oODanKNesSOo Posted March 14, 2016 Author Share Posted March 14, 2016 No my English isn't quaint... it was in response to MaxCaps post.. "By _____ are you saying _____" type of thing there. The Cobb cai is working just fine actually... and it came with the whip, at no up charge- mostly because I was a smooth talker and the place I got her had a LOT of subi, ahem Subaru, parts lying around I was asking Max, if using new oem gaskets all around was a good plan- vs something better I don't know about. And, if he meant reusing the oldies (non leaking) or getting new ones. New is the clear answer- so I'll slap myself for that one, my bad. I wasn't sure why he said to replace the hose so I asked what to replace it with... your options look good, I'll have to check into it. I was a medium duty/Diesel truck mechanic for 4 years in flat rate... so I am pretty versed in turbos, and how they operate. VERY new to boosted Subaru's tho, hence all the questions. 149.6 miles in, to be exact. I appreciate the reply, I'll work on a more polished grammar tho!!!,haha internet kills tone- I'm shooting the breeze man, type as I'd talk. Not trying to write a literary master piece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Donated Too sigmafour Posted March 14, 2016 I Donated Too Share Posted March 14, 2016 No problem I was just trying to make sure I understood what you're asking. Very much want to help. Just note the setup on these cars makes failure devastating to the engine so it's worth making sure the Turbo oil feed lines/banjo bolt filters etc are really tip top. New gaskets are always better but I have reused using the copper gasket spray that I was turned onto and it works really well indeed! The gaskets are MLS so if they are still in good condition they do seal okay. If you can afford new then of course it saves taking it all apart again and again and again. Here is the link to the FP oil lines. I use these on my car. Takes the oil from the front AVCS feed where it's stronger and comes with a cap to close off the feed at the back. http://www.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=FP&Product_Code=FPMLSSSubaru&Category_Code=WRX-TurboHW Lines are neater and cleaner IMHO plus they make a very good filter that's neat and has a lot of surface area to prevent possible clogging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oODanKNesSOo Posted March 15, 2016 Author Share Posted March 15, 2016 Where that line meets the turbo- is THAT where I find the banjo with filter? I think upgrading the flow as you mention, removing the filter, and "bulletproofing" the IC are all good things to do BEFORE I throw in the up, down, and go to stage 2 map(s). Then I think my focus will be suspension and braking to accommodate the power gains. I imagine the gaskets can't be THAT expensive, so I think I'll go new, then down the line determine if I want to reuse (copper spray) them. Is the legacy option 1 or 2 in your link? I can take the cover off and find out later- but if you remember off the top of your head saves me the trouble and I can go ahead and proceed to check out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LatentWagen Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 NOW- I have a Cobb down pipe to install along with a fancy TaipanXP aussie up pipe, and want to add a BOV (likely 50/50 to keep it from the lean shifts ive read about) what else do i need to take her to the next stage on the Cobb AP? Forget the 50/50. And it's a rich condition after the shift... pre-counted air is lost through the BOV, and the mixture goes rich because they're less oxygen than expected. LW's spec. B / YT / IG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Donated Too sigmafour Posted March 15, 2016 I Donated Too Share Posted March 15, 2016 As far as the engine is concerned. More or less without getting into specifics, the 2005 to 2009 Legacy engine is the same as the 2008 to 2014 WRX engine. We all use the same TMIC, oil lines, the same 'style' of Turbo and all the little bits and pieces are the same, again more or less. I am not going into details. Picture 2 should be the same as the Legacy - at least that is exactly what mine is on my 2005. AND the banjo bolt in the DEAD center of that picture and circle is where you will find the filter. There's another one on the drivers side head... MAX has a good write up and pictures somewhere... http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/got-some-new-stuff-engine-r-r-184106p9.html that's his build thread and he has some great pictures which should help you understand how the engine goes together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Donated Too sigmafour Posted March 15, 2016 I Donated Too Share Posted March 15, 2016 Rao's banjo bolt removal procedure from back in the day... http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2-5gt-turbo-oil-supply-banjo-bolt-filter-removal-62371.html?t=62371 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oODanKNesSOo Posted March 15, 2016 Author Share Posted March 15, 2016 Forget the 50/50. And it's a rich condition after the shift... pre-counted air is lost through the BOV, and the mixture goes rich because they're less oxygen than expected. Awww I see... that doesn't sound like anything I want any part of! Lean is mean!!! Lol Guess I'll drop the BoV plans until it's actually needed and we'll doable with out adverse side effects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oODanKNesSOo Posted March 15, 2016 Author Share Posted March 15, 2016 As far as the engine is concerned. More or less without getting into specifics, the 2005 to 2009 Legacy engine is the same as the 2008 to 2014 WRX engine. We all use the same TMIC, oil lines, the same 'style' of Turbo and all the little bits and pieces are the same, again more or less. I am not going into details. Picture 2 should be the same as the Legacy - at least that is exactly what mine is on my 2005. AND the banjo bolt in the DEAD center of that picture and circle is where you will find the filter. There's another one on the drivers side head... MAX has a good write up and pictures somewhere... http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/got-some-new-stuff-engine-r-r-184106p9.html that's his build thread and he has some great pictures which should help you understand how the engine goes together. Great info boss!! I actually have an extensive background with Jeeps, and REALLY liked the ability to shop different makes and models for certain parts as most things were interchangeable.... That makes me curious what I might be able to upgrade off a WRX, or STi. The Tmic isn't something that was better on either?? Seems the one with red STi written on it would be an upgrade to the plastic crapola the LGT got? Guess stage 2 will be a while longer... gaskets, oil line, and possibly tmic need to be considered before attacking the up and dp install Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
battelready Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 The sti has a different manifold so you cannot run a sti intercooler. You can run a intercooler made for a 08+ wrx. Alot of the parts are cross compatible between the STI, WRX , and legacy . I bought an auto be more involved in my uninvolvedness . 200k+ Club If you can't blind them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit. My high mileage turd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oODanKNesSOo Posted March 15, 2016 Author Share Posted March 15, 2016 .... however the WRX tmic, is essentially the same as what I'm running- and thus not an upgrade at all correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 .... however the WRX tmic, is essentially the same as what I'm running- and thus not an upgrade at all correct? Correct. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Donated Too sigmafour Posted March 15, 2016 I Donated Too Share Posted March 15, 2016 or you could start swapping the STI intake too and then the STI TMIC will fit but... and this is where you should start to realise, there's pleanty of good parts for the WRX/LGT without chasing one thing after another and swapping major parts just to end up back to a stock setup for something else. Other people have done this, there are a few or more Legacy's with STI manifold swaps, even some that used the NA manifolds too - these are called LEGO cars for a reason. Doesn't mean you have to follow in these same footsteps! There are some really good TMIC's both Process West and Grimmspeed make great intercoolers and you still have the AVO/Perrin styles too. The stock one isn't THAT BAD but depends on where on the graph you are for turbo output. The stock quickly becomes a toaster as well as the possible failure of the plastic endcaps either by leaking or shattering. Bulletproofing helps the leaking but not the sudden shattering should that happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oODanKNesSOo Posted March 15, 2016 Author Share Posted March 15, 2016 Basically go GS, or go home.... I get it. SO, plans for stage 2 include *GS Tmic *new oil line for turbo *remove banjo bolt filter(s) while in there [likely hold off on the hard one until I'm doing timing belt and water pump] *all new gaskets for exhaust system *install up, dp *install stage 2 Cobb MAP, possibly take in for customs tune +I've read a few things about the "Turbo inlet"- it's near the top of the turbo forum... similar build specs as what I'm looking for, and it was recommended to replace- but with OEM. Is this "inlet" the oil line already mentioned? Or what am I missing here?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldsoda Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 I dont believe the Cobb OTS tune will account for an aftermarket tmic. The turbo inlet is the air channel after the airbox that goes under the intake manifold to the turbo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 The new oil line you list, it that a oil return line ? The oil feed line should be fine. My oil feed line has never been apart, that middle fitting has been together forever. The line has some play in it, if you need to remove it. The Cobb stage 2 will work ok with a big tmic, but a custom tune will yield better overall performance. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oODanKNesSOo Posted March 15, 2016 Author Share Posted March 15, 2016 The new oil line you list, it that a oil return line ? The oil feed line should be fine. My oil feed line has never been apart, that middle fitting has been together forever. The line has some play in it, if you need to remove it. Based on the link above, or a on page 2... I'd say oil feed. Changes the source from what I gather Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oODanKNesSOo Posted March 15, 2016 Author Share Posted March 15, 2016 I dont believe the Cobb OTS tune will account for an aftermarket tmic. The turbo inlet is the air channel after the airbox that goes under the intake manifold to the turbo. Meaning I'd need a custom tune? Would it be wise to replace the inlet? Or did I misread something somewhere? They were going OEM, so I don't think it's like an "upgrade" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 I'm saying that's not needed unless you going to a different style turbo. My vf52 is using the stock oil feed for the vf40. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldsoda Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 Meaning I'd need a custom tune? Would it be wise to replace the inlet? Or did I misread something somewhere? They were going OEM, so I don't think it's like an "upgrade" Max stated that a bigger TMIC will work with the cobb OTS tune, but won't get you the additional benefits of more power without a custom tune. A lot of guys on here like the stock inlet and only replace with theirs when it splits or cracks due to oil/heat exposure. An aftermarket silicone inlet would work also, like the AVO unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Donated Too sigmafour Posted March 15, 2016 I Donated Too Share Posted March 15, 2016 Max what oil return line are you referring to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LatentWagen Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 Max stated that a bigger TMIC will work with the cobb OTS tune, but won't get you the additional benefits of more power without a custom tune. A lot of guys on here like the stock inlet and only replace with theirs when it splits or cracks due to oil/heat exposure. An aftermarket silicone inlet would work also, like the AVO unit. Cooling the intake temp is a good thing, and always results in more power (denser air). But a larger TMIC also comes with greater pressure drop, so the end result is a cooler charge, at lower pressure (if unaccounted for). These two effects work against each other, power-wise. Your motor will be happier, however. FWIW, I felt a few ponies when I added the PW TMIC to my otherwise standard Cobb stage 2 OTS setup. No change in tune. Saw a PSI drop initially (seemed faster even at lower boost), however that changed as the ECU tried to meet the boost target. May have picked up a decently measurable amount overall, without modifying the tune, but YMMV. Butt-dynos are pretty inconsistent LW's spec. B / YT / IG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 You'll be ok on the cobb tune with a big tmic for a while. Your always safer with a custom tune. When you have the turbo off of these cars now, because of the age, I highly recommend you replace the rubber oil return hose from the turbo. Unless you've already replaced it a few years back. FWIW, my wagon is still running the stock oil feed lines to the turbo, the vf52. Less banjo filter of course. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oODanKNesSOo Posted March 19, 2016 Author Share Posted March 19, 2016 Sooooooo- the red line is the rubber hose I aught to replace? (Car is new to me but the end is split) The blue one leads to the banjo filter right? Is it a bad idea to run it on Cobb stage 2 with stock IC? It'll be a few weeks before I have enough change for a quality Tmic... but I'm scared to have the old UP with cat on it, as well as the banjo filter(s) even on stage 1! I'd like to get all the exhaust gaskets for UP and DP and install both on Monday then Cobb stage2 her. The engine is loud ish under the hood- and I have a smell in the cabin- which I'm thinking might be an exhaust leak I can cure by installing both with all new gaskets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LatentWagen Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 Is it a bad idea to run it on Cobb stage 2 with stock IC? It'll be a few weeks before I have enough change for a quality Tmic... but I'm scared to have the old UP with cat on it, as well as the banjo filter(s) even on stage 1! The intercooler doesn't matter that much. Whether stock or upgraded TMIC, as long as it's holding boost, you should be good on the Cobb OTS (or stock) map. Running stage 1 or 2 boost levels with a stock catted uppipe is a very bad idea, however. The added boost will melt that catalyst, and send bits of metal honeycomb through your turbo. In a worst-case scenario, this could spell the end of your motor. Flash back to a stock map, if you're putting the stock catted uppipe back in the mix. LW's spec. B / YT / IG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oODanKNesSOo Posted March 19, 2016 Author Share Posted March 19, 2016 Actually running the stock up pipe still- but have a catless to install... as well as down pipe. Sounds like I should do the install sooner then later tho.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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