Ej22e with Ej25D heads

[1-3-2-4]

Anyone know what the C/R would be?

[Kennyfvholla]

You're looking at between 8.0:1 to 8.5:1

 

I did the numbers a while back but I forget what it exactly was. When DOHC chimes in he can give you the exact numbers that I gave him a while back. He has the same setup.

[1-3-2-4]

So I assume it would really be un-driveable without the aid of a turbo? And as far as the headgaskets match the gaskets to the block right?

[Kennyfvholla]

Quite the contrary. It's actually very drive-able, especially with the 5MT. He has a 4EAT with the "sport mode" mod and loves it. Check out his build thread.

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/dohc-ej22e-190650.html?t=190650

 

Just about any question you might have can be answered with that thread.

[1-3-2-4]

sweet I will be reading that, good info about the head studs and coolant pipe.

[spooln30]

Drivable yes but powerful doubtful. That is a great CR for turbos but the block wouldn't last long. Probably could run around 5 psi but you wouldn't notice a huge power gain.

[1-3-2-4]

I'm not looking to make a huge amount of power 5-10 psi is more then I need.

[DOHCEJ22E1]

Anyone know what the C/R would be?

 

Using a normal EJ22 head gasket will put you right where Kenny says (8.5:1ish).

I used a thinner, phase 2 type head gasket, so my compression ratio is 9.5:1.

 

So I assume it would really be un-driveable without the aid of a turbo? And as far as the headgaskets match the gaskets to the block right?

 

The engine in my car is driveable. It is my daily & has been quite the trooper for some 16k miles. It is lacking in TQ where a normal EJ22 would have it but the midrange is where this engine shines. Also, it LOVES to rev up. It just decelerates slowly, even with the lightweight pulley on the crank, which is awesome for freeway traveling as I can accelerate back to speed easily.

 

As for head gaskets, I'd go for a custom type of head gasket, such as a Cometic with whatever thickness you want. The bore has to match the block but the coolant ports have to match the head or you risk a blown head gasket.

 

Drivable yes but powerful doubtful. That is a great CR for turbos but the block wouldn't last long. Probably could run around 5 psi but you wouldn't notice a huge power gain.

 

Not true. There are EJ22E blocks being used in WRXs under harder demands than 5psi & are holding up very well. 5psi on this hybrid w/8.5:1 compression will last quite a long while if the block hasn't been abused before hand. On 5psi, this hybrid generates equal bhp to the 205 but almost 50btq over. You could most likely push 10psi & still be fine with good tuning. In N/A form with the way I have it, I'm very certain the engine puts out about 150ish bhp on 87. The TQ used to be unbearably low before but for some reason, it has a good chunk between 2k-3k rpms, so it's pretty much an all-around driver now. It hates steep hills though but will get up them with some gusto if I floor it.

 

Any more questions?

[1-3-2-4]

You have become my new best friend I have a bunch more questions but I will ask when I get home.. its more about turbo setups.. btw I think I saw your car on YouTube last night? I figure I do this now I can free up my money for the emanage ultimate which is going to take the bulk of the money.

[1-3-2-4]

OK now that I'm home I'm looking at some ej22e's that are around 120-150K miles on them, the issue is going to be trying to find some that came from a auto so I have a EGR to use with my car.

 

I figure I get the motor half way ready for a turbo ahead of time and see how it runs for a few months.. So with the DHOC heads on the ej22e does it make it a interference engine then? I've asked this on 4 sites now and no one has given me a answer yet.

 

Why do I need custom head gaskets? You are the first I heard say that

 

I was wondering if a TD04 is enough for my needs? I'd say 10 psi is about what I would want to do for the time being.

[DOHCEJ22E1]

Okay, I'll sum it up as best as I can.

 

1. EGR doesn't matter since your car doesn't have it. It will work but your car won't be able to tell that it's working. It will run on boost but don't go crazy with it on a stock EJ22. They don't inhale well enough to produce the power you want.

 

2. 97-99 25D heads will remain interference (valve to valve or piston to valve). There is no changing that. The valves just drop in too deep when the cam opens them. As long as your timing accessories are up to date, you should have no worries.

 

3. You need custom head gaskets because the cooling ports on the 22E & 25D heads are very different & the 22E gasket coolant ports will not line up with the 25D ports. I'll explain by showing.

 

Stock head gasket type: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-Subaru-OEM-Head-Gasket-Pair-EJ22-EJ22E-95-98-Impreza-Legacy-NEW-NR-/330741789824?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4d01bf3480&vxp=mtr.

 

What you need to properly fit the 25D heads on: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cometic-Head-Gasket-MLS-C4263-051-Subaru-EJ22T-98-mm-051-Each-/271114054857?pt=Race_Car_Parts&hash=item3f1fa82cc9&vxp=mtr.

 

4. 10psi will be absolutely sufficient for what you want. The older the block, the better for compression it will be. 90-95 blocks are probably the best. 96-98 blocks will yield slightly higher compression but can also be run. 99-01 blocks have the highest compression pistons.

[1-3-2-4]

Uhmm my car (1997 Outback Legacy) DOES have a EGR system.. Which is why I need to look for a EJ22e that came from a Automatic because they only had a EGR, the 5 M/T versions did not.

 

So those gaskets you list (Ej22T) I could just pick the same gaskets up from the dealer?

 

And I was not sure about the head and how far the valves opened, I just lost my Ej25 to that.. well not really lost it but at 265K miles on it I don't want to risk it.. plus the valves got bent because the belt stretched and jumped 11 teeth on the passenger side.

[r3v_v3ng3]

The egr is only on the heads so it doesnt matter since you'll be putting the 25d heads on the 22e

[DOHCEJ22E1]

Uhmm my car (1997 Outback Legacy) DOES have a EGR system.. Which is why I need to look for a EJ22e that came from a Automatic because they only had a EGR, the 5 M/T versions did not.

 

So those gaskets you list (Ej22T) I could just pick the same gaskets up from the dealer?

 

And I was not sure about the head and how far the valves opened, I just lost my Ej25 to that.. well not really lost it but at 265K miles on it I don't want to risk it.. plus the valves got bent because the belt stretched and jumped 11 teeth on the passenger side.

 

No, you must order the head gaskets from online. The dealer will give you actual 22T gaskets, which you do not want since they are the same type as the 22e gaskets.

 

Valves are like $100-$120 on eBay. A little more for OEM valves. However, you should do some head work (port & polish) while the heads are out so you can get the best out of them when you run them.

[1-3-2-4]

I can't afford the port and polish I already asked the price when I had my heads resurfaced 2 years ago.. it's like $800

[1-3-2-4]

oooh right lol how could I forget... I had to clean the EGR pipe to the head about a month ago.

 

 

I used to own a 95 legacy so I have a few parts laying around that I was going to put on it before it got totaled..

 

 

Which includes a new oil pan, and 2nd cat which I ended putting on the Outback now, and I kept the ngk plug wires but they will be useless with the DOHC heads.

 

 

So I see what you mean about those gaskets and why the others wont fit.

 

I don't think it's worth taking the heads off my ej25d and taking the valves out (need custom tool I hear) and hoping the damage is not too bad. IMHO just buy two heads for $75 each from a local yard and that's it.

[DOHCEJ22E1]

I can't afford the port and polish I already asked the price when I had my heads resurfaced 2 years ago.. it's like $800

 

If not, it's no biggie.

Those heads bring in more air than the 22E heads in stock form so that's what makes them valuable.

[1-3-2-4]

Yeah that part I noticed, I think next week providing it wont rain here again I will go hunt down a Ej22.. hah the higher the miles the better

 

So A rundown so I can put it in my notes.

 

with the ej25 heads the following would need to be moved to the ej22

 

Ej25 head bolts

ej25 coolant pipes

 

I've got a long drive to South Carolina in Aug so just having a running engine right now is good.

 

Oh speaking of engines.. now would be a good time to do those engine mounts, anyone here do them? Be it STI mounts or filled them in?

[DOHCEJ22E1]

Head bolts, coolant pipes, & dipstick need to be transferred over.

STi or solid mounts would be good.

[1-3-2-4]

Head bolts, coolant pipes, & dipstick need to be transferred over.

STi or solid mounts would be good.

The dipstick? If I remember right the part that the dipstick goes into is a two piece part? Are the ej22 and ej25 dipsticks going to have the same level reading?

[Osei]

If you have a dremel type tool you can polish the heads and intake manifold yourself.

I have EJ25D heads from a 98 Forester that I have starting polishing and am just waiting for the right car to show up so I can do the EJ22DOHC.

While not a pro job, I have removed all the tooling marks and they will flow some better.

Many vendors sell a port/polish kit for about $35. Take your time. You don't have to port match. Just watch a few youtube or vendor videos and you'll get an idea of what to do. All it takes is time.

You can get a valve compressor from some auto stores on loan. I just made a simple one to use, because I have nothing but time.

Hemostats and a magnetic screwdriver will make installing the retainers easier

 

O

[Zues Marine]

**** up a diy pnp and you're screwed tho

[1-3-2-4]

If you have a dremel type tool you can polish the heads and intake manifold yourself.

I have EJ25D heads from a 98 Forester that I have starting polishing and am just waiting for the right car to show up so I can do the EJ22DOHC.

While not a pro job, I have removed all the tooling marks and they will flow some better.

Many vendors sell a port/polish kit for about $35. Take your time. You don't have to port match. Just watch a few youtube or vendor videos and you'll get an idea of what to do. All it takes is time.

You can get a valve compressor from some auto stores on loan. I just made a simple one to use, because I have nothing but time.

Hemostats and a magnetic screwdriver will make installing the retainers easier

 

O

 

 

Yeah I do have a dremel but I need to get one as the one I have just has two speeds... back when I got it 4 years ago I was not sure if I would use it much, but as I see it's really helpful for any projects.

[Osei]

**** up a diy pnp and you're screwed tho

 

Indeed, that's why I stuck to just polishing. Looking at the heads, you'll see a scribe line to match the port. I didn't want to go this far, especially on the first one.

But taking one's time you have less possibilities of messing this up, than a first time T belt change on a dohc.

 

O.

[1-3-2-4]

All I can say is I'm glad I got myself an engine puller lol from the way things look now I might be dropping the ej22e in as is and putting the DOHC heads on later.. I have 3 weeks of vacation coming up and jury duty soon so everything is getting squeezed..

 

plus I wanted to paint my car this year, which requires me to get another hood and a new hatch because the last owner ripped the tint off taking off all the defrost lines, it's just cheaper to get a hatch from the local yard.. Plus I can get one with a spoiler on it.

 

It's a pain in the ass to drive in CT when it snows and your whole back window is foggy and you have the heat blowing full blast trying to clear it.