Super Suby gets an ej22t?

[Sludgeroo]

Either some sort of piggyback for the wrx or use a standalone to merge.

[98Wagon]

Standalone would delete my ecu's engine management all together though right? And from what I hear are the more expensive option?

 

What would be the advantages to running a piggyback with the 205 heads and em- as opposed to 25d heads and em with my stock ecu and a piggyback?

[monkeyposeur]

Standalone would replace your ecu.

 

There would be no need for a piggy back with the 205 heads and the wrx ecu/harness. If you want to run the 25D heads with the 22T block you will need a standalone. You can't run the 25D heads with the wrx ecu.

[98Wagon]

Standalone would replace your ecu.

 

 

There would be no need for a piggy back with the 205 heads and the wrx ecu/harness. If you want to run the 25D heads with the 22T block you will need a standalone. You can't run the 25D heads with the wrx ecu.

 

Yes-I thought that was the case- that the standalone would replace my ecu.

 

I am trying to figure out just what components DOHCEJ22E1 thought would make a good combo. ie: 205 heads and intake and ej22ecu/piggyback or ???

[monkeyposeur]

Your hybrid will consist of the following:

WRX car wiring harness merged with the Legacy car wiring harness.

EJ205 intake manifold.

EJ205 heads & crank gear on EJ22T block.

STi 10-11mm oil pump.

EJ205 water pump.

 

Am I missing something?

I'm a lover of hybrids & I've made 2 of my own.

 

This is what he suggested. He runs 25D heads on a NA 22e with the stock ecu. If you want to run 205 heads with a 22T then a wrx ecu/harness merge will work. Think about what your power goals are. The only reason to run a 22T vs a 257 is because the 22T is cool. Other than that a 257 will give you more power unless you do some serious mods to the 22T.

 

Here is a good read regarding hybrid builds posted by Fujik on NASIOC: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2141800

[DOHCEJ22E1]

This is what he suggested. He runs 25D heads on a NA 22e with the stock ecu. If you want to run 205 heads with a 22T then a wrx ecu/harness merge will work. Think about what your power goals are. The only reason to run a 22T vs a 257 is because the 22T is cool. Other than that a 257 will give you more power unless you do some serious mods to the 22T.

 

Here is a good read regarding hybrid builds posted by Fujik on NASIOC: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2141800

 

Monkey, that is the same page where I got a lot of my info for the first DOHC EJ22 from (my current one is actually my 2nd). My favorite pic is where it says, "Here is a stock 2.5L EJ255/EJ257 B25 combustion chamber to a 97mm bore." So Kenny (kennyvfholla), you were right the whole time on being able to use 96 25D heads on an EJ22. It CAN be done safely.

 

There are more reasons to run a 22T over a 257:

1. Fully closed deck means that more power can be contained safely. (To be fair, the 257 blocks have proven to be very tough themselves).

 

2. Oil squirters, though they come loose at times & add "liquid weight" to the pistons, bring cooling & lubrication at once.

 

3. 52mm rod journal means that Phase 2 rods can be used & the short stroke means quicker revs & higher potential rpm overall.

 

4. It has a smaller bore & thus matches the 2L (and some 2.5L) heads better than the 2.5L bore (for hybrid setups).

 

In fact, the only reason I could find to choose the 257 over the 22T is the 30% bore increase, which allows for more power out the box. Other than that, I think the 22T kinda wins that comparison.

 

To the OP, you can indeed run the 25D/22E combo w/standalone (I will eventually do this) but I think it's less troublesome to run the 205/22T combo (need 205 crank gear) as the 205 ECU can be tuned w/Accessport & it's easier to tune in general.

[98Wagon]

This is what he suggested. He runs 25D heads on a NA 22e with the stock ecu.

 

Boosted?

 

Here is a good read regarding hybrid builds posted by Fujik on NASIOC: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2141800

 

Great, great thread- thanks!

 

 

Monkey, that is the same page where I got a lot of my info for the first DOHC EJ22 from (my current one is actually my 2nd). My favorite pic is where it says, "Here is a stock 2.5L EJ255/EJ257 B25 combustion chamber to a 97mm bore." So Kenny (kennyvfholla), you were right the whole time on being able to use 96 25D heads on an EJ22. It CAN be done safely.

 

There are more reasons to run a 22T over a 257:

1. Fully closed deck means that more power can be contained safely. (To be fair, the 257 blocks have proven to be very tough themselves).

 

2. Oil squirters, though they come loose at times & add "liquid weight" to the pistons, bring cooling & lubrication at once.

 

3. 52mm rod journal means that Phase 2 rods can be used & the short stroke means quicker revs & higher potential rpm overall.

 

4. It has a smaller bore & thus matches the 2L (and some 2.5L) heads better than the 2.5L bore (for hybrid setups).

 

In fact, the only reason I could find to choose the 257 over the 22T is the 30% bore increase, which allows for more power out the box. Other than that, I think the 22T kinda wins that comparison.

 

To the OP, you can indeed run the 25D/22E combo w/standalone (I will eventually do this) but I think it's less troublesome to run the 205/22T combo (need 205 crank gear) as the 205 ECU can be tuned w/Accessport & it's easier to tune in general.

 

Thanks a TON for this info. Some of it I knew, some I didn't.

 

Either of you guys have experience swapping ecu's in a bk/bd? I'm beginning to wonder if I'd just be happier if I went ahead and swapped to a 205 ecu as has been mentioned. And would it be most cost effective per hp?

 

You guys know of any write-ups on that subject that you find are particularly informative?

 

I am willing to spend some money on this build, but on the other hand- it's not my only project vehicle and my pockets aren't super deep, so find a good balance between reliability, cost, and hp is what I'm going for. I wish I could do a build like this: 2.2 na-turbo 213 awhp

(I realize that this little motor is obd1 and so mine is not that simple-but I wish I had the know-how to pull that kind of power off for such a relatively low cost)

 

This thread also has some good reading in it: Ej22+turbo or ej22t?

[monkeyposeur]

There are more reasons to run a 22T over a 257:

1. Fully closed deck means that more power can be contained safely. (To be fair, the 257 blocks have proven to be very tough themselves).

 

2. Oil squirters, though they come loose at times & add "liquid weight" to the pistons, bring cooling & lubrication at once.

 

3. 52mm rod journal means that Phase 2 rods can be used & the short stroke means quicker revs & higher potential rpm overall.

 

4. It has a smaller bore & thus matches the 2L (and some 2.5L) heads better than the 2.5L bore (for hybrid setups).

 

In fact, the only reason I could find to choose the 257 over the 22T is the 30% bore increase, which allows for more power out the box. Other than that, I think the 22T kinda wins that comparison.

 

To the OP, you can indeed run the 25D/22E combo w/standalone (I will eventually do this) but I think it's less troublesome to run the 205/22T combo (need 205 crank gear) as the 205 ECU can be tuned w/Accessport & it's easier to tune in general.

 

^That's why they are cool! But 257s are easy to find compared to 22Ts. I'm stoked to have one. As far as the squirters go some people keep them, some people plug them. I'm pretty sure I am going to keep mine. I will use some sort of loctite on them. One of my squirters is missing. They are somewhat expensive to replace and hard to find. But I found a source in the UK and they are about £33 each.

 

One complaint that I have heard about a 22T/205 setup is that the coolant passages don't line up perfectly but it seems that most headgaskets are like this, but idk.

 

Ugh, my swap is taking forever! I wish I had enough extra $$$ to finish it. But I'm also trying to finish my epic years long house remodel.

[Sludgeroo]

If you build a megasquirt standalone it will be around the same as a nice piggyback.

 

And what's cool with the MS is you can get a base map tester to make sure you built it right before putting it in the car.

 

Alot more tuning options, like launch controls and cool shit like that.

 

Just thought id mention it as an option.

 

Should be cool build when youre done.

[Zues Marine]

http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=47252

 

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2140476

 

http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=48861

[DOHCEJ22E1]

One complaint that I have heard about a 22T/205 setup is that the coolant passages don't line up perfectly but it seems that most headgaskets are like this, but idk.

 

You have to use the Cometic or Victor Reinz custom head gasket that's for the 222. The coolant ports match up perfectly with the DOHC heads. The good thing about these gaskets is that you can get them in whatever thickness you want for whatever build you're planning.

[monkeyposeur]

I'm a little weary of using a Cometic because of a number of horror stories of failures on 22Ts. I know lots of people have used them with sucess on other blocks, and probably 22Ts as well. But I have read numerous accounts of them only lasting a few months on fresh 22T builds. In fact the guy I bought my internals from used a Cometic and it lasted a few thousand miles before it blew and he is a capable builder.

[DOHCEJ22E1]

I'm a little weary of using a Cometic because of a number of horror stories of failures on 22Ts. I know lots of people have used them with sucess on other blocks, and probably 22Ts as well. But I have read numerous accounts of them only lasting a few months on fresh 22T builds. In fact the guy I bought my internals from used a Cometic and it lasted a few thousand miles before it blew and he is a capable builder.

 

I went OEM EJ222 HG with the first build & drove that up to about 75k before selling that car & with my current 22D, I used Victor Reinz HG & 20k later, not so much as a single leak & that engine has been put through some serious duty (I live in a hilly town, so my engine sees anywhere from 2-3k rpm whenever I return home. As long as you use the head gasket with matching coolant ports, you shouldn't have a problem (22E & 22T cooling ports do not match DOHC heads).

[Wiclipse95]

I didn't know an RS bumper would fit a 2nd gen Leg

[98Wagon]

I didn't know an RS bumper would fit a 2nd gen Leg

 

It will- but there is a difference in the curve of the headlights between the two that leaves a gap from about halfway under the headlights to the grill on the legacy. And the tall grill doesn't work well either. Just FYI. I may see what I can figure out That looks good still though...

[Zues Marine]

I didn't know an RS bumper would fit a 2nd gen Leg

 

Soooooooo many better options...

[98Wagon]

Finished my brake swap/disc conversion late last night!

 

I am now sporting twin piston 04 wrx front calipers, and outback rear single-pot discs. While I was in there, I replaced the struts and springs with those from an '02 wrx wagon as well.

 

The only thing I would point out to someone wanting to do the same, is when you buy your brake conversion parts off of the other vehicles- try to get the hoses. I got them for the wrx stuff, but not for the outback rear discs.

 

I realized in the middle of the night that the hardlines that went to my drums would not work on the rear discs I bought. But when I started looking at what I had on hand and could make work- VOILA! My old front lines work perfect! And when you bend the little tab flat on the brake line mount on the newer struts, and use the old keeper for the front line, it's almost like it came from the factory that way! I don't have any pictures, but I will try to edit this post with some later.

 

The ride is much better with the new struts! I am looking forward to putting the new swaybars on (wrx front and rear) and seeing how much extra difference that makes.

 

I went and had it aligned today after all of this and asked them to make my front camber about -1.5 degrees on the front. Unfortunately they missed the memo, and I only got about -.5 degrees. Luckily I bought the the year-long alignment plan- so I will take it back to them and have them fix it later, but today was my wife's birthday and I didn't want to spend the whole day at sears!

 

On the turbo front, I am pretty seriously thinking open source tunable ECM and appropriate heads/intake/harness. And then, depending on whether I feel up to the task or not, seeing if Iwire will merge the harness' for me.

 

A few questions:

1. What would you guys say would be a good deal for the required equipment?

 

2. The newer heads, with the newer em would get me the kind of power I am looking for pretty readily with the right tune, correct?

 

3. Speaking of right tune- with the open source tuning, can a guy find a tune online that would make the kind of hp I am looking for with my setup, or am I going to need to spend a time with a tuner?

 

4. If I need a tuner, any recommendations on Colorado's front range?

 

5. What turbo would you guys with experience recommend?

 

All if that said for my 22t block, I am thinking about getting my feet wet with forced induction by using my NA 22e and getting a set of 25d heads and making a turbo set up. This would be more as a short term project while I gather parts and etc for my 22t build. I am going to have to source most of the required parts for the 22t build anyway- why not?

 

We'll see- it's all about what I can find for what price as far as building a turbo'd 22e goes. I figure I could turn around and sell that set up, minus parts I needed for the 22t, when it is ready to go. Or shoot- maybe even just by another wagon shell and have two turbo'd wagons- one for me, and one for the wife!

[blankdeluxe]

On the turbo front, I am pretty seriously thinking open source tunable ECM and appropriate heads/intake/harness. And then, depending on whether I feel up to the task or not, seeing if Iwire will merge the harness' for me.

 

A few questions:

1. What would you guys say would be a good deal for the required equipment?

 

2. The newer heads, with the newer em would get me the kind of power I am looking for pretty readily with the right tune, correct?

 

3. Speaking of right tune- with the open source tuning, can a guy find a tune online that would make the kind of hp I am looking for with my setup, or am I going to need to spend a time with a tuner?

 

4. If I need a tuner, any recommendations on Colorado's front range?

 

5. What turbo would you guys with experience recommend?

 

All if that said for my 22t block, I am thinking about getting my feet wet with forced induction by using my NA 22e and getting a set of 25d heads and making a turbo set up. This would be more as a short term project while I gather parts and etc for my 22t build. I am going to have to source most of the required parts for the 22t build anyway- why not?

 

We'll see- it's all about what I can find for what price as far as building a turbo'd 22e goes. I figure I could turn around and sell that set up, minus parts I needed for the 22t, when it is ready to go. Or shoot- maybe even just by another wagon shell and have two turbo'd wagons- one for me, and one for the wife!

 

 

 

1. If your here in Colorado the wrx parts you are looking for are going to be tricky to find.

 

2. What kind of power are you shooting for? With wrx heads on a 22t bottom end that is built you can expect to hit the 300whp mark on the high end with a good tune and the right parts to go along with it.

 

3. I would spend time with a tuner. Its always safer then trusting a random tune you find online and accidentally breaking something.

 

4. If you are on the north side of the city then Boost Creep is your best option. If you are closer to the south side then you should look into Metro or Suba performance. Those three shops should be your go to tuners for the general Denver/Colorado area.

 

5. I'm no help here. I'm still working on my build but I'm doing a 22e bottom end with 22t internals and 25d heads and I plan on running wrx headers and a td05 turbo on my setup with a 06 forester TMIC. I can only run about 10psi with that setup but i'm shooting to be right in the 230whp range once its all finished if that helps at all. And my estimated total cost is right at the $1500 for that build including paying for the new block and heads.

[98Wagon]

1. If your here in Colorado the wrx parts you are looking for are going to be tricky to find.

 

2. What kind of power are you shooting for? With wrx heads on a 22t bottom end that is built you can expect to hit the 300whp mark on the high end with a good tune and the right parts to go along with it.

 

3. I would spend time with a tuner. Its always safer then trusting a random tune you find online and accidentally breaking something.

 

4. If you are on the north side of the city then Boost Creep is your best option. If you are closer to the south side then you should look into Metro or Suba performance. Those three shops should be your go to tuners for the general Denver/Colorado area.

 

5. I'm no help here. I'm still working on my build but I'm doing a 22e bottom end with 22t internals and 25d heads and I plan on running wrx headers and a td05 turbo on my setup with a 06 forester TMIC. I can only run about 10psi with that setup but i'm shooting to be right in the 230whp range once its all finished if that helps at all. And my estimated total cost is right at the $1500 for that build including paying for the new block and heads.

 

Thanks for the input. I actually live in Castle Rock, so I would probably be going to the guys on the south end of Denver.

 

As an update to my build-I think that I found a good set of 25D heads and an intake for cheap. For now, I think that I'm going to stick with my original plan to go with these heads and probably a Greddy e-manage (Probably ultimate- but I'm not sure yet.) I am still doing tons of research though, While moving and studying for my Lineman apprenticeship, so this may develop further, But sure enough at the moment that I'm going to go look at the heads this weekend.

[98Wagon]

EJ222 turbo parts list

[98Wagon]

So this thread isn't dead-just had a lot going on lately!

 

 

-I did buy a 2.5 DOHC engine for the heads and IM but...The wagon this thread was based on was totalled when a guy pulled out in front of me when I had the right of way.

 

 

-The car was totaled- as it wasn't worth fixing, but I bought it back for the wrx bits and new tranny I had just put in it.

 

 

-I took the leftover money and bought a '97 outback with a freshly built hi comp 2.5 and a slush box.

 

 

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/02/10/y2y3yqus.jpg

Turned out I didn't like the slush box or the fuel mileage, so I started looking for another Legacy Wagon. Specifically a 99. (They are supposed to have sti rods-or so I read in a thread by a guy making up to 350 hp (edit: 507 whp! 8) )with a NA 2.2 block. http://www.sl-i.net/FORUM/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=25983&sid=18fb6a115de60c2273a2515bf7b8e947

 

 

After looking for awhile, I found one with an almost perfect body, and about 164k miles on it- it runs great and has been well taken care of. I snagged it up for a good deal and sold the outback-I even made a little money! ($1700 to be exact

 

 

Here's a picture:

 

 

 

My updated plan after doing tons of research on engines/swaps/builds/ is to ghetto boost the MAP 2.2 in my car- using this thread as guidelines: EJ222 turbo parts list

The OP is doing the 1/4 mile in the 12 second range in his totally stock, single port head, ej22 without engine management! That's good enough for me!

 

I want to eventually build the 2.2T block, but I want to gain some 2.2 na-t experience and maybe dabble with EM before I build that one. That way I can build muscle car killer!

[TexasLegacy2.5GT]

Here is the deal with the RS bumper. I have this mod on my 99' GT. Though I like Zues' GT-B bumper a ton I saw a RS bumper on sale locally and went for it. Mine was a aftermarket application for a 2000 RS. There are two problems that you will encounter with this mod. The bumper is a match from left to right (width wise) the first problem are the Legacy's front fenders. Right where the RS bumper meets with the front fenders it is a straight line for all RS's. The Legacy fenders angle only slightly downwards. You can only notice if you take care in looking that they are not perfectly straight. The second problem would be the front grill. Over the years the 2nd gen Lego changed its grill size from too to bottom. Only the earlier years in the legacy where the grill is smaller will it match up with the RS bumper and have room to close the hood. What I did was buy a 96 JDM "L7" grill to match up with the bumper. My next mod will be to add fender flares to solve the fender angle issue. I've always thought that the GT bumper was too bland and I didn't want to go the OB bumper route either. Zues's GT-B bumper is awesome but he donated his left testicle for it to arrive from Malayasia. His girl is still happy with the one testicle after two kids.

 

There is only one very rare JDM bumper and headlight combo that was OEM and JDM issue only that I'm find of and I've only yet to see the dual Fog/rally lights mounts for it on E-Bay. If I ever do find it I might be a one nut wonder as well..

 

My RS BUMPER project.

http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee134/Rubenjc111/108C0C32-07F3-4252-81B7-1FA19F224C5A-4106-000002F0C63C3085_zpsc0ea4fe7.jpg

 

http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee134/Rubenjc111/AC4B02E3.jpg

[TexasLegacy2.5GT]

^^that was for 98 Wag and Wiclipse95. BTW

[98Wagon]

Looks good from that angle! Moar pics?

 

I know it would be workn but I like the concept.

 

How about a write-up?

[Sludgeroo]

So are you saying regular 2.5rs gc8 bumpers fit with the above stated exceptions also?

 

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