission because there's only so much you can do on the price unless you trade in your car and they rip the trade. When you go to a dealership a salesman would rather selling you a $15,000 used car than a $35,000 new car. Don't ever tip a salesman because he's talking sh*t about you behind your back no matter if he's making money or not.....if he's making money then he's calling you a mullet or a dumbass and will be the nicest guy you've met but if he's not making money then he's bitching about having to deal with a mini and will get you out of the door ASAP. I'm not a salesman anymore thank god but when I was I would do the same thing lol. Car salesman are very shisty and will f*ck you in anyway possible, same with the finance guy that attaches those "great" extended warranties for $3000 (sometimes without your knowledge so view your paperwork before signing). I'm whats called a "desk guy" so I just shoot off your app to the banks and get the terms of financing so I don't have a guilty conscience anymore lol This is completely retarded. If you really think they are ripping you off by making roughly 15%-30% profit, you obviously have no idea about the mark-up in 99% of the items out there. Food for example os marked up 200% in many cases, cables that you'd by from best buy, over 1000% and I could go on. If a dealership doesn't make money then they can't afford to stay open and offer the services to the public that they do. Sales people don't really make that much when you look at how much of that 15-30% they actually get. They might get 20-30% of that 15-30% profit. Services techs are paid hourly so the dealership gets most of that money to afford to keep a staff and keep the doors open. The problem is not with the sales people but the entire industry. We really just need to go to set pricing on all cars. Then you always have a consistant pricing that customers don't know the profits involved and won't feel like they were ripped off because everyone is paid the same. As for the sales people who talk crap about customers they've just made a lot of money on, the biggest reason is because they're idiots and trained to think that way and because it doesn't happen often where they make a lot of money so they get excited. Personally I hate this industry. I think it's set up stupid and I hate the tactics people use to get more money out of customers. I may be rare, but if I make any money it's because I've earned it. I don't pad payments (meaning I show you $250 a month on a $10,000 car when the payment is really $200...just using random numbers for this example) plus because I love subarus and could give a crap about making tons of money I make sure everyone leaves with a good deal...the only time I don't go out of my way to help someone is if they cone in to the dealership and begin to treat me like dirt. So this is why I always recommend finding a sales person out there that you trust and enjoy working with. If you make the effort to treat them right, they'll do the same. And for me, when I'm offered a tip, I never except but greatly appreciate it. There are good sales people out there if you look for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrrm Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 :lol: :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest heightsgtltd Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 First off, a tip is for outstanding service, not just for doing your job correctly. That is a fallacy that is perpetuated in this country. second, I just deal with the internet manager before a car purchase that way it's all done before I get there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m sprank Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 Like I said. If you are upset with your compensation, find another job. At least you have one. Can you tell I'm fed up with the "I deserve a tip" mentality? Thanks for pouring my coffee, now get that damn tip cup out of my face! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verwilderd Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 That's perfectly fine to deal with the Internet and is actually the best way IMO. You are correct that a tip should be given for good service and I agree with you there 100%. So if you're sales person really did a fantastic job and especially if you've gotten invoice pricing (at least with Subaru...they don't have an invoice for customers and a completely different one for the dealership) a tip is a really nice gesture....especially because he/she isn't going to be making any money. And sherrm, most dealerships (at least in my area) don't pay on the back end for sales people. And back to tipping in this country...it really is a problem. I lived in Germany for a while studying there and 99% of stuff is set. Even when buying a car. You have the price, the required money down, the set rate and your monthly payment as a result. You don't like it, move on to a cheaper car. A car in America is the only thing where there is a top price you will pay (it is illegal now to over charge on the car...they may mark it up buy selling you additional things you don't know about), you can negotiate, but have a bottom line that's out there for everyone to know if you're willing to search (very few cases where a dealership takes a total loss on the car deal). I think we make a car buying process overly complicated. I like scions approach to pricing and it would be more effective if everyone had a set price. Then customers will be buying solely on quality and budget. After a while we would get better cars for less money just like everything else because that would be the only way for manufacturers to stay on top. , Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verwilderd Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 Like I said. If you are upset with your compensation, find another job. At least you have one. Can you tell I'm fed up with the "I deserve a tip" mentality? Thanks for pouring my coffee, now get that damn tip cup out of my face! I'm not saying you have to tip. I don't like that mentality either, I see it more as a way of saying thank you when you feel that a person has gone above and beyond what he/she was supposed to. I hate that we are put in a position to tip someone for doing something so simple such as pouring a cup of coffee. As for the find another job part, I'm still in this because I don't need a job. This isn't a career for me hence why I always try to give someone a better deal. I don't care about how much I make as long as I'm making something. I'm just saying that many people think car salesmen are evil when they make money and really they aren't. This is their job and how they put food on the table and if someone thinks they deserve a little extra for a job well done then then great, because overall we don't make as much money as people think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrrm Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 There really is no such thing as a "set price" because I was working at a Hyundai dealership a while ago and they were selling off 2008 Tiburons at $10k BRAND NEW! They MSRP at $18k or somewhere around there..they were taking a loser deal on each one they sold because they had "Hyundai cash" for how many they sold. A salesman is commission based so his job is already based upon performance unless he sucks and he'll make minimum wage lol. If he's not making enough cash doing his job then he should find another one. But for someone to tip them when they're already spending more than enough on a car that's going to burry them (no matter what car/price you get) that's insane. Send them a thank you card or a referral...they looooove referrals lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verwilderd Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 There is a bottom price. In the case you just mentioned that bottom price was moved lower because of the hyundai cash. And while there is some truth to a salesman's pay being performance based because of the Internet and the information out there all of that is changing. Because we are paid on gross profit and because customer more times than not (at least Subaru customers) know what we own the cars for, it doesn't matter how "good" of a job I do. If they know they can purchase the car at a set price, they'll do it. I may have sold them on the car but because they know my bottom line I may not get them on price unless I sell the car at invoice and make a mini. And from talking to many friends who sell multiple brands, it seems like the typical Subaru customer comes prepared. If had customers many tines come in with sheets full of all the cars in the area with their vin, msrp and invoice prices. Not much you can do there. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining, just pointing out a fact. If I hated it I would sell another brand but I like Subaru too much. But saying your pay is based on performance it just not totally correct. If you know you like a car and can get it at a certain price, why would you overpay just because you liked the salesman. No person would do that and that's where "tipping" can come into to play. It is far cheaper to tip the person they thought did a good job than to overpay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longislander1 Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 If people want to tip techs, that's up to them. As for me, I'm not shelling out $300+ for an oil change and then handing someone $10-$20 on top of that. I think that's just plain nuts. I also would never tip a salesperson. During the price negotiations, the salesperson is your adversary. He/she is out to extract as much money as possible from you. You're there to pay as little as possible. It's important to remain civil during negotiations. And once a final price is determined, it's appropriate to smile and shake hands. When I bought my two Subarus, the salesperson put me through the wringer both times. I had to work hard to get the price I wanted, yet I'm sure the dealership made out just fine. At the end of the negotiations, we shook hands and I would probably go to him again when I needed a new car. (Plus, the dealer service is great.) But no way is he entitled to a tip. If he has a compensation issue, he should take it up with the boss. The best way to reward a salesperson is through referrals and I've done that several times for my Subaru guy. For excellent service in the back shop, I try to send a complimentary e-mail to the owner or service manager. If they want to use it in their advertising or promotion, that's fine with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verwilderd Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 You'd be surprised at how little a dealership makes on a new car sale...especially with Subaru. That's why you see every dealership sell used cars and have a service center. Those are where the money is at. And for those who say if a sales person doesn't like their pay to take it up with the boss, I ask, is that what you do everytime you don't like your pay? Obviously if the pay was horrible then the person would find another job...and that's what a lot of salespeople do. The thing people are missing is that both with service and sales, you take care of them, they'll take care of you. Plain and simple. You wanna leave confident that you got the best deal then be nice and help them out. With sales, if they are nice and hook you up, they just threw away money, so if you throw them a small bone they'll be more likely to help you get the best possible deal. If you don't want to do that then that's fine but you'll never know for sure if you could have gotten a better deal. Would you rather spend $100 to save $200 and know it, or hope you saved the $200? And like I said, if he's an honest guy he won't accept your tip but appreciate that you're thinking of him. If it were me and you offered me a tip, I can honestly say that I wouldn't accept it, but I would make sure you got the best deal we could offer and show it to you so you knew...not just tell you that you got a good deal. Just remember, I'm the guy on the other side of the table, so I think I could speak for a good majority of salespeople (except for the older guys who come from a different generation. They'll probably screw you. That's why it's important to find someone you like and trust) in saying that if you do this, this will happen. It's just a simple fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longislander1 Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 You'd be surprised at how little a dealership makes on a new car sale...especially with Subaru. That's why you see every dealership sell used cars and have a service center. Those are where the money is at. And for those who say if a sales person doesn't like their pay to take it up with the boss, I ask, is that what you do everytime you don't like your pay? Obviously if the pay was horrible then the person would find another job...and that's what a lot of salespeople do. The thing people are missing is that both with service and sales, you take care of them, they'll take care of you. Plain and simple. You wanna leave confident that you got the best deal then be nice and help them out. With sales, if they are nice and hook you up, they just threw away money, so if you throw them a small bone they'll be more likely to help you get the best possible deal. If you don't want to do that then that's fine but you'll never know for sure if you could have gotten a better deal. Would you rather spend $100 to save $200 and know it, or hope you saved the $200? And like I said, if he's an honest guy he won't accept your tip but appreciate that you're thinking of him. If it were me and you offered me a tip, I can honestly say that I wouldn't accept it, but I would make sure you got the best deal we could offer and show it to you so you knew...not just tell you that you got a good deal. Just remember, I'm the guy on the other side of the table, so I think I could speak for a good majority of salespeople (except for the older guys who come from a different generation. They'll probably screw you. That's why it's important to find someone you like and trust) in saying that if you do this, this will happen. It's just a simple fact. It's good that we get the salesperson's perspective on here and I appreciate where you're coming from. However, the amount of money that the dealer and salesperson make on a car isn't my problem. They should go talk to SOA about better profit margins or things like whether it's prudent to now charge $995 for a moonroof that used to be standard even on the SE models. Also, I'm not there to become best friends with the salesperson. I'm there to buy the car. So, for example, when my salesperson tells me they won't give up any of their holdback so I can get another $100 or so off the car (maybe that should be THEIR tip to me for buying it), I should tip him for that? Civility, a smile, a handshake and some referrals should suffice for a deal well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest heightsgtltd Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 ^^^^ exactly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m sprank Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLegacy99 Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 I think sometimes the best things you can do is write your dealer, corperate HQ, etc. about the person if you really had good service. Here's why: I work in an upscale grocery store. My department did $25k more this quarter than this time last year, setting a new record for us and during a recession. I don't see a penny of that, but yeah, I did work harder. What I've found is that people are quick to complain a crappy service or even if they are slightly unsatisfied. However, really good service is rarely even given a second thought. And you can apply this to so many industries. It only takes a couple minutes to fill out a positive comment card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLegacy99 Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 Like I said. If you are upset with your compensation, find another job. At least you have one. Can you tell I'm fed up with the "I deserve a tip" mentality? Thanks for pouring my coffee, now get that damn tip cup out of my face! I dunno, did you ever work in the restaraunt business. I certainly was never one to go around and beg for tips, usually the quality of more work spoke for itself when I got tipped out at the end of the day. But, there are always people who ask for more and more and more and then leave nothing. Teachers tend to be the worst offenders, no offense to anyone. I def. tip alot more after working this industry, even to bar tenders who do tend to earn a normal wage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verwilderd Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 I'll always tip well when at a restaurant/bar. Those people often times work long hard hours and this is how they earn a living. It's easy to say if you don't like it find another job, but the fact is that people work where they do for a reason and you never know their circstances. So you shouldn't judge. If it was so easy to find another job that's better and pays well, everyone would do it and be happy but that's not the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLegacy99 Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 Are you supposed to tip the guy at Pep Boys who installs your wipers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verwilderd Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 It's good that we get the salesperson's perspective on here and I appreciate where you're coming from. However, the amount of money that the dealer and salesperson make on a car isn't my problem. They should go talk to SOA about better profit margins or things like whether it's prudent to now charge $995 for a moonroof that used to be standard even on the SE models. Also, I'm not there to become best friends with the salesperson. I'm there to buy the car. So, for example, when my salesperson tells me they won't give up any of their holdback so I can get another $100 or so off the car (maybe that should be THEIR tip to me for buying it), I should tip him for that? Civility, a smile, a handshake and some referrals should suffice for a deal well done. There's a couple problems with some of the things said here. First with regards to profit margins. If Subaru raises those then the car will ultimately become more expensive. Second I don't know of any sales people that get paid on holdback. And I'm not saying you have to be bff's with your sales person but being considering of the salesperson can help you get a better without the bs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.