Turbo RX8

[Knight705]

is that why vtec kicks in so hard?? hahaha

[05GT Guru]

Reliability: I give you this point on 3rd gen RX7's. They last about 60k rebuild to rebuild. First and Second Gen RX7's are very reliable, especially in n/a form. 8's are hit or miss, most people without problems follow the FSM that states you should redline the car under load at least once every time you drive it. This is to clear up carbon on the new side exhaust.

 

No Trq: Personal preference, trq means nothing in racing. I love torque, if my leggy didnt have trq it would be boring. I drove stock rx-7s and they accelerate but you can hardly tell without looking at the speedo.

 

Oil Consumption: WAAAAAAAAAAA. Thats about all I hear, big woop. You are asuming that oil consumption is a bad thing because on piston cars it is a bad thing. Rotaries burn oil by design, meaning if you make regular oil changes, you know like...taking care of your car, its no big deal.

 

Gas Mileage: 7's were quasi respectible, n/a even hit 25 on the highway! The new 8's are shit. I will concede this point. The only 'excuse' is that rotaries have billions and billions and billions of development disadvantage to piston engines.

 

Light Engine Thing: Read above post, though the 7s did have a huge weight advantage. The 8, not so much.

 

I would counter saying.

 

HP: The rotary makes more HP per litre then any other engine. Properly modded 13b's have hit the 1200hp mark and run 6s in the 1/4 mi.

 

Size: Its a little known fact that RX's are not Front Engine cars, The engine is mountet so low and so far back, the entire engine fits behind the front axle. If it existed, the car would be a front-mid engine configuration. This helps in all the RX's in the handling department.

 

Reliable for Racing: Rotaries go an entire race season without being rebuild, piston engines are rebuilt after every race. Rotaries also lose minimal power over a race, opposed to a piston engine losing a considerable amount of power from start to finish. (Mostly talking about endurance racing)

 

Withstand Abuse: Rotaries can withstand gobs and gobs of abuse and not fail. This is largely in part to the fact that there are no valves/cams/or any junk that moves up and down. I dare you to go buy a properly maintained rotary and try to break it while continuing maintanance. Plus you can build the junkiest rebuilds and still have them last 20k+ miles. Rotaries also last longer under heavily modded conditions then piston engines.

 

Smoothness: 9.2k stock redline on the 8, 7+ on various 7's with all of them taking up to 8k.

 

I, unlike most rotary afficiandos, will never tell you a rotary belongs anywhere but sports cars and race cars. They will never haul anything more then you and a passanger, never launch a car with gut wrenching power off the line, and won't make peace on earth. But if you are looking at a sports car or race car, the Rotary is a very high potential motor.

 

I have helped many friends rebuilt there rotarys many times. My friend matts 450rwhp rx-7 need a rebuilt every 30k miles.

 

Trq means nothing in racing your retarded, trq helps alot in straight line racing.

 

No valve train is a good idea in theory less movign parts=more reliable. But the whole engine is based on seals, seals that fail under boost, even the aftermarket seals fail often.

 

I too have seen 2 rotor engines make 1khp and 3 and 4 rotor engiens make 2khp but they doo it sooo unreliably.

 

For light engine you wrote rx-7 have huge weight advantage, the car itself does but the engine is damn near the same weight as a aluminum block 5.7liter. People who have put ls1s in rx-7s only gained 80lbs all together including the 6 speed t-56 tranny weight over the little 5 speed in the rx-7.

 

Gas mileage you wrote the non-turbo got 25freeway who cares. The turbo is the only one that can make power and they only made 250hp and only got 22mpg freeway. Ls1- 400hp 30mpg freeway with the 6 speed.

 

Rotarys do not last longer under high hp than piston engiens whoever told you this is a moron. I have had a coupe lfriends with 400-500whp rotarys and they all need constent work and rebuilds often. I have seen 800-900whp turbo v8 cars that a driven 15kmiles a year and need little manitanence and no rebuilds.

[farberio]

All I can really say is...your friends are doing it wrong.

[05GT Guru]

All I can really say is...your friends are doing it wrong.

 

LOL its just not him, many many many rotary owners have to do the same shit and matt has owned 7 rx-7s the one he had before the 450rwhp rx-7 was a 800whp rx-7 and he sold it because he was tired of working on it just to drive it for 5 days and then have to work on it again. He knows the cars inside and out.

 

But how come you didnt address the bad gas mileage,low trq oh wait you dont care about trq LOL. The engine weight.

 

As for the engine being so far back its not all the way behind the front suspension it sits basically on top of it. The people who do swap v8s in said the cars handle just as good but now have more power and balls. There is a reason sooooooooo many people do the ls1 swap, because they are tired of having a great car with a shitty engine

[rao]

ROTARY WARS!?!?!?!?!?!?!

[05GT Guru]

ROTARY WARS!?!?!?!?!?!?!

 

Lol, if he wants to think rotary is good for anything but a paper weight for huge blueprint then let him build one. I will never drive a rotary unless someone give it to me for free and even then i will just drive it until i have a ls1 to put in it.

[farberio]

LOL its just not him, many many many rotary owners have to do the same shit and matt has owned 7 rx-7s the one he had before the 450rwhp rx-7 was a 800whp rx-7 and he sold it because he was tired of working on it just to drive it for 5 days and then have to work on it again. He knows the cars inside and out.

 

But how come you didnt address the bad gas mileage,low trq oh wait you dont care about trq LOL. The engine weight.

 

As for the engine being so far back its not all the way behind the front suspension it sits basically on top of it. The people who do swap v8s in said the cars handle just as good but now have more power and balls. There is a reason sooooooooo many people do the ls1 swap, because they are tired of having a great car with a shitty engine

 

I have seen many many many high hp 7s that don't have any of the problems you say they do. I have also seen many piston engines with the same problems you describe. Big woop, the fact that he owned 7 cars and you think that the 8 needs to be 'fully built'...whatever that means...tells me he is doing it wrong or you are fibbing.

 

I did address the bad gas mileage, I did address the low trq, and I did address the engine weight. Your example was the LS1 that only added 80lbs and more gas mileage and power. Your example also uses an engine that didn't exist, or at least wasn't in production when USDM 7's were even sold. It also made closer to 350hp, not 400hp when it came out. It also achieved its mpg with an extra gear made for highway mileage.

 

The people that do the ls1 swap think it handles just as great and it probably does have more balls then the stock engine they took out, its also a really freaking sweet engine. Its also never been in comparison to the rotary engine to engine. IMO 13B Rotarys don't go after V8's, they more go after V6's. BTW, I will go on record saying that putting a LS1 in a geo metro will give it more balls.

 

Regarding torque, read up. Torque is about what you feel, its HP and RPM that make the biggest difference.

http://www.vettenet.org/torquehp.html

 

Your right, there is lots of reasons why people do V8 swaps. Many people are ignorant, the rest just want something easy and are so shortsighted that they don't think anything else is good but a V8.

[farberio]

ROTARY WARS!?!?!?!?!?!?!

 

Not for long anyway, soon this thread will start spinning in circles. ()

[Bolksey85]

Big woop, the fact that he owned 7 cars and you think that the 8 needs to be 'fully built'...whatever that means...tells me he is doing it wrong or you are fibbing.

Not meaning to be a dildo here, but how many have you either built or owned? I would hope it's quite a few for the pedestal that you're putting the rotary on.

[05GT Guru]

I have seen many many many high hp 7s that don't have any of the problems you say they do. I have also seen many piston engines with the same problems you describe. Big woop, the fact that he owned 7 cars and you think that the 8 needs to be 'fully built'...whatever that means...tells me he is doing it wrong or you are fibbing.

 

I did address the bad gas mileage, I did address the low trq, and I did address the engine weight. Your example was the LS1 that only added 80lbs and more gas mileage and power. Your example also uses an engine that didn't exist, or at least wasn't in production when USDM 7's were even sold. It also made closer to 350hp, not 400hp when it came out. It also achieved its mpg with an extra gear made for highway mileage.

 

The people that do the ls1 swap think it handles just as great and it probably does have more balls then the stock engine they took out, its also a really freaking sweet engine. Its also never been in comparison to the rotary engine to engine. IMO 13B Rotarys don't go after V8's, they more go after V6's. BTW, I will go on record saying that putting a LS1 in a geo metro will give it more balls.

 

Regarding torque, read up. Torque is about what you feel, its HP and RPM that make the biggest difference.

http://www.vettenet.org/torquehp.html

 

Your right, there is lots of reasons why people do V8 swaps. Many people are ignorant, the rest just want something easy and are so shortsighted that they don't think anything else is good but a V8.

 

Yes the ls1 had 350hp from factory but with bolt ons which it would have to be in a rx-7 since the stock exhaust and intake wont bolt up they make 400 crank, mine dynoed 350whp with headers, catback and a intake.

 

I understand what trq is, and in all my cars i want trq, thats why i got a turbo subie

 

The ls1 and rotary have been compared in many forums and a couple mags, the magazines and forums have both measured the weight gained over each tire. Both pro and average guys say the cars feel damn near the same and the weight is still distributed over the wheels damn near the same.

 

Alot of the people who do the ls1 swap do it after years of working on there rotary and get sick of it. Thats why alot of people do it, so these people arent shortsighted they are just looking for a engine to match the car.

[farberio]

Not meaning to be a dildo here, but how many have you either built or owned? I would hope it's quite a few for the pedestal that you're putting the rotary on.

 

I have owned 3, rebuilt 1. Helped build one more. I have also been around them for the past 5 years or so. At school I associated with 6 other 7's, all at various stages of modding from measly stockish n/a's to 420 rwhp. Predominantly my knowledge is in 2nd gens, and I know more about n/a's then turbos, everyone goes turbo so I am one of those morons pushing the n/a barrier. My build is ok and proof that n/a rotaries run with abuse, turbo block with third rebuilt rotor housings. Stock n/a rotors. The side housings even have some pitting on them.

 

I did not mean to put, and I apologize if it came off that way, rotaries on some high pedestal. I understand rotarys have their short comings, I understand rotaries are not the greatest things since sliced bread. I try to stick up for them when people say they 'suck' simply because they follow everyone else's belief that the apex seals die every time they run and that they are no good because 'omg they don't have trq!'.

 

At the end of the day its about what puts a smile on your face, and there are multiple ways to do it. High strung motocycle, cruiser bike, rally car, turbo car, supercharged car, big block, rotary, v-tech....they all can be fun. Those that are locked into only one way of thinking its possible are moronic in my opinion.

[farberio]

Alot of the people who do the ls1 swap do it after years of working on there rotary and get sick of it. Thats why alot of people do it, so these people arent shortsighted they are just looking for a engine to match the car.

 

Yes, but how many of those people have real motor problems? 7's aren't new cars with warranties. They are generally old, abused, and not maintained.

 

Let me give you an example, the 7 I have now I bought with a blown engine...a BLOWN engine. Yet, when I replaced the fuel pump the motor fired right up. Its simple stuff like that, people freak out over the fact that its a rotary.

 

Sure there are some people that probably have bad experiences with rotaries and it is the motors fault because its old and tired, but I am willing to bet that most people just don't want to relearn everything they know when a v8 swap is so easy.

[hadvw]

One point I wanted to throw out there (I was thinking about an RX8 at one point): I know it probably doesn't happen THAT often, but when I heard about the "fuel flooding" issue or whatever (where you have to have it towed to the dealer when if you flood the engine), I gave up on the car right there and then.

[farberio]

Yeah that can be annoying, generally it happens on more tired motors then non tired motors. To start a rotary its a fine line between enough fuel to start up super fast and too much fuel to flood it. On tired motors there is lower compression and the line starts to shift towards the flooding side. I don't know everything the 8 does to counter that.

 

Deflood Procedure: 1 pop fuel pump fuse. 2. crank. 3. put fuse in and start car

 

Yes, thats all the dealer does too.

[05GT Guru]

I have owned 3, rebuilt 1. Helped build one more. I have also been around them for the past 5 years or so. At school I associated with 6 other 7's, all at various stages of modding from measly stockish n/a's to 420 rwhp. Predominantly my knowledge is in 2nd gens, and I know more about n/a's then turbos, everyone goes turbo so I am one of those morons pushing the n/a barrier. My build is ok and proof that n/a rotaries run with abuse, turbo block with third rebuilt rotor housings. Stock n/a rotors. The side housings even have some pitting on them.

 

I did not mean to put, and I apologize if it came off that way, rotaries on some high pedestal. I understand rotarys have their short comings, I understand rotaries are not the greatest things since sliced bread. I try to stick up for them when people say they 'suck' simply because they follow everyone else's belief that the apex seals die every time they run and that they are no good because 'omg they don't have trq!'.

 

At the end of the day its about what puts a smile on your face, and there are multiple ways to do it. High strung motocycle, cruiser bike, rally car, turbo car, supercharged car, big block, rotary, v-tech....they all can be fun. Those that are locked into only one way of thinking its possible are moronic in my opinion.

 

Just so you know im not locked into 1 engien thinking. Yes i have owned v8 cars, but i also built a supra and i love my legacy and i have owned DSMs aswell. I just dont care for the rotary, it doesnt satify me, which is why i bought my 2000 T/A instead of matts RX-7 when he was selling it.