je24 Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 My local dealer just got in two non-Limited GT Wagons, one with the 5EAT and the other with the 5MT. Just for a point of reference, I have been driving a stock 2002 WRX wagon 5MT for the past three years. My comments are as follows (I did not have a camera - sorry, no pics): First, I have seen a number of posts inquiring if the non-Limited GTs have dual-zone climate control. The two I drove had both dual-zone and Auto climate control. I changed the driver and passenger temps (i.e., digital readouts) just to make sure I was not seeing things. I thought the car looked really good, especially the rims and 45 series tires. But then again, I bought a 2002 WRX when practically everyone thought it was one of the ugliest cars! Oh well. It was dusk when I drove the cars so I did not get a good look at the seat color, but the center section appeared to be light gray (I know there is some brown in it but it looked gray without getting close) and the sides appeared to be black. The feel of the seats (shape and material) reminded me of my WRX's seats, which to me is a good thing. I am 6'1" and fit very well. The driver's area does not appear to be much bigger than the WRX (as others have posted), but that does not bother me much. With the seat adjusted to my normal driving position (I probably sit a little closer than others my size - I do not like my leg close to being completely extended when the clutch is depressed), I would guess that there may have been almost twice the amount of rear seat leg room than my WRX (this was not scientific, but just an estimate from a quick glance - so please do not flame me if this is wrong). I drove the manual first. Either the car was not as fast as my WRX or it is very deceptive since it does not hit as hard at 3,000-3,500 RPM. It is a lot smoother and it does pull, but just not as much as the WRX (at least IMO). I will say that after accelerating through three gears and just casually driving I would look down at the speedo thinking I was going 40 MPH (based on the feel of the WRX) and find that I was actually going 60-65 MPH. Once again, it may be that it is deceptively fast (or that it is not broken in). The car was very quiet, but when you accelerated hard you could easily hear the engine, which I thought had the similar boxer note as the WRX. One other thing I noticed was that it exhibited the "rubber-banding" effect that I have experienced on the WRX (i.e., surging when slightly accelerating), which I was not overly happy about. I drove the automatic next and to my surprise it felt quicker than the manual. Once again, it may not be quicker but it sure did feel like it was (I was REALLY surprised to read another post about Car and Driver's 7.1 0-60 for an Outback XT). Off the line was quicker than my WRX, and it felt as if it pulled harder in the mid and upper RPM ranges than the manual (and close to my WRX). Most of the shifts were very quick (a few times you could confuse it to where it would delay shifting - but not during hard acceleration, mostly when shifting from 2-3 under light throttle). After I remembered about the steering wheel controls I ended up liking them quite a bit. I have to say that this was the best implementation of a manumatic transmission I have driven, comparing to a BMW 330 (previous best), Infinity G35 (worst), Acura TL and TSX and an Audi A4. In my 25-minute test drive the only time it shifted for itself in manual mode was when I came to a complete stop. I thought the handling of both cars was very good, very similar to my WRX wagon but with less body roll (and I think my WRX rolls a fair amount). The extra weight was not that noticeable - there were only a few times when I could feel it (slightly), and those were mostly when making sharp steering adjustments mid-turn. Before I went to the dealership, I thought for sure I would be putting an order in for a white GT Limited wagon 5MT with taupe interior. I really did not want the dark interior (after living with my WRX's basically black interior for three years I am really tired of the dark colors), really wanted the sunroof (I sat in a 3.0R wagon with the huge sunroof - unbelievable!) and really did not want leather. But, the leather was the lowest on the list and in order to get the other two I have to get a Limited (others have complained about the way Subaru is configuring/equipping the car, so I will go no further). Anyway, after my test drives, I was a little under whelmed by the 5MT and very impressed with the 5EAT (both based on my pre-drive expectations). My only issue now is that I did not want to go over $30K (or at least by much), and if I want the Limited and Auto I am close to $2K over (at least by MSRP). I did not want my experience (or this post) to be negative at all, believe me. I have had (and am still having) quite a few issues with my WRX (from the first allotment) and was ready to get rid of it the end of last summer. I drove a number of cars and was actually about to get a two-year old BMW 330xi (to stay around $30K), which IMO was the only car as fun as my WRX. The only thing keeping me from getting it was I had heard about the 05 Legacy GT that was coming. So I have been waiting quite some time for this test drive (as others have I am sure). I really prefer AWD over RWD (despise FWD) and the only other options are used Audis (reliability concerns based on experiences of relatives, slow except for S4, all fairly heavy - ditto for new Passats) and the BMW 330xi (reliability concerns once again based on experiences of relatives, pricey, two-year old 3 series does not have the level of safety as the Legacy). I still think the Legacy is a good value compared to the other options, and will most likely get one fairly soon. But I think I will need to take a few more test drives and hear of other peoples experiences before I decide which to get. Thanks for taking the time to read this. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akm3 Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 Wonderful write up! I'm impressed that so many people like the sportshift so much...I'm seriously considering getting it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outahere Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 [quote name='je24'] One other thing I noticed was that it exhibited the "rubber-banding" effect that I have experienced on the WRX (i.e., surging when slightly accelerating), which I was not overly happy about. Jim[/quote] Did Subaru have a fix for this on your WRX? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outahere Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 [quote name='je24'] Before I went to the dealership, I thought for sure I would be putting an order in for a white GT Limited wagon 5MT with taupe interior. I really did not want the dark interior (after living with my WRX's basically black interior for three years I am really tired of the dark colors), really wanted the sunroof (I sat in a 3.0R wagon with the huge sunroof - unbelievable!) and really did not want leather. But, the leather was the lowest on the list and in order to get the other two I have to get a Limited (others have complained about the way Subaru is configuring/equipping the car, so I will go no further). [/quote] I am not a fan of dark interiors either. They seem to compress the interior space, and easily show dirt. Its a shame we are not getting a color choice on the cloth interior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axis008 Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 Welcome to the forums, and thanks for writing a review! Just thinking... [quote name='je24']First, I have seen a number of posts inquiring if the non-Limited GTs have dual-zone climate control. The two I drove had both dual-zone and Auto climate control. I changed the driver and passenger temps (i.e., digital readouts) just to make sure I was not seeing things.[/quote] This is really interesting....... -ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Zevil Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 I find it hard to believe that you the MT was slower than the auto.. I wonder if you were just expecting too much or something. It seems so counterintuitive. Turbo cars are ALWAYS faster in manual tranny's. Very interesting indeed. Almost makes me wish I got the auto, almost ;) ..but then again I couldn't afford it then :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerdave Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 We really need an instrumented test of a manual... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Zevil Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 I have heard from multiple people that the car seems slower than it is since it's so refined.. not like the WRX that feels like it's going to sling you off the road when you hammer on it about 3K RPMs.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CombatCQB Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 This climate control thing is getting more and more confusing by the day. Maybe SOA had a change of heart after the brochure went to press already and couldn't change it in writing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgeracer Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 [quote name='Dr. Zevil']I find it hard to believe that you the MT was slower than the auto.. I wonder if you were just expecting too much or something. It seems so counterintuitive. Turbo cars are ALWAYS faster in manual tranny's. Very interesting indeed. Almost makes me wish I got the auto, almost ;) ..but then again I couldn't afford it then :lol:[/quote] ditto... "Gimme mines Balboa...Gimme mines".....Clubber Lang - Mr. T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUBE555 Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 From what I remember with driving both the FXT auto and manual, the auto seemed faster onl because I could tell when the turbo kicked in, it was nearly seamless in the manual. The reason I probably didn't notice is that by the time I'm getting on the gas from the stoplight, in the manual, rpms are at/above 2000rpm already where the auto is starting out lower and runs lower than I normally would in an auto. So I'd agree, the auto probably feels faster, but the manual really is the sleeper here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtguy Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 [quote name='je24']First, I have seen a number of posts inquiring if the non-Limited GTs have dual-zone climate control. The two I drove had both dual-zone and Auto climate control. I changed the driver and passenger temps (i.e., digital readouts) just to make sure I was not seeing things. Jim[/quote] Jim, is it possible that the dual-zone was an option? Did you look at the window sticker? If it's standard (as we were all led to believe in the first place) that is good news for fans of the dual-zone. This is what Subaru lists for the non-Limited GT at Subaru.com: <<Manually adjustable CFC-free air conditioning system with rotary controls for temperature, 4-speed fan and airflow direction>> My other question is about the armrest extension, the deal that slides up and forward. Has anyone actually seen one of these on a car? Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chapel Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 yeah, please let us know about the dual zone climate control that's a really attractive option to me But I cant afford the $30k for the Ltd package Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken S Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 Jim, Thanks for taking the time to share your review. That was some fine reading! I was very happy to hear that the 5EAT performs well. Would you care to expand on how the manumatics of the other vehicles you've driven compare (ie. what made the G35 manumatic the "worst")? Lastly, you mentioned first allotment issues with your WRX. Would you be worried about something similar with the Legacys? Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drift Monkey Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 Intresting how the manual feels slower than the auto. A good way to get tickets I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBY Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 [quote name='je24']I thought the handling of both cars was very good, very similar to my WRX wagon but with less body roll (and I think my WRX rolls a fair amount). The extra weight was not that noticeable - there were only a few times when I could feel it (slightly), and those were mostly when making sharp steering adjustments mid-turn.[/quote] Sounds great, can't wait to test-drive one myself. Thanks for the write-up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Zevil Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 [quote name='gtguy'] My other question is about the armrest extension, the deal that slides up and forward. Has anyone actually seen one of these on a car? Kevin[/quote] I talked to my dealer and he is checking into it. He will give me a call when he know. He said that he has seen pics of the armrest extension in some of the cars that he has seen, but SOA is not offering it as an option. So I guess only time will tell, unless some of you that have driven it know the answer already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtguy Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 The auto/dual zone is apparently standard on non-Limited GTs in Canada. Perhaps the same thing happened in this market, w/o Subaru saying anything. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drift Monkey Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 Why the hustle and bustle over climate control? It must be my youth that makes me not appreciate such luxury items. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBY Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 The 2.5i I sat in yesterday had the manual controls and although the function/feel of the switches was better than my WRX it definately wasn't up the the standard of my wifes '00 VW Cabrio. The auto system in the L.L. Bean Outback on the other hand was VERY nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtguy Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 [quote name='Drift Monkey']Why the hustle and bustle over climate control? It must be my youth that makes me not appreciate such luxury items. :lol:[/quote] Some folks have wives who like it colder or hotter than their spouses, which makes such a feature pretty darned cool. If you think about it, you can set your side at 72, and her side at 65, or vice versa. Now admittedly, it's the front of a car, which is a fairly confined space, but people who have used it say that it seems to make a difference. If couples have a large temperature variance, one either had to be too hot or too cold. :lol: Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drift Monkey Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 I thought that was a part of marriage. Comprimise. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBY Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 The other option is for one of you to wear more or less clothes depending on who feels hot or cold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drift Monkey Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 Or marry someone who has a LOW temperature varience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtguy Posted June 2, 2004 Share Posted June 2, 2004 [quote name='Drift Monkey']I thought that was a part of marriage. Comprimise. :lol:[/quote] It is. But if you don't have to, that's a cool thing. Luckily, my wife and I have pretty similar tempeatures, so dual-zone isn't a big deal for me, though aesthetically, as someone pointed out, it is more congruous with the rest of the console. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.