boxkita Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 The garage is moving forward, as I found someone with scaffolding. That should be going in today, so can finish insulation this weekend (crossing fingers). Gave up on sheetrock and will be using OSB. See picture for problem. Started cleaning the cabinets, what a mess. 16 years of mechanical work leaves a fine dusting of metal everywhere. Already had my first experience with a make-shift eye-bath. That really sucked. I'll be getting better eye protection today. And looking into an eye bath station that involves more than a water bottle & paper towel. Still looking for the gas line that fed the ceiling mounted gas heater. The heater is gone leaving only the scorch marks. There is no gas line anywhere near it. Previous tenant said something about converting gas line to a water line. According to the city, none of that work was on the permit. Go figure. Looking at a winch for the trailer. The wagon is currently at the bottom of my driveway and pushing it uphill into the inclined trailer is a bit too much Sisyphus for me. Having a winch would ease getting it into / out of the trailer, or I could be missing the obvious. Suggestions? Wagon is still in the same condition as when it was hauled off the track in May. Want to get the garage sorted before bringing the car over, or I'll never get it done. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 I have several suggestions before you get to far into the remodel. 1) If you have space...wall off a room specifically for your welding/cutting/grinding/drilling metals. Keeping all the little metal bits and grinding abrasive confined to a smaller space will make your shop a much nicer place and easier to clean up. The room should have 120v/240v; compressed air, and a exhaust vent to the outside. The door should be wide to get larger projects in and out, and also there will be the occasional need to wheel the welder out to the car. 2) Run as many electrical circuits as possible before you put up the sheetrock or OSB. It's much cheaper to run wire now than conduit later. Think about where you want 120v and 240v. Probably having a sub panel in the metal working room would be a good idea. 3) Think about overhead pull down electric cords and air lines. They keep the shop floor less cluttered and safer. I have the Home Depot retractable spools mounted to the ceiling on both sides of my lift. Strongly recommended. Doing it again from scratch I probably would have 4 of them, one at each corner. 4) Determine which machines you have now or planning in the future need standard residential 240 and which need 3 phase 240. Ask your electrician about 3 phase 240 now. 5) Consider where you want the air compressor and plan on it being 240v. 6) Your lift hydraulic system pumps the lift up much faster on 240V. You don't want a lift that runs on 120v unless 240v is not available. Now's the time to consider where you'll run the 240v down from the ceiling the control pole on the lift. That will also be where an air line needs to come down to drive the lift's locking system. 7) While running wiring put a couple of 120V weather receptacles on the outside of your shop on the driveway side. And a water hose bib there too. 8) Consider installing overhead LED lighting, the more the better. 9) And whether you'll be using a 4 post lift with sliding jack lift or a two post lift. I suggest getting both! Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gex Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 Put that lift in ASAP so I can come over and borrow it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 Thanks. Most of the wiring is already there. There's a 240v panel on the back wall, where I was going to put in a 13x30 room. That room will have its own garage door, so plenty of access. For the time being that will be the trailer storage area. The floor has bolts from the previous 4 post & 2 post lifts. The previous tenant removed the 2 post then asked if I wanted to buy it and re-install. I forget the brand, but its been well used and he's asking 2k. Currently have CFC floods and one mercury vapor. I find its not very bright at the counter top level. Thinking of putting in troffers like in my car garage. I can swap in LED bulbs and hang the troffers from the ceiling to the height I need/want. Also looking at putting in undercabinet lighting. I need to find an upright compressor that runs 240v. Preferably a well-cared for used one to save money? I'll add an outside lean-to with insulation for it and run solid pipe back in. Thinking of runs down each side of the garage with oiled/clean connections. From the race car shop, the machine room needs multiple connections. The rest need a connector every 6 feet or so. Want to put one near the big roll-up door, too. I saw an installation using black-pipe that looked good. Have to price it out. Still not convinced about the 4 post system. If only because I've only worked around the 2 post system. The only advantage I really see is for doing the suspension. The rest of the time, it seems bulky? Been looking at power cord management, as I'm already tripping over 2 of them. There are plugs every 6 feet in every direction, so at most, a 20 foot cord would cover everything (30 feet wide, so 20 feet would least frustrating to manage. Still the 50 footer really is nice, just need a better coiling method. Harbor Freight is doing their clearance sales for the next 2 weeks, so hoping for deals there. Pic is of the work area. Figuring the car will be 90 degrees to the big rollup door. For the time being, I'm not putting in the lift. I want to see how the space works out. The PO had the 2 post dead center, about where the heater & the insulation is. I was thinking of putting it at an angle in the general area of the heater (little silver column of useless electricity consumption). Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 Put that lift in ASAP so I can come over and borrow it! Funny you should say that. One of the original funding ideas was to rent time in the garage. A stop at the city clerk's office killed that. However, a contribution to the race fund would not be unappreciated. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 A four post lift not only does not need to be bolted down, or special footings, you can actually roll them around with a car on them! http://www.bendpak.com/car-lifts/accessories/caster-kit.aspx However you need quick disconnects for the power/air to do that. I bought the caster kit but have never used it. In your case it might make more sense. It's pretty cool the way it works. You raise the lift, bolt them on, lower the lift which thru leverage raises the lift on to the casters. Two post is best for working on the car in general, but you can't store a car indefinitely on it, it's bad for the suspension to let it droop for long periods. A four post is fine for working on the car IF you get the sliding air jack. 4,500-lb. air / hydraulic rolling jacks available (Model RJ-45).http://www.bendpak.com/car-lifts/accessories/rj-45.aspx . Otherwise it's best as a way to store two cars in one footprint. A 4 post needs no special concrete footings, a two post does. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gex Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 Funny you should say that. One of the original funding ideas was to rent time in the garage. A stop at the city clerk's office killed that. However, a contribution to the race fund would not be unappreciated. I would be happy to pay a reasonable hourly donation. We can discuss it soon. I would love a lift to put in the built motor on the blue wagon. If I had access to a lift I might buy a 6 speed and put in at the same time for convenience. Then I would have a backup 5 speed for the white wagon. Tempting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
battelready Posted December 18, 2016 Share Posted December 18, 2016 Thanks. Most of the wiring is already there. There's a 240v panel on the back wall, where I was going to put in a 13x30 room. That room will have its own garage door, so plenty of access. For the time being that will be the trailer storage area. The floor has bolts from the previous 4 post & 2 post lifts. The previous tenant removed the 2 post then asked if I wanted to buy it and re-install. I forget the brand, but its been well used and he's asking 2k. Currently have CFC floods and one mercury vapor. I find its not very bright at the counter top level. Thinking of putting in troffers like in my car garage. I can swap in LED bulbs and hang the troffers from the ceiling to the height I need/want. Also looking at putting in undercabinet lighting. I need to find an upright compressor that runs 240v. Preferably a well-cared for used one to save money? I'll add an outside lean-to with insulation for it and run solid pipe back in. Thinking of runs down each side of the garage with oiled/clean connections. From the race car shop, the machine room needs multiple connections. The rest need a connector every 6 feet or so. Want to put one near the big roll-up door, too. I saw an installation using black-pipe that looked good. Have to price it out. Still not convinced about the 4 post system. If only because I've only worked around the 2 post system. The only advantage I really see is for doing the suspension. The rest of the time, it seems bulky? Been looking at power cord management, as I'm already tripping over 2 of them. There are plugs every 6 feet in every direction, so at most, a 20 foot cord would cover everything (30 feet wide, so 20 feet would least frustrating to manage. Still the 50 footer really is nice, just need a better coiling method. Harbor Freight is doing their clearance sales for the next 2 weeks, so hoping for deals there. Pic is of the work area. Figuring the car will be 90 degrees to the big rollup door. For the time being, I'm not putting in the lift. I want to see how the space works out. The PO had the 2 post dead center, about where the heater & the insulation is. I was thinking of putting it at an angle in the general area of the heater (little silver column of useless electricity consumption). Ill take a pic of my 3 bay garage when i have a chance put go with the traditional 2 post. As for the air and wire management get retractable hose and wire reals. We have atleast 10 of them mounted up on the roof and they are so useful when you many lines out. Congrats on the place though. I bought an auto be more involved in my uninvolvedness . 200k+ Club If you can't blind them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit. My high mileage turd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 I'm sure you've already seen this. This is the approach that I use. https://www.tptools.com/tech-metal-piping.dlp Copy that PDF as well. - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 For inspiration on how to setup an awesome garage for working on cars in minimal space see this blog. Warning, it's been going for 10 years and is now 244 pages! The 12-Gauge Garage And click on the Forum posts to see subsections on almost anything garage related. I've taken many ideas from what other folks have done. The Garage Journal Board forums Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 I'm sure you've already seen this. This is the approach that I use. https://www.tptools.com/tech-metal-piping.dlp Copy that PDF as well. I've seen this implemented. My dad built his "dream" wood shop a few years ago. One of the dreams was constant compressed air. He used black pipe, and put a oil/oil-less station every 6 feet or so around the whole space. The compressor is a large service station sized system mounted in an outbuilding. It's a really nice setup. Reading the pressure drop-off pdf (same site), using ceiling mount air doesn't seem to be worth it at 20 foot drop + 25 feet of hose. The race shop I visited used the iron pipe method with air stations near the mostly likely use areas. Then kept a 25 foot hose nearby. Except in the metal working area, it worked pretty well. The slight slope to a drain point is interesting. As well as the sizing vs run time. I may have to upsize a bit for "future needs". The local home depot sells iron pipe in 10 or 20 ft lengths. It may be cheaper to buy long lengths and a pipe threader (rental?) to customize on site. The multiple connections plan seems fraught with potential leakage possibilities. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 For inspiration on how to setup an awesome garage for working on cars in minimal space see this blog. Warning, it's been going for 10 years and is now 244 pages! The 12-Gauge Garage And click on the Forum posts to see subsections on almost anything garage related. I've taken many ideas from what other folks have done. The Garage Journal Board forums Ah, yes. I've seen this in the past. I try to avoid that site, as it could consume more money than the hobby it houses. However, I like that in floor scissor lift; just not the lack of walking around space. Picked up four 1000lb shelving units last night. At least one of them looks like a good starting point for a tire rack, too. The rest should allow for storage of temporary items. The shop already has two sets of cabinets for lots of storage space. I'm adding 2x10's at 13 foot height mostly to reserve space for the loft in the future, but also as a strong attach point for other storage. The air compressor will go outside in its own little space, insulated and isolated. My current compressor is on its last legs, so an upgrade was already on the list of "to buy". Will be looking on CL for the after-Christmas "come get as I got a new one" sales. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 A four post lift not only does not need to be bolted down, or special footings, you can actually roll them around with a car on them! http://www.bendpak.com/car-lifts/accessories/caster-kit.aspx However you need quick disconnects for the power/air to do that. I bought the caster kit but have never used it. In your case it might make more sense. It's pretty cool the way it works. You raise the lift, bolt them on, lower the lift which thru leverage raises the lift on to the casters. Two post is best for working on the car in general, but you can't store a car indefinitely on it, it's bad for the suspension to let it droop for long periods. A four post is fine for working on the car IF you get the sliding air jack. 4,500-lb. air / hydraulic rolling jacks available (Model RJ-45).http://www.bendpak.com/car-lifts/accessories/rj-45.aspx . Otherwise it's best as a way to store two cars in one footprint. A 4 post needs no special concrete footings, a two post does. Had a long chat with Sgt.Gator on this today, after reading thru the bendpak site. Looks like I'll be dropping a line to their distributor to see what options are. Also to Rotary (race car shop uses these). The 4 post is an ideal solution in Sgt.Gator's garage. However, with considerably more room in mine, the 2 post is better. I need to confirm the actual concrete depth and footings required. There was a 2 post in the garage when we first saw the place, but wasnt included in the sale. It's all fun and games until you put the Suburban on the lift and it falls over. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 Picked up a 2015 STI steering rack last night with WL bits already swapped in (pic coming). New scaffolding system coming today so can finish top level of insulation. Already can hear the difference (garage is next to freeway). Looking for a new compressor. Chicago Pneumatic makes a continuous operating 8cfm system with 120gal reserve tank. I'm sure I'm over thinking the problem. Where's the ad for Harbor Freight... Still need to get the race car back in the trailer. Weight stamp on the side of the car says 3115 with driver. So the 3000 lb winch will work? Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 You want a 5-7HP, 230Volt, 2-stage 60 Gal (min) compressor that can deliver ~15CFM at min 90PSI and have a DC of 100%. 8CFM is not going to cut it for what you are envisioning. Checkout the Quincy 2-Stage models. Decent pricepoint, warranty, and USA made - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 +1 on Quincy, that's what I have though my specs are less than SBT recommends. And yes a 3000 winch will pull it in the trailer no problem. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAMMER DOWN Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 I went with a 4-post, because it was free standing & turn my 3 car garage into a 4. http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l293/HAMMERDOWNGT/1224091627.jpg http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l293/HAMMERDOWNGT/1224091627a.jpg Mileage:331487 Retired/Sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 The 4 post has benefits however the only one that really applies is the attachment to the garage floor. The 2 post looks the best for what I want to do. Having storage isn't a big deal at the moment. Looked at the Quincy compressors. Nice but spendy. I have a $5k budget for garage. Getting a nice lift is higher priority than an auto shop quality compressor. Looking on CL and offerup for something used at the moment. Still shopping for a welding setup. Would like to be able to weld aluminum as well as ferrous metals. Based on a couple conversations with experienced ppl, a class is in my future. Got half the cabinets cleaned up and got a quote for new work surfaces. Still need to sort out the lighting, as its too dim for detailed work. Had to take a day off today. Got hurt dealing with scaffolding yesterday and sore today. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegacyKid5 Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 (edited) http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161222/71735bff74567267463a271d74f1c3e8.jpg http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161222/7d96096d1eeb64450f5f1caf4de94e96.jpg http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161222/d1bc11176298771018e99b612e23df06.jpg My grandpa has this 60 Gallon husky pro air compressor that he's been talking to me about selling. If you're interested I can get you a price and more details. The compressor is pretty much new condition. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Edited December 22, 2016 by LegacyKid5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 ^ you have a pm Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 Boxkita took out the back fence. I took the opportunity to remove all tge trees and blackberry bushes my neighbor planted next to tye fence. Ive been after them to move their compost pile off the fence. I also vented 15 years of frustration with BlackBerry vines by chucking the rootballs in their yard. 5he more tired I got the more wild the pitching was. Basterds. Hazardfactory.org in Southpark has welding classes. I so want to wear my Simpsons shirt to the class. I have so much more appreciation for ppl who work outside an office environment. 2.5 weeks in and I hurt everywhere. Fitbit says i walked 10 miles today in a space 75 feet long. And 111 stairs. still don't sleep more than 5 hours a night. Tomorrow I'm building 30 feet of fence. Or digging a hole for a 30 feet fence. Really need to get back to the garage. Want to get the sheathing and first coat of primer on by Christmas. So tempted to get a flatbed to tow the racecar to the garage to speed things up. Anyway back to work, er, drinking coffee while thinking about getting back to work. 4 cups of french press and a warm room is helping my aches. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidInSeattle Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 I took a MIG class at Hazard Factory when it was called All Metals Arts. Just when I was getting the hang of things, class was over. I need to get back into welding... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 That Husky should work for now. The main thing is to avoid aluminum pumps and get cast iron like LegacyKid's Husky. And one that runs on 240 too. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 That Husky should work for now. The main thing is to avoid aluminum pumps and get cast iron like LegacyKid's Husky. And one that runs on 240 too. Reading the user comments on Homedepot site, it looks it will be the same experience as at the racecar shop. About halfway thru cutting off a body part, the cut off tool will have exhausted the tank. However for the near term its looking good. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxkita Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 I took a MIG class at Hazard Factory when it was called All Metals Arts. Just when I was getting the hang of things, class was over. I need to get back into welding... They offer custom small classes. IDK how many ppl are in the area who want to learn welding, but it would be interesting to see what kind of deal they can offer. $50/hr (including materials) for private lessons is ok, as long as I could go home and practice, too. Build my car Boxkita Track days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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