OCDetails Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Honda Integra = Not available from US Honda Dealerships Honda NSX= Not available from US Honda Dealerships Acura EL = Not available in the US Euro Accord= Not available from US Honda Dealerships Honda Legend = Not available from US Honda Dealerships Nissan and Toyota are rebadging their cars and selling them in the US as Infinities and Lexus. That is the point I am making. I'm not saying that its wrong to do that, but the majority of the Acura line is not just rebadged Hondas that you can get down at the Honda dealership for cheaper. I don't need to run by examples of this. You all know which Infinities are just overpriced Nissans and the same for Lexus. _________________________________________ “Cleanliness becomes more important as godliness becomes more unlikely.” O C D E T A I L S . C O M OCDETAILS BLOG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGT Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Honda Integra = Acura RSX Honda NSX = Acura NSX Euro Accord = Acura TSX Honda Legend = Acura RL Honda Civic = Acura EL My point that was that every single Acura listed was/is sold in the US except the EL which was a Canadian model. The corresponding 'Honda' is on the left. What were you saying about Acura NOT rebadging cars? I thought you were an Acura guy OCDetails?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCDetails Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 I didn't say that they didn't rebadge cars. I was just saying that Toyota and Nissan were better examples if you wanted to point out that Americans paid what you asked them to pay. Acuras aren't just rebadged Hondas. They do have models that aren't sold in the US as Hondas. In fact, all of the cars that Acura sells in the US are not available with Honda badging. Anyone with too much money and wants to pay 3 or 4 grand more for a 350Z just so they can get a badge that says G35 can go over to Infinity and get one. That isn't the case with Honda and Acura in the US. I'm not trying to argue. Most car manufacturers rebadges in the US. Its because the government only allows an auto manufacturer to sell a certian number of cars under one company name. You see it all the time with GMC, Dodge/Chrysler, and others. Ion and Cobalt the same car? You don't say... lol Then you have the two identical Neons with different badges? I'll never understand that one... Its because they are trying to get around the rule that they can't sell too many cars. Acura isn't selling cars to get around some law. Their cars are not rebadged Hondas that you will see on the Honda lot across the street. This is why I love Subarus. They are one of the few manufactuers who don't have a luxury division. A subie is a subie no matter where you buy it. I think that is more along the lines of this thread. If they want to put a little more form into their function then they don't have to relase the base model with cloth and low options under one banner and then another one with leather, navi, HID, and a bunch of other stuff under another. If they ever do make a Legacy STi then we at least know it will still be a Subaru and not something else. _________________________________________ “Cleanliness becomes more important as godliness becomes more unlikely.” O C D E T A I L S . C O M OCDETAILS BLOG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nKoan Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 I'm not trying to argue. Most car manufacturers rebadges in the US. Its because the government only allows an auto manufacturer to sell a certian number of cars under one company name. You see it all the time with GMC, Dodge/Chrysler, and others. Ion and Cobalt the same car? You don't say... lol Then you have the two identical Neons with different badges? I'll never understand that one... Its because they are trying to get around the rule that they can't sell too many cars. Acura isn't selling cars to get around some law. Their cars are not rebadged Hondas that you will see on the Honda lot across the street. Never heard of that law before. You have more info on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCDetails Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 I read it in a text book in a business law class in college. I'll see if I can dig it up or find it online and post where you can find it at. _________________________________________ “Cleanliness becomes more important as godliness becomes more unlikely.” O C D E T A I L S . C O M OCDETAILS BLOG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SC GT Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 i can't believe that subaru would drop the 2.5 na .. they sell too many and the emmissions are too clean but then again they are trying to make a radical change in thier markedt "upscale" dealer rumors are totaly worthless That rumor HAS to refer to Suby getting rid of the USDM base LGT. There is NO way Suby would dump half the Legacy line in one year, especially since every US Legacy since 1992 (or thereabouts) has been NA. And despite our collective enthusiasm for turbos, I am pretty sure that Suby sells more NA Legacys than Turbos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunderkind Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 isn't a luxury rebadged Subaru = Saab? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGT Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 I read it in a text book in a business law class in college. I'll see if I can dig it up or find it online and post where you can find it at. Please do. I find that statement suspect, as companies such as Toyota brag about the breadth of their product line. The same cars with different brand names are more about marketing and distribution channels than compliance with a statute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drift Monkey Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Look under the hood of an Acura. "Honda Motor Co." Case closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agctr Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Guys ahhhh STi thread ??????? Acura is to Honda what Lexus is to Toyota.... nough said. Ada///M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rfd425 Posted May 18, 2005 Share Posted May 18, 2005 I think if Subaru introduces a Legacy STI, done right, Audi will have a big problem. Maybe not BMW so much, because they are less of a direct competitor, and they would probably make sure their M3 offering was faster than the Suby, whatever it took. But a $50K, 3800# S4 would seem to me to be a very tough sell, when stacked up against, say, a $35-36K 3400# 300hp Legacy Sti. It should be fairly easy for Subaru to make the LSti faster, and better in every handling category. In fact, knock $10K off the price of the S4, and I'd still take the Subaru. Cachet or no cachet, when the appropriate comparos are done by Road & Track and Car & Driver (some well-placed Subaru marketing dollars probably wouldn't hurt), the LSti would speak for itself. As for Americans not wanting to pay a high price for a Subaru, the same could have been said for Toyota not that long ago (by my standards). But now, $37K loaded Avalons and $55K Land Cruisers are not considered outrageous, to say nothing of the whole Lexus line. The real beauty of the Legacy Sti, from a marketing standpoint, would be that it would raise the profile of the whole Legacy line, and the whole Subaru line, for that matter. The base Legacy, which until '05 was widely seen as a stodgy, quirky AWD Camry alternative, would become the little brother of a world-beating supercar. People could even buy poseur Sti wheels and body kits (and/or performance parts like suspension) to dress up their lesser Legacies. This won't happen overnight, and rightly so, because a model line should be freshened and improved gradually and incrementally. Who knows, maybe I'm full of BS and the whole idea is stupid. But Audi is vulnerable on a lot of fronts, and I'd like to see Subaru's marketing and engineering teams go for the jugular. In the long run it would even make Audi better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwannaSportSedan Posted May 18, 2005 Share Posted May 18, 2005 Amen, rfd425. Spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSiWRX Posted May 18, 2005 Share Posted May 18, 2005 ...A subie is a subie no matter where you buy it. I think that is more along the lines of this thread. If they want to put a little more form into their function then they don't have to relase the base model with cloth and low options under one banner and then another one with leather, navi, HID, and a bunch of other stuff under another.... Saab 9-2x? Sorry, not tryin' to pick a fight with you - heaven knows you've helped me and others more than enough times on detailing/cleaning issues! I just had to get that in, though! -A <-- I love Winky, my "periwinkle" (ABP) LGT! - Allen / Usual Suspect "DumboRAT" / One of the Three Stooges '16 Outback, '16 WRX, 7th Subaru Family Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCDetails Posted May 18, 2005 Share Posted May 18, 2005 That's only because GM owns 20% of Subaru (rather, they own 20% of Fuji Heavy Industries which owns Subaru) as well as Saab. So even though the 9-2x is just a WRX with Saab badging, but I still wouldn't buy it. Its only 20% of a Subaru. Here's an interesting list I found. Its no wonder so many cars on the road look the same these days. Its another reason to drive a Subaru really. We don't have the problem of deciding between all the cars that are essentially the same and trying to pick out what makes them different before we buy one. BMW owns: -BMW -Mini -Rolls Royce Daimler/Chrysler owns: -AMC (brand discontinued) -Chrysler -Dodge -Eagle (brand discontinued) -Hyundai (Daimler/Chrysler only owns 10%) -Jeep -Maybach -Mercedes-Benz -Mitsubishi (Daimler/Chrysler owns 37%) -Plymouth (brand discontinued) -Smart Fiat owns: -Alfa Romeo -Ferrari -Fiat -Lancia -Maserati Ford owns: -Aston Martin -Ford -Jaguar -Land Rover (bought from BMW) -Lincoln -Mazda (Ford owns 33% of Mazda) -Mercury -Volvo cars Fuji Heavy Industries owns: -Subaru General Motors owns: -Buick -Cadillac -Chevrolet -Daewoo (GM owns 44%) -Fiat (GM owns ~20%) -Fuji Heavy Industries (GM owns ~20%) -GMC -Holden -Hummer -Isuzu (GM only owns a percentage) -Oldsmobile (brand discontinued) -Opel -Pontiac -Saab -Saturn -Subaru (GM owns 20%) -Suzuki (GM only owns a small percentage) -Vauxhall Honda owns: -Acura -Honda Hyundai owns: -Hyundai -Kia Nissan owns: -Infiniti -Nissan -Renault (Nissan owns 15%) PSA Peugeot Citroen owns: -Citroen -Peugeot Porsche is an independent company (they do work very closely with VW, however) Renault owns: -Nissan (Renault owns 44%) Toyota owns: -Lexus -Scion -Toyota Volkswagen owns: -Audi -Bentley -Bugatti -Lamborghini -SEAT -Skoda -Volkswagen And for the benefit of the learning impaired, I never said that Honda doesn't make Acura. I drove an Acura for 5 years and I know who makes it. I'm just saying that Acura has more proprietary models available in the US that aren't just rebadged Honda models than some other companies do. When saying that Americans will buy something just because it is expensive and not because it is better, I think Infinity and Lexus are just better examples than Acura. That's all I was saying. _________________________________________ “Cleanliness becomes more important as godliness becomes more unlikely.” O C D E T A I L S . C O M OCDETAILS BLOG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSiWRX Posted May 18, 2005 Share Posted May 18, 2005 OCDetails, LOL, I see what you're saying by "percentage." Good thing I was a mathlete! -A <-- I love Winky, my "periwinkle" (ABP) LGT! - Allen / Usual Suspect "DumboRAT" / One of the Three Stooges '16 Outback, '16 WRX, 7th Subaru Family Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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