Falling On It's Face

[seabass07]

In all the performance cars I've driven, they pull strong till just before red. So when you're really pushing the car hard, red to red gear shifting the car stays in the 'ideal' power band. In this car, you fall out of that at the top 1k of revs. It doesn't need a drive with another car to know, look at all the dinos.

 

I'm actually strongly considering selling this car in the summer and buying the Acura I should have but the exwife had to own a subi.

 

The power curve they make:

 

http://photos.smugmug.com/photos/435756258_9ekSt-XL.jpg

 

What you are forgetting, or blatantly ignoring for trolling purposes, is that you are not driving a "performance car". You are driving a family sedan with a tiny turbo designed for DD.

 

Now seriously, just STFU and buy a bigger turbo. Stop your bitching.

[.Catalyst.]

Was thinking the exact same about the classification of the LGT. Skip buying the bigger turbo - sell the LGT as you said you would, and go enjoy your "performance" Acura that gains 4HP and 6TQ with the tune shown in that Dyno plot you're so impressed with.

[rob-2]

Was thinking the exact same about the classification of the LGT. Skip buying the bigger turbo - sell the LGT as you said you would, and go enjoy your "performance" Acura that gains 4HP and 6TQ with the tune shown in that Dyno plot you're so impressed with.

 

The tune wasn't the point, the curve was. Look at how stock there is a nice cross over, strong pull and flat top of curve. Every shift falls back into peak power.

 

But thanks. I might just do that. On the acura forums, people aren't so childish about being critical of a design flaw.

[700watts]

this thread still lives ?

[iNVAR]

wondering what Acura is that?

[Nrw]

So... You want a n/a style powerband on a factory turbo car?

[rob-2]

So... You want a n/a style powerband on a factory turbo car?

 

I want a decent power band. Turbo or NA doesn't make a difference.

 

RDX Turbo power band. Showing a well designed turbo platform can offer a good power band without the fall off at the top.

 

http://rdx.acurazine.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=2223&pictureid=11489

[iNVAR]

So I googled his image url, and it goes back to a bmw forum. someone posted the image as a reference. it's a stock car with VQ35HR probably a Nissan 350z...

 

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1320305

 

at least get your dyno plots straight...

 

Also, you're comparing a 3.5 liter engine with 6 cylinders to a 2.5 with 4 and a turbo...

 

so a 40% increase in displacement and 50% more cylinders...

[rob-2]

So I googled his image url, and it goes back to a bmw forum. someone posted the image as a reference. it's a stock car with VQ35HR probably a Nissan 350z...

 

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1320305

 

at least get your dyno plots straight...

 

Also, you're comparing a 3.5 liter engine with 6 cylinders to a 2.5 with 4 and a turbo...

 

so a 40% increase in displacement and 50% more cylinders...

 

Thanks I've been reviewing dyno graphics in google image search.

[mwiener2]

The Acura dyno from UpRev is using an SAE correction factor. Those numbers are a bit inflated.

 

If I use an SAE CF on our dyno, My outback puts out close to 600hp at redline.

[kanazteck261]

 

notice where he says boost pressure starts to fall off.

 

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

[RabidWombat]

I want a decent power band. Turbo or NA doesn't make a difference.

 

RDX Turbo power band. Showing a well designed turbo platform can offer a good power band without the fall off at the top.

 

No, you want a N/A power band. The LGT has a very good power band.

If you consider 90% of peak HP, here are you power bands.

 

Dynojet: 5500-7500

RDX: 4200-6700

LGT: 4200-6500

 

The LGT hits peak power sooner, but has just as wide a power band.

[.Catalyst.]

The tune wasn't the point, the curve was. Look at how stock there is a nice cross over, strong pull and flat top of curve. Every shift falls back into peak power.

 

But thanks. I might just do that. On the acura forums, people aren't so childish about being critical of a design flaw.

It's not a design flaw. Your logic is where the flaw resides (assuming all engine types regardless of displacement, forced induction, transmission types, etc. - should have identical power bands). I have no issues shifting to maximize time spent in the peak power band. Then again I drive a 5MT instead of the autotragic.

[Nolmers06LGT]

The tune wasn't the point, the curve was. Look at how stock there is a nice cross over, strong pull and flat top of curve. Every shift falls back into peak power.

 

But thanks. I might just do that. On the acura forums, people aren't so childish about being critical of a design flaw.

 

First, I agree with the others- if you're really disappointed with your automatic turbo luxury sedan, go buy an Acura. I think you're missing the point of the other posts.. This isn't a design flaw, it's another safety feature. An engine pulling high load at high rpms SHOULD lose power above 5k. There is no reason to push a turbo that hard if it's a daily driver. If you want to see where your restriction is, look at photos of the stock downpipe flange. The car is designed to choke itself with the revs up so that it will last a long time. Subaru engineers are some of the best in their field because they are realistic. If you bought a 5mt instead of an auto, you could see how much fun running from 3k to 5k really is. If you really think an Acura is better, good for you. Have fun with your NA powered, fwd, 2+2 seater.

[frank_ster]

also another point the automatic will lock up the torque converter at around 6000 rpm and the rpm needle will sort of hang there and then sweep the rest of the way.

if the tranny is not warm enough the tcc wont lock up and the car will be quite a bit slower

[iNVAR]

I want a decent power band. Turbo or NA doesn't make a difference.

 

RDX Turbo power band. Showing a well designed turbo platform can offer a good power band without the fall off at the top.

 

http://rdx.acurazine.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=2223&pictureid=11489

 

Dude... Seriously?

 

Here's what the HP and TQ look like when you superimpose and scale the HP properly on top of TQ.

 

Yeah, that looks really awesome, so much better than ours.

[robitrice]

this thread is really becoming a gem. yea and the lgt tq curve fell on its face at 5.5K rpms. that graph jumped off a cliff, no parachute. yea you would shift back to the power and hold it for 1K rpms!!!!! def a neck snapper

[gt06unlimited]

sayin theyre pooly designed is kindof unfair... u mentioned auto, im assuming you mean an automatic tranny. if its shift points and fun you want, you need a manual. automatics are good for city driving, but theres a lot of extra stuff in there that robs you of high end power. remember how much effeciency you lose with an awd platform, somewhere like 10-20% if youre lucky, add to that half a million quarts of AT fluid, a heavy torque converter and a small turbo, the turbo at that point is there for fuel economy. that 6k redline is the actual point where valve float can occur in these engines, sooo everything from 5 and up is in the "yellow" range. rev limiter kicks in at 6300 i think...?

[frank_ster]

hey hey there enough with the auto bashing thats all not true !

check out rome sti hr ran 12.5 @ 112 mph ! on a stock 5 eat

[Nolmers06LGT]

Not necessarily bashing the 5EAT.. Just pointing out that the 5mt is much more enjoyable to drive. I'm sure everyone on here with a 5mt who has to deal with bumper to bumper traffic can agree that an automatic transmission has its benefits. I'm fairly new to manual transmissions; I've owned automatics exclusively up to my legacy. The satisfaction of running through the gears WOT is one of the best experiences of my life- driving through rush hour traffic in Chicago was one of the worst experiences. My next DD will be an automatic for that reason.

[frank_ster]

oh ^ actually the flex plate and torque converter is actually lighter than then flywheel and pressure plate.

[iNVAR]

Not necessarily bashing the 5EAT.. Just pointing out that the 5mt is much more enjoyable to drive. I'm sure everyone on here with a 5mt who has to deal with bumper to bumper traffic can agree that an automatic transmission has its benefits. I'm fairly new to manual transmissions; I've owned automatics exclusively up to my legacy. The satisfaction of running through the gears WOT is one of the best experiences of my life- driving through rush hour traffic in Chicago was one of the worst experiences. My next DD will be an automatic for that reason.

 

same here. NYC driver here. this is my first and last MT car haha

[Nolmers06LGT]

Lol.. I can't imagine that traffic day to day. The manual is amazing for curvy roads in the country where no-one is around to get in the way. Bumper to bumper traffic for hours at a time suck to no end.

 

I plan to buy an outback or something for the wifey, then buy a beater truck.. capable of pulling a trailer.. those will be auto. I don't plan on getting rid of my legacy for a long time. I've had fun doing all of my repairs/mods by myself. I'd rather swap a tranny or rebuild a block than get rid of this chassis.