BLKGT5 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 After replacing my clutch for the second time now, I’m back to stock and might I say it's wonderful! It drives great and hasn’t even been broken in yet. I had them save my ACT setup. I'll post pictures when I get home this weekend, but here is what I've notice. The first day I drove it, it was almost impossible to drive. It chattered horribly and took almost 200 miles before I could take off without riding the clutch and giving it 2k+ rpms. I put around 2000-3000k miles on this setup before dumping it for the stock setup because of TOB noise and low rpm roughness and being nosy in general. ACT or Harmon wouldn’t take responsibility for the TOB noise and I thought the roughness was normal for a higher hp clutch setup, well until I notice both the pressure plate and flywheel had unusual wear marks and just by running my finger across the surface I notice it's warped, which would cause the horrid chatter and bad stop and go feel. I’m almost positive this had to be warped in the first place to cause the bad experience. But would thier be any other reason to cause this? Do you guys think I could get some money back too? Because the whole ordeal has cost me a ton of money from parts to labor! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
integroid Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 According to Han, ACT should of crapped one out over the phone! Let the ACT vs. SPEC war begin. LOL Seriously though, did you use a new Flywheel when you did the switch out? What kind of flywheel did you use? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKGT5 Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 All brand new stuff, it was a light weight Act Flywheel, street disc and HD pressure plate. I had it installed locally at a performance shop that have seen their share of clutches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwiener2 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Warping could only be caused by riding the clutch and overheating it. My Mods List (Updated 8/22/17) 2005 Outback FMT Running on Electrons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKGT5 Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 Say that was the case of riding the clutch caused the warping. What other choice could their have been in breaking in the clutch properly if it wasn't possible to drive the car without feathering the clutch or riding just to not stall? Could a bad disc have cause these problems? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
integroid Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Warping could only be caused by riding the clutch and overheating it. I would have to agree. I am sure ACT machines and checks all of their PP/FW before they send them out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwiener2 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 the unofficial rule is that for the first 1000 miles of a new clutch, you shouldn't slip it for more than 3 seconds. that means you have 3 seconds to get the car from stopped to 1st. 2nd and up are easy. (occasional steep hills excepted) If you can't get it moving in 3 sec or less, get a 5EAT My Mods List (Updated 8/22/17) 2005 Outback FMT Running on Electrons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKGT5 Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 It wasn't my driving, I have no problems with other manual cars or this car now. Even the staff had a hard time getting it out of the shop. If the ACT with the street disc is so comparable to stock, why would it be 1000% harder to drive than a stock setup? I have no problems with my new stock setup, it's like butter and I just picked it up right as they finished the installation of the clutch. I was expecting a stiffer peddle, but not drag racing puck feel with the mild ACT setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qikslvr Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 I think it's just part of a heavier clutch break-in that takes a lot of getting used to. I've owned over 2 dozen different manual cars/trucks/jeeps in the last 20 years and this one has been the most touchy of them all even when stock. You never really could just slowly let the clutch out and roll off the line at idle with no gas in this car even when it was new. Most other cars I've had would at least pull their own weight at idle without jumping all over the place. My SPEC Stage2 was the same way for the first couple hundred miles. I had to rev to 1.7K-2K to get a smooth start, but I would just let it out. There was no way to inch along without clicking and violent shaking so I just made sure I had room in front of me and just let it out smoothly all the way. I messed with the pedal travel at least a dozen times in the first week trying to see if I could make any difference in the release with no improvement. I can see how it could blue the pressure plate if you let the clutch ride too long when trying to get rolling or in stop n go traffic. I specifically avoided hills and rush hour traffic for the first 1K miles with mine for this reason. I think the TOB squeal issue is caused by the total thinkness of the clutch assembly(Both ACT and SPEC) being just a couple .001's off. It only takes a pinky's worth of pressure to make it stop and the $7 clutch fork return spring fix is still working on mine after 4 months and 4K miles. Mine smoothed out to an alomost stock feeling after 3K miles and I can creap off the line at just over 1K RPMs with no noise or vibration. I guess I'm one of the lucky ones (so far:rolleyes:). Let's kick this pig! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKGT5 Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 I guess I'll just have some paper weights laying around my garage. I'll still take some pictures when I get the chance. It was a combination of things that turned me off. I didn't want to granade the tranny, since the TOB sometimes felt odd, like it was spinning on sand. Even when I revved the engine, I could hear some rattle from the clutch, which is completely gone now with my new stock setup. Anything under 1.5k I would get shudder and the engine felt like it wanted to die with the ACT setup. No so anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qikslvr Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 I'd be interested in seeing the pics of a clutch pack that cooked at 3K miles. It would be interesting to see the color and the stress marks on it. Let's kick this pig! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwiener2 Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 I've had 3 different clutchs in my car and the ACT setup is the easiest to drive. I can creep at idle with no issues. Pedal feel is better than stock My Mods List (Updated 8/22/17) 2005 Outback FMT Running on Electrons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saul_Good Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 I think this must be an isolated incident, because I also have this setup and the pedal pressure doesn't feel stiff at all, more like stock. I have no problem driving this car, as you say you do. In fact it's super easy, and i've never had any problems w/it since the beginning. I don't even ride the clutch and can also creep like Mweiner w/o any issues. I had my clutch installed at a suby dealership that is very familiar w/aftermarket suby clutches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKGT5 Posted February 3, 2008 Author Share Posted February 3, 2008 http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/1.JPG http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/3.JPG http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/4.JPG http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/7.JPG http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/1.JPG http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/3.JPG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwiener2 Posted February 3, 2008 Share Posted February 3, 2008 That's a FW that's been cooked.... badly My RPS didn't even look that bad Edit: Actually, it looks just like my RPS which faile dbecasue it got cooked. http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a257/mwiener2/IMG_1435.jpg My Mods List (Updated 8/22/17) 2005 Outback FMT Running on Electrons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boostjunkie Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 I've got SnoDork's car in my driveway right now because, as I'm scheduled to install a bunch of stuff on it this week. He has an ACT full facing clutch in his car that I had previously installed for him. It drives just as easily as a stock clutch. Smooth, progressive and quiet. Given the pictures that you posted I would be questioning the install or your driving rather than the clutch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKGT5 Posted February 4, 2008 Author Share Posted February 4, 2008 The day I got the clutch, it gave me problems. Just gently trying to take off from a start it stalled and sounded like and explosion. That's why it required lots of feathering and throttle just to get moving. Nothing like my new clutch now, which feels like a new car. Nothing required, just drive and go. Yea being pissed off with this setup I did some higher rev takeoff's before getting it removed. That might account for some of the scaring. Anyone notice the TOB looks odd? Some of the fins look out of place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tytek Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/1.JPG http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/3.JPG http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/4.JPG http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/7.JPG http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/1.JPG http://members.cox.net/zenmaster/3.JPG Looks like pictures of my ACT kit... had the same problems as you noted. The car was barely drivable it chattered so badly. I have sent detailed pix to ACT and they offered to inspect the kit. I ended up swapping their light flywheel for a 06 WRX one. It fixed most of the issues. But I am still not 100% satisfied with their product. I have had aftermarket clutches in my previous cars and have put over 300k miles on manual tranny cars, so I am very convinced that the problem was not me, but the kit itself. Feel free to disagree, but I had 4 different people (dealer techs included) drive the car and they all agreed with my diagnosis. I still have the ACT flywheel in my basement, with all the burn marks. Mike at ACT has stopped answering my emails, and it seems that there will be no replacement or refund. Glad to hear that mine was not the only isolated incident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanboy Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Hmm, so it looks like in both cases severe chattering right after install? -B http://www.standardshift.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Ok, Spec is out, now Act is out (hate companies who do not stand behind their product). Any other clutch options when I need one? Perhaps Bullyclutch LBGT touted here? Or I guess I really should swap 6MT in the future and just stick to the STI stocker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleBlueGT Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Ok, Spec is out, now Act is out (hate companies who do not stand behind their product). Any other clutch options when I need one? Perhaps Bullyclutch LBGT touted here? Or I guess I really should swap 6MT in the future and just stick to the STI stocker. Mine works 100%. 28k on mine! It does seem like something was maybe defective with these 2 AT units as most seem to work well. What is wrong with the Specs? Full tune of 68HTA, KSTech 73 MAF, Racer X FMIC and ID1000s................by the DataLog Mafia!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tytek Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Hmm, so it looks like in both cases severe chattering right after install? That is correct. I chattered like mad from the get-go. I hoped that it would bed itself in after a few hundred miles, but it only got worse. It would chatter in 1st, when shifting into 2nd, and was generally not smooth in any gear. It feels a lot better with the heavier WRX OEM FW, which is still quite a bit lighter than the dual mass stock piece. It also performs well when under load at low RPMs. If I had to do it over again, I would have gone with a different manufacturer. Not sure which one, but certainly not ACT... at the very least, not their streetlight FW. A 6 speed STI or SpecB swap would be ideal, but I can't justify the expense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tytek Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Mine works 100%. 28k on mine! It does seem like something was maybe defective with these 2 AT units as most seem to work well. What is wrong with the Specs? Exactly, but if they were defective, the manufacturer should have been willing to make the situation right... so far they have not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Mine works 100%.:)28k on mine! It does seem like something was maybe defective with these 2 AT units as most seem to work well. What is wrong with the Specs? Also a horror story about out-of-spec Spec product (pun intended) and disastrous customer service. The thread is somewhere around here. Again, seems like most Spec clutches work fine, but the customer service matters when products do not work fine... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanboy Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 ACT kit is going in later this week. Guess I will have to pay attention to how much chatter is present right after install. Least it is something that seems to make itself known right away. Nothing to do with making sure all surfaces were degreased and dried before install would it? -B http://www.standardshift.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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