lawl Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 is it just me or are a lot of 07/08'ers experiencing a lot of trouble getting power out of their setups? car for sale. PM me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenc544 Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 Those AFR's do look a bit lean. I've extensively tuned my AFR's using the same fuel and run ~11.1:1. Mac Autosports' sniffer has read lean every time I had been there. We did a couple of Z car dyno days there and the AFR were all low 12's to 11's for most people. It was reading 12's for this car that was running way rich and bellowing black smoke out of the back... Anyway, unless they fix the sniffer I wouldn't put much stock in their AFR number. Mac has always used too much SAE correction. 1.28 would be high for a NA car and it will give you a reading way too high for a FI car at 5300'. Like other says, you should log your car and get more data. Your log should help shed some light on what's going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collegemt Posted June 5, 2008 Author Share Posted June 5, 2008 Logs are now attachted to the first post. Also I did time calculations and the car is now slower than my stage 2 setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infamous1 Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 Your boost is all over the place, doesn't look like a pill problem. This is a tuning problem. You have way too many incorrect parameters logged so it is difficult to read. However the boost is not setup correctly and no pill will help if the know how is not there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyd2005 Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 Stage 2 times: 50-80: 4.2 60-80: 2.9 vf40 18g times: 50-80: 4.6 60-80: 3.165 It doesn't matter what the dyno says. The above says everything you need to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolutions Performance Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 Uncorrected Numbers on Mac's dyno are typically the same as our CORRECTED numbers. So your car is making roughly what a Stage 2 LGT will make on my dyno. Those AFR's aren't too lean. I typically target about 11.5:1 and haven't had any problems doing so. Adam & Matt Revolutions Performance 417 E. Vermijo Colorado Springs, CO 80903 Store | Contact Info | Website Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legend Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 What parameter should he be using to detect knock? I am not familiar with the limited '08 parameters, but the knock signal could be zero and he could still be knocking if the signal isn't flagged at the exact instant the logger is fed a stream of data. Do 08's also pull 2 degrees after a knock event? I see several 2-degree decrements but cannot conclude it's knock, especially since it seems to follow the timing curve.... Slower?! Geez. That's not good. I'm sure Revolutions or Super could do better! My '05 LGT My '07 Supercharged Shelby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boostsr20 Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 I'm not sure if its worth me posting or not since our altitudes are so far off but I have Some vf4018G logs I can post if you want. Timing should be comparable and you could put a conversion on the boost/maf readings to lower them to yours if you know the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squishyface Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 take it to the track and find out where you are at +1 MBC to clean up that boost issue....some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collegemt Posted June 5, 2008 Author Share Posted June 5, 2008 Your boost is all over the place, doesn't look like a pill problem. This is a tuning problem. You have way too many incorrect parameters logged so it is difficult to read. However the boost is not setup correctly and no pill will help if the know how is not there. I don't exactly see how my boost is all over the place, it looks like it increases with engine speed and then tapers. If you could explain it to me that would help. I am going back to the tuner tomorrow morning, what should I tell him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infamous1 Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 I don't exactly see how my boost is all over the place, it looks like it increases with engine speed and then tapers. If you could explain it to me that would help. I am going back to the tuner tomorrow morning, what should I tell him? Sorry, it is not all over the place but it doesn't look great. I don't have access to my graphing programs right now to show you the curve. However it is ramping up very show, this is the reason you are down so much torque vs HP. At 3300rpms you should already be at or approaching full boost, however you are at just 14.9 psi. You slowly roll up to max boost at 4300rpms of 17.2 then fall back down but then climb again at 5400rpms. Definately stay away from the MBC, not needed. The WGDC need some smoothing out. Your boost target from about 3k to about maybe 6k should be 17.2psi as the turbo seems to able to handle it with ease judging by the LOW WGDC's up top. This is all if your IDC's are low enough to do so. At that point I would start to taper boost. Right now your boost plot looks like a roller coaster, it should ramp up quick, Plateau then taper down. The point when the taper begins depends on if there is enough fueling there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collegemt Posted June 5, 2008 Author Share Posted June 5, 2008 What is the MBC? Basically I need to tell my tuner to adjust the boost tragets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infamous1 Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 What is the MBC? Basically I need to tell my tuner to adjust the boost tragets? Manual Boost Controler Boost is much easier to setup using one, however eliminates the failsafe to drop boost in the event of a problem. Boost targets may be fine, however the boost control isn't. If I were tuning it, I would drop AFR down to 11:1 and set peak boost to 17psi. Make sure boost ramps up quickly then taper off accordingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boostsr20 Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 On my vf4018g (5eat) I had 17psii by 3400rpms and max boost of 18 by 3600 but I'm at much lower elevation. Doesn't seem that its too far off, may just be a downside to the hybrid mismatched wheels. Also seems that Deadbolts 15psi wastegate has quite a bit of adjustment to it. My boost targets were achieved with less than 10% WGDC. Maybe have them try to tighten up the arm a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collegemt Posted June 6, 2008 Author Share Posted June 6, 2008 On my vf4018g (5eat) I had 17psii by 3400rpms and max boost of 18 by 3600 but I'm at much lower elevation. Doesn't seem that its too far off, may just be a downside to the hybrid mismatched wheels. Also seems that Deadbolts 15psi wastegate has quite a bit of adjustment to it. My boost targets were achieved with less than 10% WGDC. Maybe have them try to tighten up the arm a little. I didn't even know they were adjustable, maybe i will tell them about that. I am feeling less confident about them being able to tune it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VTGT Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 I didn't even know they were adjustable, maybe i will tell them about that. I am feeling less confident about them being able to tune it right. Take it to revolutions then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infamous1 Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 On my vf4018g (5eat) I had 17psii by 3400rpms and max boost of 18 by 3600 but I'm at much lower elevation. Doesn't seem that its too far off, may just be a downside to the hybrid mismatched wheels. Remember you also have a 5eat which builds boost slower as well..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collegemt Posted June 6, 2008 Author Share Posted June 6, 2008 Take it to revolutions then. I might have to, but then I will have to pay for a tune all over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boostsr20 Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 Remember you also have a 5eat which builds boost slower as well..... Thank god for TQ converters Your tune isn't bad, just needs a little fine tuning done to dial it in. Its definately a good safe tune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyd2005 Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 There's nothing wrong with your boost. Boost is not your problem. Lack of airflow is the problem. This is a comparison of your datalogs. Notice that even when boost is higher with the VF40-18G, most of the time, you are still flowing more air with your previous turbo/tune. I think the AVCS is overly advanced. Can you log VVT-I? Or AVCS? http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r69/mickeyd2005/collegemt.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infamous1 Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 I disagree, the boost still could be dialed in alot better and come on quicker. The boost target itself is fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collegemt Posted June 6, 2008 Author Share Posted June 6, 2008 There's nothing wrong with your boost. Boost is not your problem. Lack of airflow is the problem. This is a comparison of your datalogs. Notice that even when boost is higher with the VF40-18G, most of the time, you are still flowing more air with your previous turbo/tune. I think the AVCS is overly advanced. Can you log VVT-I? Or AVCS? http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r69/mickeyd2005/collegemt.jpg What is AVCS? Could this be due to a boost leak somewhere? I wouldn't think so since I am holding boost preety well. Like I said I am heading back to the tuner tomorrow morning, and I will ask him about AVCS being overly advanced. The tuner seems to think that a different pill size will increase my boost in the lower RPM's. I sure hope so. My plan for now is to give MAC a second chance tomorrow. If they can't get it right I will be heading to Revolutions. If that doesn't work I am going to put the stock turbo back in (pain in the a$$) and go back to my TDC stage 2 tune. This last route would really suck since it hasn't been cheap to do all of this work and get no results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard B. Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 Remember you also have a 5eat which builds boost slower as well..... uhhh...roll a manual out from a stop light at 700 rpms. it's not the tranny. i can do a 1500 rpm roll and you would never know i had "lag". "launching" at 3k isn't necessary. not to mention my car doesn't jerk when shifting.. it's smooth and boost doesn't drop like a manual. i will put money down and say that IF the auto had the EXACT same gear ratio as the manual there would be no difference in acceleration. but hey. at 80 my rpms are 2800. give and take my man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyd2005 Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 I disagree, the boost still could be dialed in alot better and come on quicker. The boost target itself is fine. Just because the boost is not dialed in perfectly is not his problem. I've tuned a VF40-18G at sealevel and I know what it can do and can't do. I would not tune the turbo that way but that's not the problem. Everyone was talking about tightening the wg arm and increasing boost. That's not going to solve the problem of low acceleration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infamous1 Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 uhhh...roll a manual out from a stop light at 700 rpms. it's not the tranny. i can do a 1500 rpm roll and you would never know i had "lag". "launching" at 3k isn't necessary. not to mention my car doesn't jerk when shifting.. it's smooth and boost doesn't drop like a manual. i will put money down and say that IF the auto had the EXACT same gear ratio as the manual there would be no difference in acceleration. but hey. at 80 my rpms are 2800. give and take my man. Tune an auto vs a manual then come back and talk to me..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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