dr_sharp Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share Posted October 14, 2010 In defense of the Deka, however, I had a member PM me 2 or 3 months ago stating that they had purchased the EXT14 (11.5lb version) and had had no problems with the battery. They mentioned that www.batterymart.com had the best prices for Deka batteries. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClimberDHexMods Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 In defense of the Deka, however, I had a member PM me 2 or 3 months ago stating that they had purchased the EXT14 (11.5lb version) and had had no problems with the battery. They mentioned that www.batterymart.com had the best prices for Deka batteries. I've compared the Braille and Deka catalog side-by-side and most of it was identical. You could tell me Deka doesn't make braille batteries, but you would be wrong about one thing. However, neither Braille or its fans will ever admit this. [CENTER][B][I] Front Limited Slip Racing Differentials for the 5EAT now available for $1895 shipped, please inquire for details! [/I][/B][/CENTER] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share Posted October 14, 2010 I've compared the Braille and Deka catalog side-by-side and most of it was identical. You could tell me Deka doesn't make braille batteries, but you would be wrong about one thing. However, neither Braille or its fans will ever admit this. Do you know where to find more tech specs on the Deka battery? I'd be interested to know the pulse cranking amps and cranking amps on it. The tech specs that I pulled directly from both companies' websites show that they do not have the same battery internals. That doesn't mean that Deka doesn't make the Braille batteries, but the Deka and Braille versions are not the same. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClimberDHexMods Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 I found them when reading AnorexicSTi's weight reduction thread. Similar debate. My take-away was that for the 5lb, 10lb, 15lb, brackets, there was one identical offering from each of a dozen companies, all made by Deka. If Braille has other batteries that use more advanced technology, that is beyond me. I think there was speculation as to the truth about Braille's numbers as well, but don't know enough to comment. But the aftermarket is known for making claims under the most realistic of environments [CENTER][B][I] Front Limited Slip Racing Differentials for the 5EAT now available for $1895 shipped, please inquire for details! [/I][/B][/CENTER] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted December 28, 2010 Author Share Posted December 28, 2010 I just ordered the Braille B2015 15lb battery. There were a couple of members that installed this battery several years ago and they have reported no problems with it and are still rocking it. Total price was $183 after shipping - only about $75 more than an oem replacement. I think installation is going to be pretty simple... 1 small modification to the stock battery tie-down is all that I see necessary. Pictures and weight of stock battery to follow. I've read stock battery is 32 lbs but I will confirm. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClimberDHexMods Posted December 29, 2010 Share Posted December 29, 2010 I recently installed a Deka ETX12. Weighs 10 lbs. Cranks the engine no problem in 40* weather. I bought some short dowel things from Lowes to make the now super long battery tie-down rods reach. Had to order AGM terminal posts that screw into the battery, got those on eBay. I think I'm $90 into it, but the battery was only $60. Shipping and the terminals really ate into my wallet. But not quite what what you paid That braille looks identical to my Deka, but bigger, and says Braille. [CENTER][B][I] Front Limited Slip Racing Differentials for the 5EAT now available for $1895 shipped, please inquire for details! [/I][/B][/CENTER] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted December 29, 2010 Author Share Posted December 29, 2010 Nice... I hope it lasts for you. Keep us posted, if the Dekas can last for the long haul, there's no reason to spend the money on a Braille. My plan is to turn the stock tie-down up-side down and reuse the stock tie-down rods. I believe the Braille comes with the terminal posts, but if not, I'll visit autozone. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClimberDHexMods Posted December 29, 2010 Share Posted December 29, 2010 Nice... I hope it lasts for you. Keep us posted, if the Dekas can last for the long haul, there's no reason to spend the money on a Braille. My plan is to turn the stock tie-down up-side down and reuse the stock tie-down rods. I believe the Braille comes with the terminal posts, but if not, I'll visit autozone. Autozone has posts with male threads, but they are not the proper size, and are useless on these. A 10lb Deka will not be as dependable as a 15lb Deka. So I'll take what I get for service life. If it's too short of a life, then I might get an ETX14 next time. I've been looking at those small solar panels that trickle charge car batteries. Not sure if they put out 14V or 12V, and they don't say. Hopefully 14V, but I don't want to pay to test it out. [CENTER][B][I] Front Limited Slip Racing Differentials for the 5EAT now available for $1895 shipped, please inquire for details! [/I][/B][/CENTER] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted January 4, 2011 Author Share Posted January 4, 2011 The battery came with the posts and correct screws. I turned the stock tie-down upside down and it worked just fine. The only tricky part was getting the wiring free from the OEM posts due to heavy corrosion. Pictures to follow this evening. OEM Battery = 37.5 lbs!!! 37.3 - 15 = 22.5 lbs lighter! Now... I've inherited some Cusco strut braces... hopefully I will net a loss of weight taking the battery into consideration as well. [edit] Looks like I got a bit more than I bargained for. 732 Measured CA, vs. the 574 CA advertised... lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Th3Franz Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 I installed a DEKA ETX18L on mine. Since it gets really cold here, I needed the extra CCA, but at least it's still a nice weight savings. I got a Braille mount for cheap off Summit, and I'm going to be putting down some non-slip material to ensure the battery can't slide around. The terminals are not flimsy at all. In that picture, there are caps over the terminals, and the battery comes with ATV posts. I had to get some brass SAE terminals but they are working out great. Also, DEKA makes the batteries for Braille. Braille slaps on a sticker or a fancier body and charges twice as much. I bought mine locally from Batteries Plus, since it comes with a warranty and the price was reasonable. If I ever have a problem, I can take it to a local store and get it exchanged. -Franz The end of a Legacy http://www.youtube.com/th3franz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted January 5, 2011 Author Share Posted January 5, 2011 I have a tough time believing that the battery was manufactured on 12/28/10 by Deka in PA, shipped to Braille in FL the same day, tested by Braille the same day, and shipped to me on 12/29/10. Either Braille is lying about the manufacture date or you guys are wrong? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClimberDHexMods Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I have a tough time believing that the battery was manufactured on 12/28/10 by Deka in PA, shipped to Braille in FL the same day, tested by Braille the same day, and shipped to me on 12/29/10. Either Braille is lying about the manufacture date or you guys are wrong? I want to create HellaFlush Battery Co. So I call Deka. I pay them to manufacture batteries for me, then brand it as HF. I hire a drop shipper or order fulfillment company. Perhaps Deka can handle some distribution itself, but definitely not entirely, since outside dedicated distribution channels are more efficient for most companies than insourcing. Deka will already have this service in place, most likely. They make batteries for a LOT of brands. I hire a marketing firm, which coordinates everything from simple advertising and promotion, to finding vendors. This firm has the simple task of making HF appear to be the best battery out there, either through targeting an ignored niche (people with 19" wheels on a family sedan, who need a lighter battery to be more flush). I get lines of credit for all if this. Then I hire a PR company to come up with demostrations and events, designed to show how superior my product is. Marketing and PR will coordinate the details. I, Mr. HF, do nothing, except make phone calls, and make high level strategic decisions. I feel like I just read aloud a corny childrens book. I know of few managers who would be so inept as to ship a heavy object ANYWHERE with more than one touch (once: distributor to customer or local store). Deka manufactures batteries for Braille. Braille spends a lot of money distancing themselves from this relationship. For very obvious reasons. [CENTER][B][I] Front Limited Slip Racing Differentials for the 5EAT now available for $1895 shipped, please inquire for details! [/I][/B][/CENTER] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClimberDHexMods Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 My Braille ETX12 already kicked the bucket. I have something drawing too much current overnight. Time to whip out the multimeter and pull fuses. [CENTER][B][I] Front Limited Slip Racing Differentials for the 5EAT now available for $1895 shipped, please inquire for details! [/I][/B][/CENTER] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted January 8, 2011 Author Share Posted January 8, 2011 You mean your Deka ETX12... still no conslusive evidence related the two companies lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Th3Franz Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Braille most likely puts the manufacturing date as the date they slap on their sticker and test it. The date they "manufacture" it. Put a DEKA and Braille battery of the same type side by side.. they are identical. -Franz The end of a Legacy http://www.youtube.com/th3franz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted January 8, 2011 Author Share Posted January 8, 2011 Not according to the specs from each manufacturers website. The Braille technical specs are superior to the Deka tech specs. I agree that they do look like the same package; they likely just source their casing from the same company. The casing is where the similarities end. Deka: http://www.dekabatteries.com/assets/base/0278(6.10).pdf Weight: 17lbs (looks basically identical to the Braille battery below) 325 Cold Cranking Amps 19 A-hr @ 10hr This is all of the tech specs that are listed, which is generally not a good sign. Note the flimsy terminals Braille: http://www.braillebattery.com/index.php/batteries/b2317/# 17 lbs 475 Cold cranking amps 641 Cranking amps 1191 Pulse cranking amps 23 A-hr @ 20 hr Note the solid terminals lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Th3Franz Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Manufacturers can inflate or underrate the specs for a product. The best way would be to buy one of each, put them on a bench, and test and measure them. Someone on a different forum tested a DEKA battery and it was closer to the Braille in output. Depth of discharge, age, etc can affect the readings a bit too. http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?2353060 -Franz The end of a Legacy http://www.youtube.com/th3franz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted January 9, 2011 Author Share Posted January 9, 2011 Cold cranking amps should be measured in 0F environment and should actually be a measure of amperage, not some calculated number a DMM or battery meter will output. Besides, he said, "the Deka tests the same as what the Braille is claimed to test at - 360-400CCA- fact" The Braille battery I recieved tested more than 25% higher than its rating. I know I sound like a Braille fanboy right now but all I'm trying to say is that there is absolutely nothing conclusive that the Braille and Deka versions are the same. In fact, most of the evidence here points to the notion that they do not share the same internals. On paper, the Braille is rated higher - shown from each companies respective websites. Braille tests higher than advertised - as shown in this thread. Deka tests the same as the Braille's advertised rating - as shown in your link. In the end, it doesn't matter if they're the same. The real question is: will the cheaper option work as an OEM replacement and last for an extended period of time? Several members have had their Braille last for several YEARS with no problems. ClimberD just reported a dead Deka battery after how much use? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted January 9, 2011 Author Share Posted January 9, 2011 From your link, Franz: "MY Deka had a short life. I got a year (maybe) out of it. The low CCA and improper charge rate of our alternators just killed it. It was no longer worth the hassle of jumping it constantly. It was installed in a track car that I loce to daily drive. So it got consistent use, but not excessive." "The BIG-ETX14 battery is rated at 200 CCA's. In automotive applications, your asking the battery to do a lot more than it was designed to do. Manufactures of most automotive batteries recommend using a battery with a CCA of at least 100 CCA's over the designed requirement. The battery may work ok during the warmer months, but may not work well in colder winter months in automotive applications. Will it work for short term use, probably. The battery may not last 12 months under automotive CCA loads, especially in colder weather. It really depends on how often and how heavy the load you put on the battery, temperature, and how you maintain the battery between uses. Heat will also affect the design life. Deka batteries are high grade built batteries but each battery is limited to the application for which the battery was designed, which in this case, smaller engine applications such as ATV and Motorcycles. Also, most alternators put out 14.2 amps which is way higher than is recommended for the ETX14 battery. Recommended recharge amps should not exceed 7 amps. Exceeding the recommended charging amps on a regular basis will harm the battery." "You see how the Braille battery has battery posts and the Deka battery doesn't come with them?" "It looks like my second ETX20L just died. Just for reference, what I purchased is branded as an "Extreme MagnaPower." The first battery lasted maybe 2 months. This one lasted just under 12 months. For reference, the car is usually driven on weekends." "My etx14 doesn't like trying to start in the cold though." "wow i forgot about this trehad, my car loved the battery i ended up using, the battery didnt love cold weather. it compleatly died over the winter and dosnt hold a charge at all." This guy got his to work for 2 full years, after he spent an additional $100 on a holder: "i've been running my Deka 11.5lb battery from MMP with battery case for 2 years now with NO issues whatsoever. Thing works great and the quality of the battery holder is well worth it. I can't believe some of you bawk at $100 aluminum battery holder that is built to spec?" lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted January 9, 2011 Author Share Posted January 9, 2011 On a side note, the Braille specs state "Ratings based on conductance testing" which means that Braille's numbers may be slightly inflated. Either way, the test was higher than the rating, both of which use the conductance test method. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Th3Franz Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 AGM batteries are much more touchy about deep cycling. If people don't know how to maintain the battery, they should not expect it to last nearly as long. Same goes for getting a battery that is too weak for the application. 200CCA is a joke for the weather here where it gets well below freezing temps. For a car that isn't driven often, a trickle charge should be left on it. You can tell by those posts that many of the failures are from people not properly caring for their battery. Regarding your question if it will last as long as OEM.. the same question can be asked for ANY lightweight battery. Properly cared for and properly sized for the application, I would say yes. I'm hoping to prove just that -Franz The end of a Legacy http://www.youtube.com/th3franz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted January 12, 2011 Author Share Posted January 12, 2011 AGM batteries are much more touchy about deep cycling. If people don't know how to maintain the battery, they should not expect it to last nearly as long. Same goes for getting a battery that is too weak for the application. 200CCA is a joke for the weather here where it gets well below freezing temps. For a car that isn't driven often, a trickle charge should be left on it. You can tell by those posts that many of the failures are from people not properly caring for their battery. Regarding your question if it will last as long as OEM.. the same question can be asked for ANY lightweight battery. Properly cared for and properly sized for the application, I would say yes. I'm hoping to prove just that Franz, while I agree about the life of the battery, there are SO many people stating that they don't have good results. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClimberDHexMods Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Franz, while I agree about the life of the battery, there are SO many people stating that they don't have good results. There are SO many folks claiming they do have good results too. There are SO many folks who drive their car to the corner store and back, 5 minutes each way, then blame the battery. There are SO many folks who believe Church and State should not be separated, praise Jesus. I don't mean to prove you wrong, as I have provided no statistical evidence to the contrary. But then neither has anyone. [CENTER][B][I] Front Limited Slip Racing Differentials for the 5EAT now available for $1895 shipped, please inquire for details! [/I][/B][/CENTER] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_sharp Posted January 27, 2011 Author Share Posted January 27, 2011 I had a dream that my battery died already? lol. After intalling my intercooler and intake, I had some leaks that threw off the MAF sensor. That resulted in stumbling idle, etc... but my point is that I tried to start the car and it cranked for 5-10 seconds before I stopped. This happened 2 or 3 times before all leaks were fixed, no issues from the battery. Added some weights for intake lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SATSFYD Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Taking notes... **There are two types of people in the world, those who build horsepower and those who buy it. Which one are you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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