executor485 Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Alright, my friend just bought a C63 AMG Black Series and I figured I'd give everyone a nice comparison. I got to drive it a bit, and I've got some thoughts. First off: Styling - Need we say more... Hands down, this over the LGT. Speed - Holy *expletive deleted*. Power is there at any moment. Pull in third gear from 2k RPM's... No turbo lag, just a nice punch to your chest. For a moment, I thought it was the fastest car I've ever been in, but then I remembered I did get to drive a CTS-V once. The power delivery, about the same though. I'd pit them against each other with a slight edge given to the V in a straight line only. 18G Subaru, yea, you're not coming close either. 20G with E85, maybe... But when you get up in the triple digits, may as well give it up cause this thing is relentless. Pulling from 100-160 in the Black is just as strong as doing a 40-80 pull in an 18G Subie. Handling - Not even a comparison here. I could try to compare them, but that would mean that the Legacy actually does handle. Lets see, an overpowered RWD beast with racing suspension vs people who need to excuse their lack of ability with AWD and overpriced coilovers... Having been in "great handling" LGT's and STi's with full suspension work and the Black; I can say I'd rather DD a Black than the Subies. Even though it's racing suspension, and really, an engineering marvel; the ride is VERY smooth. My friends EVO with springs had a rougher ride than the Black, and it didnt handle near as well. The steering wheel is very precise. Feedback is absolutely brilliant, heavy enough to know it's there, but not so much that you have to brute force it at any point. Point and shoot would be about the best way to describe it. Braking - Probably one of the best parts about this car. Linear, smooth, composed and brilliant. Basically everything on this car feels linear and precise. Drifting in this thing is extremely predictable and easy to do. Burnouts: FUN So... Cliff notes: Rather than modding a Subaru, it seems more reasonable to buy a better platform from the beginning. Being a 1 in 500 car though, I'll have to stick with driving his when I get the opportunities. If I pass you on the right, I'm flipping you off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoplightAssassin Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 thats great but how's it do in snow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mega Users seabass07 Posted January 23, 2012 Mega Users Share Posted January 23, 2012 AWD>RWD /thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05GT Guru Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 AWD>RWD /thread Yea... for snow driving. RWD with lots of tire and downforce>AWD for almost anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mega Users seabass07 Posted January 23, 2012 Mega Users Share Posted January 23, 2012 No. AWD>RWD always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoplightAssassin Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 you never know when you'll hit someone's icee they threw out the window. it happened to me twice last week. if it weren't for awd, I would've been 15 pages deep in my thread blaming the car how the rear end just snapped out without warning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemo Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Wow. Beautiful car. I'm sure someone is going to ask it so I'll get it out of the way -- what does he do for a living? OH, and obligatory Spec B > MB. If you don't vote Trump, out, you're a bigot who hates america. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
01rs25 Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Wait your comparing a AMG black to a legacy? Did you really think the legacy would compare at any point in your review? These cars aren't even in the same league. Slammed more than your girlfriend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowImg Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 So the summary is a $100,000+ car outperforms the Legacy? I think next you should probably review the F430 and Aventador vs the LGT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRSCobra Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Edmunds has that doing a 12.6@115.2 mph in the 1/4. Not too much faster than a pump gas 20g lgt. (sorry, I had to!) I'm sure it would kill the LGT in a 1/2 mile or highway race, though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmx045 Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 panties drop at an alarming rate with the C63 LGT... nah brah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
executor485 Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 Wow. Beautiful car. I'm sure someone is going to ask it so I'll get it out of the way -- what does he do for a living? OH, and obligatory Spec B > MB. 2 jobs, no kids, split bills with gf. One job is recruiting for my company, the other is a helicopter instructor. So... yea, lots of fun It is/was used though, so not 100k If I pass you on the right, I'm flipping you off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katalyst Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 panties drop at an alarming rate with the C63 LGT... nah brah / thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
executor485 Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 Wait your comparing a AMG black to a legacy? Did you really think the legacy would compare at any point in your review? These cars aren't even in the same league. Well, I wasnt expecting miracles. The AMG is a RWD car as compared to our superior AWD system. I mean really, look at the Lambo's and Audi's with AWD systems that will absolutely crush the competition. One would venture to think that an AWD system would completely disgrace the RWD of this car, but first hand, I can confirm that the RWD in this car is my solid choice over any AWD platform. So the summary is a $100,000+ car outperforms the Legacy? I think next you should probably review the F430 and Aventador vs the LGT. This forum constantly compares the LGT to any other car, and nearly every time the LGT reigns supreme. It's actually a very rare case that our 3*k car does not triumph in every category. That being said though, it's also very common for the LGT engine to blow, ringlands get shot, turbos die, RE92's cause wrecks, and the like. After it's all said and done, we're dumping massive amounts of money into the LGT. Also considering, the mods we have to put into the LGT, it's quite shameful that it's not a much better platform even after the mods. While we may not be spending 135k new (or 70k used), I have seen people dumping obscene amounts of money into the LGT that eventually comes out to ridiculous prices when you could start with a far superior platform. Edmunds has that doing a 12.6@115.2 mph in the 1/4. Not too much faster than a pump gas 20g lgt. (sorry, I had to!) I'm sure it would kill the LGT in a 1/2 mile or highway race, though... It all depends on conditions too though. Get a nice set of hoosiers for the MB and I'm guessing there would be a different story. The biggest problem with the car in it's stock form is the inability to put down every piece of power it has in the lower gears. I was actually CONSTANTLY pinging the traction control under 80MPH. If I pass you on the right, I'm flipping you off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolksey85 Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 First off, major props to your buddy for even being able to get one. There's only around 90 of them coming to the States. And second of all, since I work for MB, Benz>LGT because they make me my moneys. And the AMG's do a great job of making me moneys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtmenace Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Re92>* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueWhiteBoy Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I don't think the difference in maintenance/modding really makes up for that price difference... Still looks like a lot of fun. I think Car & Driver did an article on a 2008 C63 vs a 2012 Charger SRT8 Edit: Found it, it was a E63 actually http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/2012-dodge-charger-srt8-vs-2008-mercedes-benz-e63-amg-comparison-test The E63 won out. Not that I could afford maintenance or the up front price on either Maybe in a couple years should things go well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC5.2 Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 That's cool and all, but it's no 2.5i. With coilovers, sway bars, and sticky tires, the 2.5i would take that thing in the turns like there is no tomorrow. Plus, the 2.5i is going to be lighter, and it'll be able to be driven in the snow. Even if your buddy got that thing for $80k, then that's almost $65k that I have left over to spend on a used 2.5i. I could probably post about turbocharging it, to get some information on that. Then you'd really be in trouble. [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CL21376 Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I don't think the difference in maintenance/modding really makes up for that price difference... Still looks like a lot of fun. I think Car & Driver did an article on a 2008 C63 vs a 2012 Charger SRT8 Edit: Found it, it was a E63 actually http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/2012-dodge-charger-srt8-vs-2008-mercedes-benz-e63-amg-comparison-test The E63 won out. Not that I could afford maintenance or the up front price on either Maybe in a couple years should things go well. No, the Charger came in first. The 3 top executives at my company all have MB's...E63AMG, SL550, S550. At least once a week one of them has a courtesy car from the local dealer. There have been a couple times all three had loaners at the same time The C63 Black is a bad ass car, no doubt. But I'd be looking at other options due to the lack of a manual transmission. Probably a M6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
executor485 Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 I don't think the difference in maintenance/modding really makes up for that price difference... Still looks like a lot of fun. I think Car & Driver did an article on a 2008 C63 vs a 2012 Charger SRT8 Edit: Found it, it was a E63 actually http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/2012-dodge-charger-srt8-vs-2008-mercedes-benz-e63-amg-comparison-test The E63 won out. Not that I could afford maintenance or the up front price on either Maybe in a couple years should things go well. A major problem in the comparison is that it's going off an E63. 4 doors, larger platform, and not as much carbon fiber. As we all know, carbon fiber is a far superior material, and the more carbon fiber it has, the more rigid the structure. While an E63 is still a formidable car, it's still not a Black Series. That's cool and all, but it's no 2.5i. With coilovers, sway bars, and sticky tires, the 2.5i would take that thing in the turns like there is no tomorrow. Plus, the 2.5i is going to be lighter, and it'll be able to be driven in the snow. Even if your buddy got that thing for $80k, then that's almost $65k that I have left over to spend on a used 2.5i. I could probably post about turbocharging it, to get some information on that. Then you'd really be in trouble. A 2.5i may do ok in the handling department, but that's really only because it couldn't achieve the speeds the Black can. It may turn on a dime, but it doesnt really count if it's going 15mph. After modding a 2.5i, it's probably best to just go straight for an LGT in the first place. But as it's been mentioned, an LGT isnt a great platform to start with. If you were really going to try and compete, it would probably be best to get a new STi and mod from there. You may be able to get away with an older GC8 style and mod it to hell and back, but no matter what you're losing any DD ability to try and keep up with the Black. Also, you're going to be held back by the AWD once you're off the line. As mentioned before, all the Black would need is a set of drag radials and traction isnt a problem for a drag. No, the Charger came in first. The 3 top executives at my company all have MB's...E63AMG, SL550, S550. At least once a week one of them has a courtesy car from the local dealer. There have been a couple times all three had loaners at the same time The C63 Black is a bad ass car, no doubt. But I'd be looking at other options due to the lack of a manual transmission. Probably a M6. The lack of a manual trans is disappointing, but it's also for the best. The way this thing tears through RPM's, I'd much rather let the torque converter do the work. The transmission in this thing is probably the only downside though actually. Stomping on the gas, you've got to click up a gear at 5k, otherwise it will bounce off the rev limiter at 7200 RPM. It doesnt change lightning fast unfortunately, but I'd still say it switches gears faster than a modded 5EAT. If they put in a nice dual clutch system with rev matching, there'd be absolutely nothing wrong with the car, no room for improvement, and no reason for owners to upgrade someday. Similar, but not as bad as Subaru. I mean really, put rear folding seats in the 07's and call that a "massive improvement". It should have had those from the start. At least MB actually gives you something for buying a newer model car. The technology that went into this car is astounding though, even down to a cooling system for the LSD! It's an engineering marvel. If I pass you on the right, I'm flipping you off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC5.2 Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I think your cracked. You can make a 2.5i look way more fly than that mercedes, and the 2.5i will be way better in the snow. [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowImg Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 As someone who races a modified GM6 (your GC8 style), I welcome the Black out to any of my events. I'm quite confident it will not keep up with me, assuming it can even finish without breaking. My only mods are even parts that have fallen off, a motor that was replaced because the old one exploded, some steel wheels/cheap-o tires, and struts/springs from an 04 STI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wpgspecb Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 First off, major props to your buddy for even being able to get one. There's only around 90 of them coming to the States. And second of all, since I work for MB, Benz>LGT because they make me my moneys. And the AMG's do a great job of making me moneys. <---------- i dig your car in your profile ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
executor485 Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 I think your cracked. You can make a 2.5i look way more fly than that mercedes, and the 2.5i will be way better in the snow. Snow tires on the Black = Instant win. As someone who races a modified GM6 (your GC8 style), I welcome the Black out to any of my events. I'm quite confident it will not keep up with me, assuming it can even finish without breaking. My only mods are even parts that have fallen off, a motor that was replaced because the old one exploded, some steel wheels/cheap-o tires, and struts/springs from an 04 STI. Blown motor sounds like a big problem. The Black isnt a typical MB either, they actually did some work to make sure it would finish a race without problems. There is some element of what tracks you're driving on too. From your avatar, I'm seeing an auto-x event in a parking lot. As stated already, it's not as easy to apply all the power to the ground at those low speeds. Sticker rubber will be a big help, but there's a point where you've gotta be slower to be faster and the Subaru is pretty good at being slower If I pass you on the right, I'm flipping you off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
executor485 Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 First off, major props to your buddy for even being able to get one. There's only around 90 of them coming to the States. And second of all, since I work for MB, Benz>LGT because they make me my moneys. And the AMG's do a great job of making me moneys. Get me a hookup for an SL63 Black Series. I'm in need of some V12 bi-turbo action. If I pass you on the right, I'm flipping you off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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